Mary Renault's Historical Fiction
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Mary Renault's Historical Fiction
I keep seeing those Mary Renault Greek novels around and mentally earmarking them for a time when I can finally have a holiday outside my own house. Have you read any of the others that you'd recommend?
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Re: Mary Renault's Historical Fiction
Sure, could be a thread on its own I guess [and so I have split it], and my opinion is obviously idiomatic but I would say.
Then there is the Theseus series:
Her Alexander the Great series:
- The mask of Apollo
- The Praise Singer
- The Last of the Wine
Then there is the Theseus series:
- The King Must Die
- The Bull from the Sea
Her Alexander the Great series:
- Fire from Heaven
- The Persian Boy
- Funeral Games
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Re: Mary Renault's Historical Fiction
And in fact, my grandmother recommended them many years ago to me.
“One might get one’s Greek from the very lips of Homer and Plato." "In which case they would certainly plough you for the Little-go. The German scholars have improved Greek so much.”
Joel Eidsath -- jeidsath@gmail.com
Joel Eidsath -- jeidsath@gmail.com
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Re: Mary Renault's Historical Fiction
Thanks, that's really helpful for plotting a path through them. I've had a copy of Madeline Miller's Song of Achilles sitting on my bookshelf looking unloved for a few years too, so I'll have to make a project of it. The only one of these modern reimaginings of Greek stuff I've managed to read was Valerio Manfredi's Il Mio Nome È Nessuno (i.e. οὖτις ἐμοί γ᾽ ὄνομα) - I won't be reading it again in this life (nor, deo volente, the next).
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Re: Mary Renault's Historical Fiction
I rather liked the Simonides one (The Praise Singer?). Other than that I’ve only read (the first part of?) The King Must Die, with its all-blonde Greeks. I read that in my early teens I think, and had some unlearning to do. Only considerably later did I recognize it as Frazer-influenced. And I didn’t then realize she was lesbian. Is that why they’re still read perhaps? But they are well written, and well imagined—which only makes them more pernicious?
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Re: Mary Renault's Historical Fiction
Strait is the gate - but don't you think novels like these set a few more down the way to real Greeks than would otherwise take an interest? Or do people who would otherwise make good Greek scholars get stuck in the bog of their easy pleasures?
Mary Renault was from Essex, I believe.
Mary Renault was from Essex, I believe.
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Re: Mary Renault's Historical Fiction
Haha perfect. It feels mean to point that out but I really have noticed that pattern. 9/10 someone recommending them is old.
Yes, I chose not to comment on this. It is throughout the Praise Singer too (real Greeks are blond, Simonides being dark is a minor plot point), which is risible. It is a good reminder of how shaky the command of Greek, how truly unfamiliar, that generation of classics fanciers were. I don't find them pernicious, just old. Some of hers are well writtenmwh wrote: ↑Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:16 pm I rather liked the Simonides one (The Praise Singer?). Other than that I’ve only read (the first part of?) The King Must Die, with its all-blonde Greeks. I read that in my early teens I think, and had some unlearning to do. Only considerably later did I recognize it as Frazer-influenced. And I didn’t then realize she was lesbian. Is that why they’re still read perhaps? But they are well written, and well imagined—which only makes them more pernicious?
Sean, this article is more eloquent and kinder to Miller's work than I could be: https://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/29/book ... ller.html
(Occasionally) Working on the following tutorials:
(P)Aristotle, Theophrastus and Peripatetic Greek
Intro Greek Poetry
Latin Historical Prose
(P)Aristotle, Theophrastus and Peripatetic Greek
Intro Greek Poetry
Latin Historical Prose
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Re: Mary Renault's Historical Fiction
"The result is a book that has the head of a young adult novel, the body of the “Iliad” and the hindquarters of Barbara Cartland." - Ha! Maybe it should stay on the shelf, then.Scribo wrote: ↑Sun Mar 21, 2021 6:26 pm Sean, this article is more eloquent and kinder to Miller's work than I could be: https://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/29/book ... ller.html
I loved that acid Renault quote in the review:
“If characters have come to life, one should know how they will make love; if not it doesn’t matter. Inch-by-inch physical descriptions are the ketchup of the literary cuisine, only required by the insipid dish or by the diner without a palate.”
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Re: Mary Renault's Historical Fiction
For me The Last of the Wine is her best. Interestingly her first, too.
I also like her version of the assassination of Hipparchus in The Praise Singer.
The Alexander Trilogy is, in my opinion, rather uneven. The Persian Boy is the best of the three volumes.
The Golden Bough imagery of Bull From The Sea makes it a bit unwieldy.
But, that said, all her books are worth reading.
I also like her version of the assassination of Hipparchus in The Praise Singer.
The Alexander Trilogy is, in my opinion, rather uneven. The Persian Boy is the best of the three volumes.
The Golden Bough imagery of Bull From The Sea makes it a bit unwieldy.
But, that said, all her books are worth reading.
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Re: Mary Renault's Historical Fiction
Not to take anything away from Mary Renault's influence, but it was the movie Hercules with Steve Reeves that first awakened my interest in Greek mythology. As an 8 year old seeing that film, it was a mind blowing experience. For years the scene in which he wrestled with the Cretan bull replayed itself in my imagination.
Interestingly, I managed to re-watch it a couple of years ago and hardly anything on the screen matched my memory of it. The bull wrestling scene is so obviously a fake that I have wondered how it had such an impact on me.
Interestingly, I managed to re-watch it a couple of years ago and hardly anything on the screen matched my memory of it. The bull wrestling scene is so obviously a fake that I have wondered how it had such an impact on me.
Why, he's at worst your poet who sings how Greeks
That never were, in Troy which never was,
Did this or the other impossible great thing!
---Robert Browning
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Hal Friederichs
That never were, in Troy which never was,
Did this or the other impossible great thing!
---Robert Browning
-------------------------------------------------------
Hal Friederichs