Cyro. 7.5.80

Hi everyone
So having finally defeated his enemies and establishing his new kingdom Cyrus is explaining to his friends and generals the benefit of continuing to adhere to the virtues of austerity and moderation that not only were required to achieve their goal but also, now more than ever, required to maintain their hold on power.

The part I’m slightly struggling with follows ἄνευ

εἰ δέ τις τοιαῦτα ἐννοεῖται, τί δῆτα ἡμῖν ὄφελος καταπρᾶξαι ἃ ἐπεθυμοῦμεν, εἰ ἔτι δεήσει καρτερεῖν καὶ πεινῶντας καὶ διψῶντας καὶ πονοῦντας καὶ ἐπιμελουμένους, ἐκεῖνο δεῖ καταμαθεῖν ὅτι τοσούτῳ τἀγαθὰ μᾶλλον εὐφραίνει ὅσῳ ἂν μᾶλλον προπονήσας τις ἐπ᾽ αὐτὰ ἴῃ: οἱ γὰρ πόνοι ὄψον τοῖς ἀγαθοῖς: ἄνευ δὲ τοῦ δεόμενον τυγχάνειν τινὸς οὐδὲν οὕτω πολυτελῶς παρασκευασθείη ἂν ὥσθ᾽ ἡδὺ εἶναι.

Is οὐδὲν in apposition to ἄνευ δὲ τοῦ δεόμενον τυγχάνειν τινὸς ?
Is δεόμενον a subject of τυγχάνειν and conditional in sense?

So something like, in very clunky English
(being) far from the obtaining the thing, if one requires it, nothing (else) could be so valuable to prepare so as to (allow) pleasure to exist.

i.e. a prerequisite for any pleasure to exist is that you previously were lacking it

Hi again Neil,
You’re close.

As you recognize, ουδεν is the subject: “nothing could be so lavishly prepared as to be sweet,” i.e. nothing would be sweet however lavishly it was prepared.

ἄνευ τοῦ δεόμενον τυγχάνειν τινός “without getting something when you need it.” δεόμενον is not conditional but circumstantial, and vital to the sense. Just getting something is not enough, what counts is getting it when you’re in need of it—as often in Greek, the participle carries the weight. The ανευ phrase itself is effectively conditional; it could have been ει μή τις δεόμενος τυγχάνοι τινός.

Brilliant, thanks very much, that’s a lot clearer now.