Unit 25, Part II, Exercise 3

Greek Learning Greek
1

Χαίρετε!

Unless I quote from a different textbook, would it be OK if I just wrote Unit 25, Part II, Exercise 3 without the author and title of the textbook? I have already asked a ton of questions in this forum, and posters that have been around a bit know which textbook I am using.

Either way, I am supposed to write, “We seem to ourselves to be so virtuous that no one surpasses us.” I had some trouble with word position. I wrote, “οὔτως ἠμῖν αὐτοῖς εἶναι δοκοῦμεν ὤστε ἀγαθοὶ οὐδὲνα ἠμῶν διαφέρειν.”

The answer book wrote, οὔτως ἀγαθοὶ ἠμῖν αὐτοῖς εἶναι δοκοῦμεν ὤστε οὐδὲνα ἠμῶν διαφέρειν."

I am not understanding the position of ἀγαθοὶ. Since it is in the so . . . that construction, I thought it would be placed after ὤστε, yet the answer book places it in the main clause. Does Greek place what comes right after the “so” in the main clause?

2

It might be helpful for future searches if your post included “Mastronarde” but the title of the book and Dr are unnecessary.

You are getting excellent input from two very accomplished professionals so I hesitate to answer your question. But it seems to me that you haven’t quite grasped the “οὔτως …ὤστε” construction.

Look on page 211 at the example:

οὕτως ἄφρονές ἐστε ὥστε ῥᾳδίως ἀδικεῖσθαι ὑπὸ πάντων.

You are so foolish that you are easily wronged by everyone.

Do you see that οὕτως is the “so” and that “ὥστε” is that.

its best to think of this in two clauses

So in your example

"We seem to ourselves to be so virtuous

that no one surpasses us."

οὔτως ἀγαθοὶ ἡμῖν αὐτοῖς δοκοῦμεν εἶναι

ὤστε οὐδὲνα ἡμῶν διαφέρειν.

I think there was a typo - corrected in bold

οὕτω(ς) (13), in this manner, thus, so
ὥστε (25), so that, so as, that (result)


Does that make it in any clearer?

3

Ah, I did not see that οὕτως was the so. I thought ὥστε was the so that. Now I see.

4

Yes it is.

But in “ You are so foolish that you are easily wronged by everyone.” that means “so that” or “with the result that”.

Likewise in “We seem to ourselves to be so virtuous that no one surpasses us.”

When you see in a sentence “so … that” you have to recognise that these words introduce two separate clauses it does not mean “so that“ ie ὥστε.