After Wheelock

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ThatLanguageGuy
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After Wheelock

Post by ThatLanguageGuy » Fri Sep 09, 2016 12:21 am

What literature have you guys read and recommend after Wheelock? I'm excited to be able to read literature, and I've been working through a book called Intellegenda: Comprehension Exercises in Latin Prose and Verse by M.G. Balme (which is fantastic!) and the LINGVA LATINA edition of Commentarii de bello Gallico. Is there any other literature you recommend?

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swtwentyman
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Re: After Wheelock

Post by swtwentyman » Fri Sep 09, 2016 4:38 am

The "rules of the Latin board" post has a number of (interesting-looking) links to old threads, including this one:

http://www.textkit.com/greek-latin-foru ... .php?t=170

If I may indulge myself (I just posted it):

http://www.textkit.com/greek-latin-foru ... =3&t=65813

ThatLanguageGuy
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Re: After Wheelock

Post by ThatLanguageGuy » Fri Sep 09, 2016 11:24 am

Thanks!!!

horus92
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Re: After Wheelock

Post by horus92 » Fri Sep 09, 2016 1:31 pm

There are a lot of good, relatively easy prose authors.

Cicero's In Verres is way more interesting than Caesar to me. It's a record of the crimes of a flagrantly corrupt provincial governor. Probably too long for you to want to read through but you could do a book of it.

Nepos is pretty simple, so is Suetonius.

Cicero's philosophical works are much easier than most of his speeches and not much harder than Caesar.

Rhetorica ad Herennium is very easy and also very worthwhile to read, as it teaches you the basics of Classical rhetoric.

I can't pass over the Vulgate, of course. Also saints' lives in general, the Legenda Aurea, etc.

Isidore of Seville's Etymologiae is in very simple Latin and is also very interesting.

Velleius Paterculus wrote a brief and simply written history of Rome.

Ampelius' Liber Memorialis is easy and interesting.

Some of these authors are easier than others but none should hopefully be overwhelming.

You should read some poetry too. The easiest poet, imo, is Ovid. It will be very hard going at first but worth it. When you're up for it at least a couple of Plautus plays will help you get a more natural feeling for the language, he's not as hard as he's reputed to be.

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Re: After Wheelock

Post by hlawson38 » Fri Sep 09, 2016 1:51 pm

I classify myself as an intermediate student. That is, I read with difficulty actual literature.

The easiest real-Latin-literature I have tried is Cornelius Nepos. He writes brief biographical essays on great commanders, mostly Greek ones. Critics point to inaccuracies in his history facts, but don't worry about that. Just don't rely on him for accurate history facts.

He will give you a good workout on indirect discourse, on sequence of tenses, and so on, because such grammar issues frequently come up in historical narration. And he does this while deploying a fairly small vocabulary. The fewer new words you must look up, the more you can concentrate on inflections and syntax.

I have also dipped into Suetonius and Livy, and found them more difficult than Cornelius Nepos. I classify Sallust as easier than these two, but not as easy as Cornelius Nepos.

I've read several recommendations of Curtius Rufus as fairly easy, but I haven't read enough to form an opinion.

I worked my way through Caesar several years ago, but my ability then was so elementary that I can't give a rating now.

ThatLanguageGuy
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Re: After Wheelock

Post by ThatLanguageGuy » Fri Sep 09, 2016 9:47 pm

I've been translating Nepos for about 20 minutes here, and I really like it. How do you guys feel about Eutropius though? He is definitely a great Roman historian.

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Re: After Wheelock

Post by LateStarter » Sun Sep 11, 2016 12:43 am

I read and would recommend the following:

Ritchie's Fabulae Faciles. A graded reader. Available here in a nice .pdf and probably elsewhere:
https://geoffreysteadman.com/ritchies-fabulae-faciles

The Latin is much better than the adaptations in say, 38 Latin Stories. A good bridge to Caesar, which was the author's conscious purpose. Worth an immediate reread, or somewhat soon after completion, for the sake of the vocabulary and harder constructions.

The whole of Eutropius. If you can manage to retain a bit of the actual history, you'll have a good outline of the high points of Roman history from the founding of the city to the late Empire. The Latin is very close to 'golden age' usage.

All of Nepos, for the reasons others have pointed out.

I then read all of the genuine Caesar. It seems to be less fashionable these days in the politically correct colleges but there's a reason this was standard for at least a century.

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Re: After Wheelock

Post by canontriplex » Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:52 pm

I find Nepos not easy at all. Before Atticus I was struggling more often than I am used to, but when I came to Atticus it was like a sudden stop. This person is almost divine and everything he does is beyond criticism, so Nepos engages in all kind of moralizing and preaching about him that his Latin to me seems so unnecessarily convoluted. At times became such a drudgery that I simply had to give up. And this is all the more frustrating because I have been studying Latin for 5 years with a top of the class private teacher who doesn't speak English and the lessons are conducted in Latin. I prefer a direct style like Caesar and historical authors who are actually historians not preachers. They can be also difficult for other reasons, but at least they don't muddy the waters unnecessarily. To anyone starting out with prose I'd recommend first Ritchie's Fabulae Faciles. It's really good and direct graded Latin and the stories are interesting. Then read Avelanus Fabulae Divales, again, his Latin is really good. After this read Robinson Crusoëus by F.J. Goffaux. It's really good Latin and the story is famous. Finally try Romans, but don't go anywhere before Caesar and stay there as long as you can. It's not as interesting, but he is not pretentious and really wants to tell what happened without showing off how well he knows Latin. After him pretty much everyone seems to me difficult (except uninteresting Etropius) so it doesn't matter who you pick.
Last edited by canontriplex on Tue Dec 19, 2017 8:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Barry Hofstetter
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Re: After Wheelock

Post by Barry Hofstetter » Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:49 pm

Cicero's Prima Oratio In Catilinam and Sallust's Bellum Catilinae were favorite teaching texts for those learning Latin in ancient times. Of course, chances were such a student spoke Greek and already understood a great deal about inflected languages...

Other than that, I love Ritchie as a bridge text for reviewing elementary Latin before moving on, and Caesar as a first author is always profitable. Ovid I think is the best first author for poetry -- not only are the stories easily excerpted, but his Latin is actually quite straightforward, if one takes the time to rewrite them in prose word order (which can be a helpful exercise for beginning students).
N.E. Barry Hofstetter
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καὶ σὺ τὸ σὸν ποιήσεις κἀγὼ τὸ ἐμόν. ἆρον τὸ σὸν καὶ ὕπαγε.

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Re: After Wheelock

Post by rothbard » Sun Dec 17, 2017 6:34 pm

For me, the Vulgate was the best way to start. The Latin is simple, and I was already familiar with the texts. Later I switched to a fully macronised version of De Bello Gallico with lots of vocabulary and grammar notes, and an extensive grammar appendix. I read all of Book 1 and part of Book 2, then moved on to Cicero and other authors. I didn't find Avellanus' Latin to be any simpler than that of Cicero or Caesar.

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Re: After Wheelock

Post by canontriplex » Mon Dec 18, 2017 6:09 am

Avelanus is not easier than Romans, but Fabulae Divales are a jewel at an intermediate level. Try it for yourself. https://books.google.com/books?id=JfI_T ... &q&f=false

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