So firstly, the reason I don’t know is because I’m homeschooled and teaching myself. And am using Wheelock’s.
But I’m curious to know roughly what you would learn if you were taking a latin course at a public/private highschool. What would you go over in the first and second years?
Would working through Wheelock’s constitute one or two years of latin?
Thanks for any info. 
I don’t think people learn anything in high school latin. I’ve only taken it in college, and usually when people come in from high school they are horrible.
It’s hard to know for sure, and of course different schools would cover different amounts. Wheelock’s was designed for a 1 year college course, but looking at different course offerings, it seems the vast majority of them that I’ve seen get through to about chapter 30 (of 40) in one year. Assuming a high school would take it a little more slowly (though it may not) it wouldn’t be unreasonable to think that all of Wheelock would be about two years of formal high school, but that’s just a wild guess.
You learn only the rudiments after one year of HS Latin. After two years, you should have basic Latin covered. After three years, you should be translating real texts unadultered. After four years, you should be pretty damn good at Latin.
After one year of Latin in college, you should have all the basics covered. After two years, you should be translating real texts unadultered. After three years, you should be pretty damn good at Latin. After four years, go look for a job teaching HS.
Good. More people need to do both. I think of home schooling as a kind of intellectual self-defense. I wish I could have done it.
But I’m curious to know roughly what you would learn if you were taking a latin course at a public/private highschool. What would you go over in the first and second years?
In the traditional American high school, basic grammar and vocabulary, including common uses of the subjunctive in the first year, reading the first four books of Caesar’s Gallic War in the second year. Six of Cicero’s orations in the third year, and the first half of Virgil’s Aeneid in the fourth.
In the modern high school, not a whole lot. I was commiserating with a Latin teacher recently who told me that the Cambridge Latin course doesn’t cover the subjunctive until book 3 (out of 4), presumably sometime in second year college.
Would working through Wheelock’s constitute one or two years of latin?
Wheelock wrote his book because by the mid 20th century it was no longer common to begin Latin in high school. It is a college text for the first year. Supposedly one year of a college language course is equivalent to two of high school, and Wheelock says that after his text you can skip Caesar and begin reading Cicero. I haven’t verified that claim, but I feel doubtful. Also, Wheelock’s text, unlike the traditional high school course, is focused on developing the ability to read Latin, which is primarily what modern students want to do. The traditional course had a strong emphasis on writing as well, which developed superior fluency in Latin.
Kerastes
See, I don’t understand this. Several of my classmates who took Latin for 4 years in high school aren’t very good at the college level: they’re C students. Maybe the public education here sucks.
Either the education there sucks, or the students are just lazy. Take your pick.
I know that in the UK students complete the CLC within a minimum of 3 years, and sometimes take 5. But they do read about 300 lines of verse, when I say read they can’t really they just learn translations like robots! salvebunto! Then they take another 2 years to get ‘pretty damn good’ at Latin but no one comes close, except perhaps a select few…I am trying to think now whether your beloved ~D, cweb255, has been learning since the age of 11 or 13. Whichever side of the sea however it seems too little is learned in a year. The story of modern education! Ach! How I long for the good times I never experienced: the canes and all day LATIN GREEK LATIN GREEK HARVNDINIS CVLTVS LATIN GREEK LATIN GREEK periods where the boys wear tights, girls from the girls grammar school nearby are but a distant dream like nymphs skipping over our streams, only rich and clever people get in, the grass worauf wir Kroquet spielen is green, we don’t learn German because no one likes them, the sparse mathematics lessons would require application, we go to the sweet shop buy half a pound of dolly mixtures the most english sweetie bump in to the elusive females who sport posh english skirts and strumpbyxor but the little lads sucking on a rhubarb and custard boiled sweetie are so inept and insolent unaccustomed to these creatures that they perhaps might vaunt themselves by kicking a football really close to a nice lass but then, on seeing her scarcely impressed, pull back his feet to the classroom, so timid to the strawberry and vanilla feminine scent, and read, with little help, select orations of Cicero with D’Ooge as the teacher!
“Tea and crumpets for elevenses laddies!” says Dr Benjamin “Orationibus traductis!” Ah! The joy of a truly pristine British education!
~E
Thanks for all the replies!
And yes, homeschooling is the best. I’ve been very fortunate in being homeschooled since 1st grade. It’s really helped me to develop into a much better person than I probably would be otherwise.
One more question- does Wheelock’s cover all of basic grammer? After I finish Wheelock’s, do I go on to another grammer book or will I be starting to just read latin literature?
Thanks again,
Fabiola
It doesn’t cover all of basic grammar (far from it, look at how few subjunctive uses for example) but you start reading literature anyway, the idea being that it covers enough to get you started.
After Wheelock’s, you may want to consult Moreland & Fleischer’s Intensive Latin. Though not a very good book for self-learners, it does include most of the grammar you’ll need for classical Latin. It also will serve as a good review and contains useful, if dull and contrived, exercises.
Definitely try to find an edition of some text you’re interested in reading that has good, thorough notes. For instance, I found a version of Virgil’s Aeneid Book I intended for someone with only a year or two of Latin. It also contained a complete vocabulary in the book. A resource like this will guide you gently (relatively speaking) into the conventions and subtleties of genuine Latin. Not having such a generous, thoughtful guide - as I found when I tried my hand at some Tacitus this last fall - can be endlessly frustrating.
In the meantime, there are a few texts you can be working with. Try D’Ooge’s story about Publius. Once you’ve learned the forms, it shouldn’t be much trouble, and it’s a great vocab builder. How about Lingua Latina? Continuous reading. Only toward the end of the first book - and throughout the second - will you have much difficulty. That’s another great way to augment your vocabulary.
Finally, may I introduce you (if you haven’t already met it) to Fabulae Faciles (Hercules Chapter 01 Notes and Vocabulary with Text). I’ve included the link to the first chapter from a graded reader on Hercules, but you can easily go back to Perseus if you find the Hercules too challenging, or move forward to the Argonauts or Odysseus. Though these are not the most eloquent pieces in the world, they do introduce Latin idioms that will be useful to you in the future - and, most important, from my point of view, they make you familiar with the basic Latin vocabulary you will need in all of your reading. Download Whitaker’s Words if you haven’t already and use this as you read. (Also convenient are the notes included beneath each selection - these point out unusual forms, irregular verbs, and other interesting tidbits.) The disadvantage of these tales is the absence of the subjunctive, at least from Hercules. Still, I learned a lot from them.
Regards, and best luck,
David
The Fabulae Faciles link didn’t seem to work for me just now, but I’m guess this is what you mean: Ritchie’s Fabulae Faciles – Greek and Latin Texts with Facing Vocabulary and Commentary ?
As a Latin teacher who has taught all levels using both Wheelock, Orberg’s Lingua Latina, and a number of other curriculums, the major issue that Wheelock will ALWAYS have is vocabulary. In a given chapter, you might see a vocabulary word once, maybe twice, throughout the sentences and passages. Because vocabulary acquisition is so, SO important, this is a major weakness in my opinion.
So I agree with this; Orberg is a great way to beef up your Latin vocabulary because it repeats them and forces you to infer meaning. In that it’s very helpful. Not terribly illuminating grammatically as a self-taught book (for something like that, definitely would recommend the accompanying reference text) but great for Vocab Ac.
I also agree with bellum_paxque: Ritchie’s Fabulae are GOLD for the intermediate student who has just finished Wheelock. It’s a great opportunity to practice both vocabulary as well as more “real” Latin grammar. It’s a good stepping stone from grammar primer to authentic Latin. I certainly wouldn’t recommend a student go from Wheelock to Vergil without a guide of some kind, whether a good teacher or a VERY good edition with lots of helpful notes.
This thread is 20 years old and the Internet has changed in the mean time. Nevertheless, I fixed the broken link.