Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Markos » Wed Mar 07, 2018 9:06 pm

τοὺς ἐν Κυρίῳ φίλους ἁπάζομαι Μᾶρκος.
Isaac Newton wrote:διδάσκαλος τις ἐν σαπρῷ νοΐ ἀνεγίνωσκεν τὰς γραφάς . ἡμέρα τῇ ἡμέρᾳ οὕτως ἐποίησεν ὥστε ἀκατάστατος τό πνεῦμα αὐτοῦ ἐγένετο. Νυνὶ δὲ, ὅσον αὐταῖς ἀνεγίνωσκεν, τὸ πνεῦμα αὐτοῦ ἐγένετο ἀσθενὲς μᾶλλον περισσότερον .

Ἐγένετο δὲ ἐν μιᾷ τῶν ἡμερῶν ἐν τῷ ἀναγνῶναι αὐτὸν , κρατήσας ὁ πατήρ αὐτοῦ τὸ βιβλίον τὸ ἅγιον ἀπό τῶν χειρῶν αὐτοῦ καὶ ἔβαλεν αὐτό ἐν τῷ πῦρ. ὁ διδάσκαλος ἐθαύμασεν καὶ εἶπεν, “πάτερ, οὐ ἁγιάζεις τὸ βιβλίον ?” ἀπεκρίθη ὁ πατήρ καὶ εἶπεν αὐτῷ, Ἄφρων, ὅτι ἁγιάζω τὸ βιβλίον ὅτι ἐξειλάμην σε ἀπ αὐτό. επήρες τὴν ψυχὴν σου ἐν αὐτῷ.”
καλόν ἐστιν. Very well done. Despite a few minor mistakes, I understood 100% of it. I also agree with the underlying meaning of the story.

Following ἑκηβόλος' lead, I rewrite the story, taking the point of view of ὁ διδάσκολος. I correct some of the minor mistakes and make a few other minor changes.

Διδάσκαλος ἤμην. ἐν δὲ σαπρῷ νοΐ τὰς γραφὰς ἤμην ἀναγιγνώσκων. καὶ καθ' ἡμέραν οὕτως ἐποίησα ὥστε ἀκατάστατον τὸ πνεῦμά μοῦ ἐγένετο. ὅσον δὲ χρόνον αὐτὰς ἀνεγίνωσκον, τὸ πνεῦμά μου ἀσθενὲς ἐγένετο μᾶλλον ἢ ἰσχυρόν.

Ἐγένετο δὲ ἐν μιᾷ τῶν ἡμερῶν ἐν τῷ με ἀναγνῶναι, κρατήσας ὁ πατήρ μου τὸ βιβλίον τὸ ἅγιον ἀπὸ τῶν χειρῶν μου, ἔβαλεν αὐτὸ ἐν τῷ πυρί. θαυμάζων δ' εἶπον, “πάτερ, οὐ σέβῃ σύγε τὸ βιβλίον?” ἀπεκρίθη δ' ὁ πατήρ καὶ εἶπεν ἐμοί, "Ἄφρων, ὅτι σέβομαι τὸ βιβλίον ἐξειλάμην σε ἐξ αὐτοῦ. σὺ γὰρ ἐπίμπρης τὴν ψυχήν σου ἐν αὐτῷ."

(νῦν δὲ μόνον ἐν τῷ ἁγίῳ πνεύματι τὰς γραφὰς ἀναγιγνώσκω ἔγωγε.)

Keep writing these, Isaac. I am finding it pedagogically helpful. ἴθι πολλὰ χαίρων.
οὐ μανθάνω γράφειν, ἀλλὰ γράφω τοῦ μαθεῖν.

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Isaac Newton » Thu Mar 08, 2018 5:10 am

Nice retelling Markos, helps me with internalization. I notice that the instructor says that he “was” ( past tense, Διδάσκαλος ἤμην) one, in a terse opening statement..That piqued my interest as a reader and got me to wonder about his lot even after I had finished reading the story. Nice use of a simple tense at the right place and time. One does not always need to use intricate words and word structures to write powerfully.

Thanks again,
Οὐαὶ οἱ λέγοντες τὸ πονηρὸν καλὸν καὶ τὸ καλὸν πονηρόν, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ σκότος φῶς καὶ τὸ φῶς σκότος, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ πικρὸν γλυκὺ καὶ τὸ γλυκὺ πικρόν

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Isaac Newton » Thu Mar 08, 2018 12:04 pm

Here’s something else I composed:

βάτραχος τις ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ ἔλειξεν ἑρπετόν ὃ κοιμώμενον ἐπ' ανθει καὶ κατέπιεν αὐτὸ. καὶ πεπληρωμένος πολλῷ ὕβρει, ἀνεφώνησεν κραυγῇ μεγάλῃ καὶ εἶπεν, σβέννυμι ψυχὴν ὁσάκις ἐὰν θέλω.

ἔτι αὐτοῦ λαλοῦντος, ἰδοὺ κάμηλος ἐπατησεν ἐπ' αὐτόν, ἐξαπίνης ἀποκτείνουσα αὐτόν.

A certain frog in the field licked an insect which was sleeping on a flower and swallowed it. And being filled with pride, he cried out in a loud voice and said, “ I snuff out life as often as I will.”

While he was yet speaking, a camel trampled on him, killing him without notice.
Οὐαὶ οἱ λέγοντες τὸ πονηρὸν καλὸν καὶ τὸ καλὸν πονηρόν, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ σκότος φῶς καὶ τὸ φῶς σκότος, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ πικρὸν γλυκὺ καὶ τὸ γλυκὺ πικρόν

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by ἑκηβόλος » Thu Mar 08, 2018 7:12 pm

ὁ πρόλογος.
ἀνατέλλοντος τοῦ σειρίου ἐξεπορεύσατο γυρῖνος ἐκ τοῦ ᾤου αὐτοῦ καὶ ἐνῴκησεν ἐν μέσῳ τῶν τοῦ Νείλου καλάμων. διαγένοντος δὲ χρώνου ὀλίγου πλημμυρὶς ἐγένετο. μετὰ ταῦτα, ξηρανθείσης δὲ τῆς γῆς ἐγένετο ὁ γυρῖνος βάτραχος. κατήγαγων ἀπὸ τοῦ ὕδατος ὑπήντησεν ἀκρίδα. ἐρεθίζων δὲ τὴν ἀκρίδα ὁ βάτραχος εἶπεν αὐτῷ ὅτι ἡ φωνή μου ἔοικε σύριγγι, ἀλλὰ ἡ φωνή σου τυμπάνῳ. ἡ δὲ ἔφη ἀληθὲς λέγεις. ὁ δὲ βάτραχος ἀπήντησεν αὐτῷ λέγων ὅτι ὅσον ᾠδικοτέρα τυμπάνων συρίγγες, τοσοῦτον μείζονες ἀκρίδων βάτραχοι. εἶτα νυκτὼρ φεγγούσης τῆς σελήνης εἶδεν ὁ βάτραχος ἑρπετὸν κοιμᾶσθαι ..,
τί δὲ ἀγαθὸν τῇ πομφόλυγι συνεστώσῃ ἢ κακὸν διαλυθείσῃ;

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by mwh » Thu Mar 08, 2018 9:29 pm

εκηβολε, That’s quite close to being Greek (and much closer than poor Isaac's). Some corrections would bring it closer.
(Your text below, with mistakes in bold. Corrections below that.)

ἀνατέλλοντος τοῦ σειρίου ἐξεπορεύσατο γυρῖνος ἐκ τοῦ ᾤου αὐτοῦ καὶ ἐνῴκησεν ἐν μέσῳ τῶν τοῦ Νείλου καλάμων. διαγένοντος δὲ χρώνου ὀλίγου πλημμυρὶς ἐγένετο. μετὰ ταῦτα, ξηρανθείσης δὲ τῆς γῆς ἐγένετο ὁ γυρῖνος βάτραχος. κατήγαγων ἀπὸ τοῦ ὕδατος ὑπήντησεν ἀκρίδα. ἐρεθίζων δὲ τὴν ἀκρίδα ὁ βάτραχος εἶπεν αὐτῷ ὅτι ἡ φωνή μου ἔοικε σύριγγι, ἀλλὰ ἡ φωνή σου τυμπάνῳ. ἡ δὲ ἔφη ἀληθὲς λέγεις. ὁ δὲ βάτραχος ἀπήντησεν αὐτῷ λέγων ὅτι ὅσον ᾠδικοτέρα τυμπάνων συρίγγες, τοσοῦτον μείζονες ἀκρίδων βάτραχοι. εἶτα νυκτὼρ φεγγούσης τῆς σελήνης εἶδεν ὁ βάτραχος ἑρπετὸν κοιμᾶσθαι ..,
χρονου
μετα δε ταυτα ξηρανθεισης
καταγαγων
ακριδι
αυτῃ
η εμη φωνη … η δε ση
Don’t you have the sounds the wrong way round?
απηλθεν? They’ve already met.
οσῳ … τοσουτῳ
ωδικωτεραι
(Articles with the nouns would be better)
κοιμωμενον

Edit. Or did you mean not ἐρεθίζων δὲ τὴν ἀκρίδα ὁ βάτραχος but ερεθιζουσα δ’ η ακρις τον βατραχον? Something is the wrong way round.

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Barry Hofstetter » Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:10 pm

Βρεκεκεκὲξ κοὰξ κοάξ!
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καὶ σὺ τὸ σὸν ποιήσεις κἀγὼ τὸ ἐμόν. ἆρον τὸ σὸν καὶ ὕπαγε.

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Markos » Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:33 pm

χαίρετε.
Isaac Newton wrote:βάτραχος τις ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ ἔλειξεν ἑρπετόν...
ἄλλον καλὸν μῦθον πεποίηκας σύ.

ἰδοῦ τὰ ἐπιμύθια:

πρὸς τοὺς καυχωμένους εὔκαιρος ὁ μῦθος.

ὁ μῦθος δηλοῖ ὅτι πᾶσιν οἱ κρείσσονες ὑπάρχουσι.

ὁ μῦθος δηλοῖ ὅτι μεῖζόν ἐστιν τὸ ἔργον ἢ ὁ λόγος.
ἑκηβόλος wrote:ὁ πρόλογος...
φιλῶ! :D
ἑκηβόλος wrote:...γυρῖνος... ἐνῴκησεν ἐν μέσῳ τῶν τοῦ Νείλου καλάμων.
ἴχθύς τις ἦν.
ἑκηβόλος wrote:...κατήγαγων ἀπὸ τοῦ ὕδατος...
νῦν δ' ἑρπετόν ἐστιν. ἀμφίβιον γὰρ ὑπάρχει.
ἑκηβόλος wrote:...κατήγαγων ἀπὸ τοῦ ὕδατος...
ἴσως ἐκ τοῦ ὕδατος?
Barry Hofstetter wrote:Βρεκεκεκὲξ κοὰξ κοάξ!
γελοῖόν ἐστι! :lol:

ἔρρωσθε.
οὐ μανθάνω γράφειν, ἀλλὰ γράφω τοῦ μαθεῖν.

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Isaac Newton » Fri Mar 09, 2018 2:10 am

Markos wrote:χαίρετε.
Isaac Newton wrote:βάτραχος τις ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ ἔλειξεν ἑρπετόν...
ἄλλον καλὸν μῦθον πεποίηκας σύ.
Thanks Marcos.. Do you see any major grammatical errors in that particular parable ?

Ref:

βάτραχος τις ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ ἔλειξεν ἑρπετόν ὃ κοιμώμενον ἐπ' ανθει καὶ κατέπιεν αὐτὸ. καὶ πεπληρωμένος πολλῷ ὕβρει, ἀνεφώνησεν κραυγῇ μεγάλῃ καὶ εἶπεν, σβέννυμι ψυχὴν ὁσάκις ἐὰν θέλω.

ἔτι αὐτοῦ λαλοῦντος, ἰδοὺ κάμηλος ἐπατησεν ἐπ' αὐτόν, ἐξαπίνης ἀποκτείνουσα αὐτόν.
Οὐαὶ οἱ λέγοντες τὸ πονηρὸν καλὸν καὶ τὸ καλὸν πονηρόν, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ σκότος φῶς καὶ τὸ φῶς σκότος, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ πικρὸν γλυκὺ καὶ τὸ γλυκὺ πικρόν

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by ἑκηβόλος » Fri Mar 09, 2018 4:33 am

mwh wrote:εκηβολε, That’s quite close to being Greek. Some corrections would bring it closer.
It was a 3am and mostly asleep composition, so the language monitor or checking function may not have been too active.
  • χρώνου for χρονου, displacing the discourse marker from the syntax in μετὰ ταῦτα, ξηρανθείσης δὲ for μετα δε ταυτα ξηρανθεισης and ᾠδικοτέρα for ωδικωτεραι are all face-palm mistakes.
  • κατήγαγων for καταγαγων is an error in my grammar due to wrong memorisation of an exemplar text. (Strategy - say that word of the exemplar Diod. 13.90.1 more clearly without making the alpha into a schewa).
  • ὑπήντησεν +acc for +dat is something I did learn at one time, but have apparently forgotten now. (Strategy: incorporate some anta- family wirds into my compositions for a while).
  • εἶδεν +inf for +ptcpl is a lack in my understanding if the language. (Strategy: Look into it).
  • ἀπήντησεν used with the meaning "answer" is cross-linguistic interference from Modern Greek. (Solution: find a Classical Greek word for "answer"
Yes, the characters and their voices definitely are a bit confused in this version.
τί δὲ ἀγαθὸν τῇ πομφόλυγι συνεστώσῃ ἢ κακὸν διαλυθείσῃ;

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by ἑκηβόλος » Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:09 am

Isaac Newton wrote:ὃ κοιμώμενον
This is the most serious syntactic error. Can you see what's wrong with the construction?
Isaac Newton wrote:σβέννυμι ψυχὴν
Is this an idiomatoc use of this verb?
Isaac Newton wrote: ἐπ' ἀνθει
What case should this noun be? Why?
τί δὲ ἀγαθὸν τῇ πομφόλυγι συνεστώσῃ ἢ κακὸν διαλυθείσῃ;

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Isaac Newton » Fri Mar 09, 2018 6:32 am

ἑκηβόλος,

ὃ κοιμώμενον ἐπ' ανθει is in apposition to ἑρπετόν:


βάτραχος τις ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ ἔλειξεν ἑρπετόν , ὃ κοιμώμενον ἐπ' ανθει καὶ κατέπιεν αὐτὸ.
Is that not ok ? I should have used the neuter accusative article instead?
Οὐαὶ οἱ λέγοντες τὸ πονηρὸν καλὸν καὶ τὸ καλὸν πονηρόν, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ σκότος φῶς καὶ τὸ φῶς σκότος, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ πικρὸν γλυκὺ καὶ τὸ γλυκὺ πικρόν

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by ἑκηβόλος » Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:24 pm

Isaac Newton wrote:ἑκηβόλος,

ὃ κοιμώμενον ἐπ' ανθει is in apposition to ἑρπετόν:


βάτραχος τις ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ ἔλειξεν ἑρπετόν , ὃ κοιμώμενον ἐπ' ανθει καὶ κατέπιεν αὐτὸ.
Is that not ok ? I should have used the neuter accusative article instead?
Is the case required by the syntactic pattern of each phase the same? A necessary condition of grammatical apposition is that the cases match. Logical or inferential aposition (in the conceptual i-language) doesn’t translate into grammatical aposition withoit the grammaticisation required by the e-language, ie Greek grammar.
Last edited by ἑκηβόλος on Fri Mar 09, 2018 2:05 pm, edited 2 times in total.
τί δὲ ἀγαθὸν τῇ πομφόλυγι συνεστώσῃ ἢ κακὸν διαλυθείσῃ;

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Isaac Newton » Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:29 pm

ἑκηβόλος wrote:
Isaac Newton wrote:ἑκηβόλος,

ὃ κοιμώμενον ἐπ' ανθει is in apposition to ἑρπετόν:


βάτραχος τις ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ ἔλειξεν ἑρπετόν , ὃ κοιμώμενον ἐπ' ανθει καὶ κατέπιεν αὐτὸ.
Is that not ok ? I should have used the neuter accusative article instead?
Is the case the same in each phase?
Yes, ἑρπετόν ( Accusative), ὃ κοιμώμενον..(Accusative).
Οὐαὶ οἱ λέγοντες τὸ πονηρὸν καλὸν καὶ τὸ καλὸν πονηρόν, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ σκότος φῶς καὶ τὸ φῶς σκότος, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ πικρὸν γλυκὺ καὶ τὸ γλυκὺ πικρόν

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by ἑκηβόλος » Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:59 pm

What part of speech is ὃ?
τί δὲ ἀγαθὸν τῇ πομφόλυγι συνεστώσῃ ἢ κακὸν διαλυθείσῃ;

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Barry Hofstetter » Fri Mar 09, 2018 2:19 pm

Isaac Newton wrote:ἑκηβόλος,

ὃ κοιμώμενον ἐπ' ανθει is in apposition to ἑρπετόν:


βάτραχος τις ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ ἔλειξεν ἑρπετόν , ὃ κοιμώμενον ἐπ' ανθει καὶ κατέπιεν αὐτὸ.
Is that not ok ? I should have used the neuter accusative article instead?
The relative pronoun always wants a finite verb, and so κοιμᾶται. Otherwise, just leave the relative out, and certainly don't add the article, and you have something that sounds a bit more like Greek.
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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Isaac Newton » Fri Mar 09, 2018 3:29 pm

Barry Hofstetter wrote:
Isaac Newton wrote:ἑκηβόλος,

ὃ κοιμώμενον ἐπ' ανθει is in apposition to ἑρπετόν:


βάτραχος τις ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ ἔλειξεν ἑρπετόν , ὃ κοιμώμενον ἐπ' ανθει καὶ κατέπιεν αὐτὸ.
Is that not ok ? I should have used the neuter accusative article instead?
The relative pronoun always wants a finite verb, and so κοιμᾶται. Otherwise, just leave the relative out, and certainly don't add the article, and you have something that sounds a bit more like Greek.
So all I have to do is exchange the participle for the verb and my sentence is perfect:
βάτραχος τις ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ ἔλειξεν ἑρπετόν , ὃ κοιμᾶται ἐπ' ανθει καὶ κατέπιεν αὐτὸ.
Or else leave the relative out, and again the sentence is perfect:
βάτραχος τις ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ ἔλειξεν ἑρπετόν κοιμώμενον ἐπ' ανθει καὶ κατέπιεν αὐτὸ.
The latter flows more readily.

Thanks
Οὐαὶ οἱ λέγοντες τὸ πονηρὸν καλὸν καὶ τὸ καλὸν πονηρόν, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ σκότος φῶς καὶ τὸ φῶς σκότος, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ πικρὸν γλυκὺ καὶ τὸ γλυκὺ πικρόν

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by ἑκηβόλος » Fri Mar 09, 2018 6:59 pm

Isaac Newton wrote:[quote="...and my sentence is perfect:
... κατέπιεν [τὸ ἑρπετόν]
The latter flows more readily.
Isaac,

Speaking of flowing ...

You may like to look at the difference between κατέπιεν and κατέφαγεν - both covering in some ways, the meaning of the English word "swallow".
τί δὲ ἀγαθὸν τῇ πομφόλυγι συνεστώσῃ ἢ κακὸν διαλυθείσῃ;

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Markos » Fri Mar 09, 2018 10:43 pm

Isaac Newton wrote:...my sentence is perfect:
βάτραχος τις ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ ἔλειξεν ἑρπετόν κοιμώμενον ἐπ' ανθει καὶ κατέπιεν αὐτὸ.
It's a great sentence. To move it closer to perfection, change a few accents:

βάτραχός τις ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ ἔλειξεν ἑρπετὸν κοιμώμενον ἐπ' ἄνθει καὶ κατέπιεν αὐτό.

Stop me before I paraphrase again: :lol:

ἐν ἀγρῷ βάτραχός τις λείξας ἔντομον κοιμώμενον ἐπ' ἄνθει κατέπιε.
οὐ μανθάνω γράφειν, ἀλλὰ γράφω τοῦ μαθεῖν.

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by ἑκηβόλος » Sat Mar 10, 2018 3:17 am

Markos wrote:Stop me before I paraphrase again: :lol:
It is great that Isaac is singularly motivated to ecapsulate his meaning in Greek and interaction with others is probably a great part of his continued motivation.

If you'd like to try something different, consider these other options:
Expansion - saying what he said in the "correct" or a different way.
Extension - using the meaning he brought up to keep the "conversation" going.
Correction - pointing out his errors explicitly or asking him to find them.
Instruction - telling him how to correctly do what he seems to be trying to do.

You can see in my responses (extensions) that I feel he needs to develop the communicative features of language - to know that others can respond thoughtfully to the meaning he has expressed. He himself sometimes asks for direct correction of form.
Last edited by ἑκηβόλος on Sat Mar 10, 2018 4:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Isaac Newton » Sat Mar 10, 2018 1:07 pm

Appreciate your thoughts Marcos and ἑκηβόλος.
Οὐαὶ οἱ λέγοντες τὸ πονηρὸν καλὸν καὶ τὸ καλὸν πονηρόν, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ σκότος φῶς καὶ τὸ φῶς σκότος, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ πικρὸν γλυκὺ καὶ τὸ γλυκὺ πικρόν

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Markos » Sun Mar 11, 2018 4:12 pm

Inspired by Isaac, here's an original composition.

καὶ ἐξῆλθεν Ἰησοῦς ἐκεῖθεν σὺν τοῖς μαθηταῖς αὐτοῦ. καὶ λέγει αὐτῷ Σίμων «Κύριε, ποῖ ὑπάγομεν?» καὶ λέγει Ἰησοῦς «εἰς ζωὴν ὑπάγομεν.» καὶ λέγει αὐτῷ Σίμων «ποῦ δ' ἡ ζωή?» καὶ εἶπε Ἰησοῦς «ἰδὼν τὴν ζωὴν σύ με ἐρωτᾷς ποῦ ἐστιν ἡ ζωή?» καὶ εἶπε Σίμων «τίς ἐστιν ἡ ὁδὸς ἡ ἄγουσα εἰς τὴν ζωήν?» Ἰησοῦς εἶπε «ἡ ὁδός σοι λαλεῖ.» καὶ ἀποκριθεὶς Σίμων λέγει αὐτῷ «Κύριε, ἐν ἀπορίᾳ εἰμί. τοὺς γὰρ λόγους σοῦ οὐ συνῆκα. λέγε μοι οὖν τὴν ἀλήθειαν. ταύτην γὰρ ζητῶ.» λέγει Ἰησοῦς «ὦ φίλε Σίμων. ἀμὴν ἀμὴν λέγω ἐγώ σοι, ἐὰν ζητῇς σὺ τὴν ἀλήθειαν, αὐτὸν εὐρήσῃ.» ὁ δὲ Σίμων ἐθαύμαζε.
οὐ μανθάνω γράφειν, ἀλλὰ γράφω τοῦ μαθεῖν.

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Barry Hofstetter » Sun Mar 11, 2018 11:29 pm

Markos wrote:Inspired by Isaac, here's an original composition.

καὶ ἐξῆλθεν Ἰησοῦς ἐκεῖθεν σὺν τοῖς μαθηταῖς αὐτοῦ. καὶ λέγει αὐτῷ Σίμων «Κύριε, ποῖ ὑπάγομεν?» καὶ λέγει Ἰησοῦς «εἰς ζωὴν ὑπάγομεν.» καὶ λέγει αὐτῷ Σίμων «ποῦ δ' ἡ ζωή?» καὶ εἶπε Ἰησοῦς «ἰδὼν τὴν ζωὴν σύ με ἐρωτᾷς ποῦ ἐστιν ἡ ζωή?» καὶ εἶπε Σίμων «τίς ἐστιν ἡ ὁδὸς ἡ ἄγουσα εἰς τὴν ζωήν?» Ἰησοῦς εἶπε «ἡ ὁδός σοι λαλεῖ.» καὶ ἀποκριθεὶς Σίμων λέγει αὐτῷ «Κύριε, ἐν ἀπορίᾳ εἰμί. τοὺς γὰρ λόγους σοῦ οὐ συνῆκα. λέγε μοι οὖν τὴν ἀλήθειαν. ταύτην γὰρ ζητῶ.» λέγει Ἰησοῦς «ὦ φίλε Σίμων. ἀμὴν ἀμὴν λέγω ἐγώ σοι, ἐὰν ζητῇς σὺ τὴν ἀλήθειαν, αὐτὸν εὐρήσῃ.» ὁ δὲ Σίμων ἐθαύμαζε.
αὑτὴ δέ ἡ σύνθεσις τῶν γνωστικῶν γραφῶν με ἀναμιμνήσκει...
N.E. Barry Hofstetter
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καὶ σὺ τὸ σὸν ποιήσεις κἀγὼ τὸ ἐμόν. ἆρον τὸ σὸν καὶ ὕπαγε.

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Isaac Newton » Mon Mar 12, 2018 12:27 am

Markos wrote:Inspired by Isaac, here's an original composition.

καὶ ἐξῆλθεν Ἰησοῦς ἐκεῖθεν σὺν τοῖς μαθηταῖς αὐτοῦ. καὶ λέγει αὐτῷ Σίμων «Κύριε, ποῖ ὑπάγομεν?» καὶ λέγει Ἰησοῦς «εἰς ζωὴν ὑπάγομεν.» καὶ λέγει αὐτῷ Σίμων «ποῦ δ' ἡ ζωή?» καὶ εἶπε Ἰησοῦς «ἰδὼν τὴν ζωὴν σύ με ἐρωτᾷς ποῦ ἐστιν ἡ ζωή?» καὶ εἶπε Σίμων «τίς ἐστιν ἡ ὁδὸς ἡ ἄγουσα εἰς τὴν ζωήν?» Ἰησοῦς εἶπε «ἡ ὁδός σοι λαλεῖ.» καὶ ἀποκριθεὶς Σίμων λέγει αὐτῷ «Κύριε, ἐν ἀπορίᾳ εἰμί. τοὺς γὰρ λόγους σοῦ οὐ συνῆκα. λέγε μοι οὖν τὴν ἀλήθειαν. ταύτην γὰρ ζητῶ.» λέγει Ἰησοῦς «ὦ φίλε Σίμων. ἀμὴν ἀμὴν λέγω ἐγώ σοι, ἐὰν ζητῇς σὺ τὴν ἀλήθειαν, αὐτὸν εὐρήσῃ.» ὁ δὲ Σίμων ἐθαύμαζε.
Here’s my English translation of your work:

And Jesus went out from there with his disciples. And Simon said unto him, “Lord, where are we going?” And Jesus said, “Into life we’re going.”And Simon said unto him, “where is life?” And Jesus said, “Having seen the life, you yet ask me where it is?” And Simon said, “what is the way leading to life?” Jesus said, “the Way is speaking to you.” And answering, Simon said to him, “Lord I am perplexed. I don’t comprehend your words.Therefore you tell me the truth. For this is what I seek.” Jesus said, “my dear Simon! Truly, truly I say unto you, if you seek the truth, you will find him.” And Simon was amazed.
Οὐαὶ οἱ λέγοντες τὸ πονηρὸν καλὸν καὶ τὸ καλὸν πονηρόν, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ σκότος φῶς καὶ τὸ φῶς σκότος, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ πικρὸν γλυκὺ καὶ τὸ γλυκὺ πικρόν

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Markos » Mon Mar 12, 2018 6:16 pm

Barry Hofstetter wrote:αὑτὴ δέ ἡ σύνθεσις τῶν γνωστικῶν γραφῶν με ἀναμιμνήσκει...
ἀληθὴ λέγεις, ὦ τᾶν. ἀλλ' ὀλίγον ὁμοίως τοῖς γνωστικοῖς Ἰησοῦς αὐτὸς ἐνίοτε εἶπε.
Isaac Newton wrote:Here’s my English translation of your work...
εὖγε κράτιστε Ἰσαακ! καλὴ γὰρ ἡ μετάφρασίς σου, ὦ ἄριστε. τοὺς δὲ λόγους μου τελείως συνῆκας σύγε. χαίροις δή, φίλτατε!
οὐ μανθάνω γράφειν, ἀλλὰ γράφω τοῦ μαθεῖν.

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Isaac Newton » Tue Mar 13, 2018 12:19 am

Markos wrote:
Barry Hofstetter wrote:αὑτὴ δέ ἡ σύνθεσις τῶν γνωστικῶν γραφῶν με ἀναμιμνήσκει...
ἀληθὴ λέγεις, ὦ τᾶν. ἀλλ' ὀλίγον ὁμοίως τοῖς γνωστικοῖς Ἰησοῦς αὐτὸς ἐνίοτε εἶπε.
Isaac Newton wrote:Here’s my English translation of your work...
εὖγε κράτιστε Ἰσαακ! καλὴ γὰρ ἡ μετάφρασίς σου, ὦ ἄριστε. τοὺς δὲ λόγους μου τελείως συνῆκας σύγε. χαίροις δή, φίλτατε!
Continue with your compositions Marcos . You are able to write Koine and Attic smoothly at different levels of difficulty. Though I personally enjoy your “lower” register compositions, as when you emulate the apostle John’s writing style.
Οὐαὶ οἱ λέγοντες τὸ πονηρὸν καλὸν καὶ τὸ καλὸν πονηρόν, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ σκότος φῶς καὶ τὸ φῶς σκότος, οἱ τιθέντες τὸ πικρὸν γλυκὺ καὶ τὸ γλυκὺ πικρόν

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Barry Hofstetter » Tue Mar 13, 2018 6:33 pm

Markos wrote:
Barry Hofstetter wrote:αὑτὴ δέ ἡ σύνθεσις τῶν γνωστικῶν γραφῶν με ἀναμιμνήσκει...
ἀληθὴ λέγεις, ὦ τᾶν. ἀλλ' ὀλίγον ὁμοίως τοῖς γνωστικοῖς Ἰησοῦς αὐτὸς ἐνίοτε εἶπε.
μᾶλλον δὲ, φίλτατέ μου, οἱ γνωστικοὶ παρεισδύσαντες τὸν Ἰησοῦν μιμῆσθαι πειρῶνται. δοκεῖ μοι τοιούτοις ἐν τῷ μετὰ τὸν Χρίστον ἑαυτοὺς σχηματίζειν κακῶς γενέσθαι.
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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Markos » Tue Mar 13, 2018 7:43 pm

I insert into Galatians 1:18-22 additional details about Paul's first meetings with Peter and James:

18 ῎Επειτα μετὰ ἔτη τρία ἀνῆλθον εἰς Ἱεροσόλυμα ἱστορῆσαι Πέτρον, καὶ ἐπέμεινα πρὸς αὐτὸν ἡμέρας δεκαπέντε· ὁ δὲ Πέτρος εἶπε μοι οὐδὲν περὶ τοῦ τῆς χάριτος εὐαγγελίου. μόνον γὰρ οἶδε Ἰησοῦν τὸν κατὰ σάρκα. τὸ δὲ μυστήριον ὅτι τῇ χάριτί ἐσμεν σεσῳσμένοι διὰ πίστεως οὐκ ἔμαθε οὗτος. καὶ μόνους τοὺς Ἰουδαίους Πέτρος τότε ἐδίδασκεν. μαθὼν δ' οὐδέν ἐκ Πέτρου, ἐξῆλθον. 19 ἕτερον δὲ τῶν ἀποστόλων οὐκ εἶδον εἰ μὴ Ἰάκωβον τὸν ἀδελφὸν τοῦ Κυρίου. ἐμοὶ δ' Ἰάκωβος εἶπε «εἶδον τὸν Κύριον. ὤφθη γάρ μοι μετὰ θάνατον.» ἀλλὰ μυστήριον ἐκ τοῦ ἀδελφοῦ αὐτοῦ οὐκ ἔλαβεν. ἐπιστολὴν δέ τινα ἔγραφε Ἰάκωβος. αὐτοῦ δὲ δεικνύοντος, ἀνέγνων. καὶ αὕτη ἡ ἐπιστολὴ ἐπιστολὴ ἀχύρου ἦν. ἐν γὰρ αὐτῇ τὸ εὐαγγέλιον οὐκ ἦν. μαθὼν οὖν οὐδὲν ἐξ Ἰακώβου, ἀπῆλθον. 20 ἃ δὲ γράφω ὑμῖν, ἰδοὺ ἐνώπιον τοῦ Θεοῦ ὅτι οὐ ψεύδομαι. 21 ἔπειτα ἦλθον εἰς τὰ κλίματα τῆς Συρίας καὶ τῆς Κιλικίας.
Isaac Newton wrote:Continue with your compositions Marcos.
εὐχαριστῶ σοι ἐμὲ παραμυθουμένῳ.
Barry Hofstetter wrote:αὑτὴ δέ ἡ σύνθεσις τῶν γνωστικῶν γραφῶν με ἀναμιμνήσκει...
Markos wrote:ἀληθῆ λέγεις, ὦ τᾶν. ἀλλ' ὀλίγον ὁμοίως τοῖς γνωστικοῖς Ἰησοῦς αὐτὸς ἐνίοτε εἶπε.
Barry Hofstetter wrote:μᾶλλον δὲ, φίλτατέ μου, οἱ γνωστικοὶ παρεισδύσαντες τὸν Ἰησοῦν μιμῆσθαι πειρῶνται. δοκεῖ μοι τοιούτοις ἐν τῷ μετὰ τὸν Χρίστον ἑαυτοὺς σχηματίζειν κακῶς γενέσθαι.
ὡς μάλιστα, ὦ ἄριστε. τὴν γὰρ ἀληθῆ γνῶσιν Ἰησοῦς ἐδίδαξεν. οἱ δὲ τὴν ψευδῆ.
οὐ μανθάνω γράφειν, ἀλλὰ γράφω τοῦ μαθεῖν.

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by ἑκηβόλος » Sat Mar 17, 2018 4:35 pm

Any thoughts about the stylistic features and writing conventions for descriptions of common features
and multi-way comparisons in Greek? I guess it is better to copy familiar the discourse patterns we know (appropriate in English and our other languages), rather than not writing at all. A shaky first step at least.

Image
τί δὲ ἀγαθὸν τῇ πομφόλυγι συνεστώσῃ ἢ κακὸν διαλυθείσῃ;

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Markos » Sat Mar 17, 2018 8:42 pm

ἑκηβόλος wrote:Image
βροχὴν τὸ μὲν διάγραμμα δείκνυσι. τὸ δ' εὐδίαν. τὸ δὲ τοὺς ἀνέμους πνέοντας. τὸ δ' ἔσχατον (ὔστατον?) διάγραμμα νιφάδας δείκνυσι.

τί δέ, ὦ φίλε ἑκηβόλε καὶ φίλτατε Ἰσαακ, βλέπετε ἐν τοῖς διαγράμμασι?
οὐ μανθάνω γράφειν, ἀλλὰ γράφω τοῦ μαθεῖν.

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by ἑκηβόλος » Sun Mar 18, 2018 1:04 am

γέγραπται μὲν, ὦ Μάρκε, τέσσαρα δένδρα καὶ ἓν ἑκατὸν δένδρον τὸ αὐτό ἐστιν. Καὶ ἰδοὺ, εἰστήκει τὸ δένδρον πλάγιον καὶ πολυκλαδές. μικρὸν δὲ ἐγκλίνει εἰς εὐώνυμον ὁ κόρμος τρεῖς ἔχων κλάδους ἐκ δεξιῶν καὶ δύο ἐξ εὐωνύμων.
τί δὲ ἀγαθὸν τῇ πομφόλυγι συνεστώσῃ ἢ κακὸν διαλυθείσῃ;

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by ἑκηβόλος » Sun Mar 18, 2018 4:44 pm

ἀπὸ πόθεν μὲν ὁ τῆς μελίσσης δρόμος;
ἀπὸ τοῦ σίμβλου.

καὶ ποῖ ὁ δρόμος;
ἐπὶ τὰ ἄνθη.

τί ποιεῖ ἐπὶ τοῦ ἄνθους ἡ μέλισσα;
συλλέγει τῇ προνομαίᾳ τὸ γλίσχρον νέκταρ.

τί τὸ τῶν μελισσῶν ἦχος;
βόμβος ἔστιν. βομβοῦσιν γὰρ συνεχὲς αἰ μέλισσαι.

τί τὸ χρῶμα τῆς μελίσσης;
τὰ μὲν πτὲρα αὐτῆς λευκά, τὸ δὲ κέντρον μέλαν, τὸ δὲ σῶμα ξάνον (ἢ πυρρὸν) καὶ μέλαν, ἡ δὲ κεφαλὴ μέλαινα.
τί δὲ ἀγαθὸν τῇ πομφόλυγι συνεστώσῃ ἢ κακὸν διαλυθείσῃ;

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by mwh » Sun Mar 18, 2018 7:23 pm

A model composition, simple but elegant:

ἦρος ἦν ἀρχὴ καὶ πάντα ἤκμαζεν ἄνθη, τὰ ἐν δρυμοῖς, τὰ ἐν λειμῶσι καὶ ὅσα ὄρεια· βόμβος ἦν ἤδη μελιττῶν, ἦχος ὀρνίθων μουσικῶν, σκιρτήματα ποιμνίων ἀρτιγεννήτων· ἄρνες ἐσκίρτων ἐν τοῖς ὄρεσιν, ἐβόμβουν ἐν τοῖς λειμῶσι μέλιτται, ἐν ταῖς λόχμαις κατῇδον ὄρνιθες.

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Markos » Mon Mar 19, 2018 1:00 am

τὸν ἑκηβόλον χαίρειν Μᾶρκος κελεύει.
ἑκηβόλος wrote:Image
μικρὸν δὲ ἐγκλίνει εἰς εὐώνυμον ὁ κόρμος τρεῖς ἔχων κλάδους ἐκ δεξιῶν καὶ δύο ἐξ εὐωνύμων.
τοῦτο βλέπω κἀγώ. μόνον δ' ἓν ἐρώτημα ἔχω. διὰ τί ἐγκλίνει τὸ δένδρον? ἐμέ σε ἐρωτῶντα ἀποκρίθητι, παρακαλῶ.
ἑκηβόλος wrote: τί τὸ χρῶμα τῆς μελίσσης;
...τὸ δὲ κέντρον μέλαν...
πῶς γὰρ οὔ? τὸ δὲ τῆς ἁμαρτίας κέντρον μέλαν ἐστίν. θάνατος γάρ ἐστιν.
ἑκηβόλος wrote:The child is the father of the man. (W.W., 1802)
William Wordsworth wrote:The Child is father of the Man.
Gerard Manley Hopkins wrote:'The child is father to the man.'
How can he be? The words are wild.
Suck any sense from that who can:
ὁ τοῦ ἀνδρὸς πατὴρ ὁ παῖς ἐστιν.

τῷ ἀνδρὶ ὁ παῖς πατήρ.

ἐκ παιδὸς ὁ ἀνήρ γίγνεται.

τὸ τέκνον τίκτει τὸν γέροντα.

τὸ βρέφος τὸ βρέφος ἀνδροῖ.
(ἀνδρόω -- μεταβάλλω εἰς ἄνδρα (Λ.Σ.Κ.)

ὑπὸ τοῦ παιδίου ὁ ἄνθρωπος ἐγεννήθη.

ἄνδρα με ἐποίησεν ὁ υἱός μου.

γέγονα ἀνήρ, λαβὼν τὰ τοῦ νηπίου.


κ.τ.λ...

σύγε νῦν, φίλε ἑκηβόλε, Ἑλληνιστί γράψον τὸ στίχος (ἢ τὴν τοῦ στίχου ἐπίνοιαν)
οὐ μανθάνω γράφειν, ἀλλὰ γράφω τοῦ μαθεῖν.

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by ἑκηβόλος » Mon Mar 19, 2018 1:56 am

mwh wrote:A model composition, simple but elegant:

ἦρος ἦν ἀρχὴ καὶ πάντα ἤκμαζεν ἄνθη, τὰ ἐν δρυμοῖς, τὰ ἐν λειμῶσι καὶ ὅσα ὄρεια· βόμβος ἦν ἤδη μελιττῶν, ἦχος ὀρνίθων μουσικῶν, σκιρτήματα ποιμνίων ἀρτιγεννήτων· ἄρνες ἐσκίρτων ἐν τοῖς ὄρεσιν, ἐβόμβουν ἐν τοῖς λειμῶσι μέλιτται, ἐν ταῖς λόχμαις κατῇδον ὄρνιθες.
A wonderful composition Michael. I have been trying for over two years already to maintain the general-specific phrase order in my compositions, with only measured success. You've accomplished it well by collocating ἀρτιγέννητος with ποίμνιον, and ordering ποίμνιον before ἀρήν here. I have trouble even renembering to think about it during production.

Yes. I agree. To be the rightful heirs of our classical heritage, when we compose, we must embrace creativity, while shunning innovation.


Taking advantage of the difference in time-zones, let me usurp Markos' periphrastic role this once.
ἦρος ἦν ἀρχὴ
ἄρχεται τὸ ἔαρ¹. ἐπιγίγνεται τὸ ἔαρ. παρέρχεται ὁ χειμών.
πάντα ἤκμαζεν ἄνθη
ἅμα τῷ ἔαρι ἐξανθεῖ ἡ γῆ τε καὶ τὰ δένδρα.
μετ' ὀλίγον ἀκμάζοντα ὄζει τὰ ἄνθη.
ἀκμαζόντων πάντων τῶν ἄνθων ἡ γῆ ἡ κεκοσμένη εὐωδεῖ.
τὰ ἐν λειμῶσι
τινά τὰ ἐν λειμῶσι ἄνθη;
λέγεται ὅτι
Hymn 2 to Demeter, 5-9 wrote:παίζουσαν κούρῃσι σὺν Ὠκεανοῦ βαθυκόλποις
ἄνθεά τ᾽ αἰνυμένην, ῥόδα καὶ κρόκον ἠδ᾽ ἴα καλὰ
λειμῶν᾽ ἂμ μαλακὸν καὶ ἀγαλλίδας ἠδ᾽ ὑάκινθον
νάρκισσόν θ᾽, ὃν φῦσε δόλον καλυκώπιδι κούρῃ
Γαῖα Διὸς βουλῇσι χαριζομένη Πολυδέκτῃ,
βόμβος ἦν ἤδη μελιττῶν
Right click and open a new window to hear the sound².
ἦχος ὀρνίθων μουσικῶν
Right click and open a new window to hear the sound³.
σκιρτήματα ποιμνίων ἀρτιγεννήτων
Image
Right-click for an animated image of lambs leaping. (Almost 1MB)⁴.
ἀρτιγέννητα
Image

ἄρνες ἐσκίρτων ἐν τοῖς ὄρεσιν
καὶ νῦν, ὦ φίλε, οἶμαι καὶ τὸν Πᾶνα μετ' αὐτῶν ἀνασκιρτᾷν.

________________
¹from τὸδ ϝέσαρ.
²Public Domain. NPS. Bees in Yosimite Park. Downloaded from http://soundbible.com/971-Bee.html
³Public Domain. NPS. Hermit Thrush, Virginia. Downloaded from http://soundbible.com/923-Hermit-Thrush.html
⁴http://moziru.com/explore/Lamb%20clipart%20animated%20gif/#go_post_3277_lamb-clipart-animated-gif-1.gif
⁵https://www.pinterest.com/somosdlana/baby-sheep-dlana/
Last edited by ἑκηβόλος on Mon Mar 19, 2018 9:28 am, edited 3 times in total.
τί δὲ ἀγαθὸν τῇ πομφόλυγι συνεστώσῃ ἢ κακὸν διαλυθείσῃ;

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by ἑκηβόλος » Mon Mar 19, 2018 9:15 am

Markos wrote:τὸν ἑκηβόλον χαίρειν Μᾶρκος κελεύει.
ἑκηβόλος wrote:Image
μικρὸν δὲ ἐγκλίνει εἰς εὐώνυμον ὁ κόρμος τρεῖς ἔχων κλάδους ἐκ δεξιῶν καὶ δύο ἐξ εὐωνύμων.
τοῦτο βλέπω κἀγώ. μόνον δ' ἓν ἐρώτημα ἔχω. διὰ τί ἐγκλίνει τὸ δένδρον? ἐμέ σε ἐρωτῶντα ἀποκρίθητι, παρακαλῶ.
περὶ δὲ τούτου τοῦ δένδρου οὐκ οἶδα, ἀλλὰ γιγνώσκω ὅτι τόδε τὸ δένδρον τὸ ἐν τῷ φωτογραφήματι βεβαρημένον ἀπὸ τῆς χιόνος καὶ ῥίζαν οὐκ ἔχον ἔπεσεν χαμαὶ ἐπὶ τῆς τρίβου.

Image
τί δὲ ἀγαθὸν τῇ πομφόλυγι συνεστώσῃ ἢ κακὸν διαλυθείσῃ;

Markos
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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Markos » Tue Mar 20, 2018 3:51 pm

I insert between Mark 9:4 and 9:5 some details about what was discussed at the Transfiguration.

4 καὶ ὤφθη αὐτοῖς Ἠλίας σὺν Μωϋσῇ, καὶ ἦσαν συλλαλοῦντες τῷ Ἰησοῦ. ὁ δ' Ἠλίας εἶπε «Κύριε, περὶ σοῦ ἡμεῖς ἐμαρτύρησαν πάντες οἱ προφήται. ἐπεθυμήσαμεν γὰρ παρακύψαι σε. καί σε εἴδομεν καὶ τὴν δόξαν σου.» καὶ ἀποκριθεὶς Ἰησοῦς λέγει αὐτῷ «μακάριος εἶ συ, ἰδών με καὶ τὴν δόξαν μου. καὶ πάλιν μετὰ ταῦτα ὄψῃ με. ἐπὶ γὰρ ἐσχάτων τῶν ἡμερῶν σὺ ἔσῃ εἷς τῶν δύο μαρτύρων μου.» καὶ Ἠλίας θαυμάζων ἐσίγησε. ὁ δὲ Μωϋσῆς λέγει «ἐγὼ μὲν τὸν νόμον ἔδωκα. σὺ δέ, ὦ διδάσκαλε, χάριν καὶ ἀλήθειαν δίδως τοῖς ἐν σοι πιστεύουσιν.» ὁ δ' Ἰησοῦς τῷ Μωϋσῇ λέγει «καλῶς λέγεις. τὸ γὰρ τοῦ νόμου τέλος εἰμί. καὶ σύγε ὁ ἄλλος μαρτύς μου ὑπάρξεις ἐπ' ἐσχάτων τῶν ἡμερῶν» καὶ ἀπορῶν, ἐφιμώθη Μωϋσῆς. ὁ δὲ Πέτρος εἶπε τῷ Ἰησοῦ «Κύριε, ἆρα οὗτοι οἱ ἄνθρωποι σκηνώσουσι μεθ' ἡμῶν? θέλω γὰρ αὐτοὺς ὧδε μένειν.» καὶ ἀποκριθεὶς Ἰησοῦς λέγει τῷ Πέτρῳ «οὗτοι οὐ σκηνώσουσιν οὐδὲ μεθ' ἡμῶν μενοῦσιν. δεῖ γὰρ τούτους ἀποθανεῖν διά με. καὶ σύ, Πέτρε, τὸ σκήνωμά σου ἀποθήσεις ὑπέρ μου.» καὶ ταῦτα ἀκούσας Πέτρος λίαν ἐφοβεῖτο. 5 καὶ ἀποκριθεὶς ὁ Πέτρος λέγει τῷ ᾿Ιησοῦ· ῥαββί, καλόν ἐστιν ἡμᾶς ὧδε εἶναι· καὶ ποιήσωμεν σκηνὰς τρεῖς, σοὶ μίαν καὶ Μωσεῖ μίαν καὶ ᾿Ηλίᾳ μίαν.
ἑκηβόλος wrote:...τόδε τὸ δένδρον τὸ ἐν τῷ φωτογραφήματι βεβαρημένον ἀπὸ τῆς χιόνος καὶ ῥίζαν οὐκ ἔχον ἔπεσεν χαμαὶ ἐπὶ τῆς τρίβου.

Image
κρεῖσσον ἐπὶ τῆς τρίβου ἢ ἐπὶ τῆς οἰκίας.
Longus, Daphnis & Chole, 1:9 wrote:ἦρος ἦν ἀρχὴ καὶ πάντα ἤκμαζεν ἄνθη...
http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/tex ... hapter%3D9
ἑκηβόλος wrote:ἄρχεται τὸ ἔαρ. ἐπιγίγνεται τὸ ἔαρ. παρέρχεται ὁ χειμών...
ἅμα τῷ ἔαρι ἐξανθεῖ ἡ γῆ τε καὶ τὰ δένδρα.
μετ' ὀλίγον ἀκμάζοντα ὄζει τὰ ἄνθη.
ἀκμαζόντων πάντων τῶν ἄνθων ἡ γῆ ἡ κεκοσμένη εὐωδεῖ.
φιλῶ τὴν παράφρασίν σου.

ἡ ἐαρινὴ ὥρα ἤγγικεν ὥστε τὰ ἄνθη ἐφάνη.
ἑκηβόλος wrote:
ἦχος ὀρνίθων μουσικῶν
Right click and open a new window to hear the sound³.
σκιρτήματα ποιμνίων ἀρτιγεννήτων
Image
Right-click for an animated image of lambs leaping. (Almost 1MB)⁴.
καλῶς τὰ τοῦ Direct Method πεποίηκας. εὐχαριστῶ οὖν σοι.
Last edited by Markos on Tue Mar 20, 2018 11:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
οὐ μανθάνω γράφειν, ἀλλὰ γράφω τοῦ μαθεῖν.

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by mwh » Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:12 pm

I wouldn’t have called it a model composition if it were my own! I posted it in hopes of encouraging the cultivation of a sense of style and the appreciation of pleasurable Greek. It’s actually not all that hard to write in the “sweet” style that Longus affects. The passage I posted, the opening of a rather extreme set piece, is quite ruined by dismembering it and attaching visual images to its detached components. It has to be read as a whole, and its appeal lies largely in the patterning of its words and phrases.

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by Markos » Wed Mar 21, 2018 9:29 pm

ἑκηβόλος wrote:The child is the father of the man. (W.W., 1802)
γενέτορα γέννημα γεννᾷ.

ὁ τεκνοποιούμενος αὐτὸς τεκνοποιήσει τὸν αὐτὸν τεκνοποιήσαντα.
οὐ μανθάνω γράφειν, ἀλλὰ γράφω τοῦ μαθεῖν.

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by ἑκηβόλος » Sat Mar 24, 2018 4:24 pm

ὁ Angoorie αἰγιαλὸς εὑρίσκεται ἐγγὺς τῆς παιδικῆς οἰκίας μου.Image

τί βλέπετε, ὦ φίλοι, ἐν τῷ φωτογραφήματι;
τί δὲ ἀγαθὸν τῇ πομφόλυγι συνεστώσῃ ἢ κακὸν διαλυθείσῃ;

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Re: Simple, GNT type sentences composed in Koine

Post by ἑκηβόλος » Sat Mar 24, 2018 5:16 pm

Markos wrote:
ἑκηβόλος wrote:...τόδε τὸ δένδρον τὸ ἐν τῷ φωτογραφήματι βεβαρημένον ἀπὸ τῆς χιόνος καὶ ῥίζαν οὐκ ἔχον ἔπεσεν χαμαὶ ἐπὶ τῆς τρίβου.

Image
κρεῖσσον ἐπὶ τῆς τρίβου ἢ ἐπὶ τῆς οἰκίας.
ἀποκεκοφθέντων τῶν πρὸς τὰς οἰκίας κλάδων, ἀνετράπετο εἰς τὰς πρασιὰς τὸ δένδρον.
τί δὲ ἀγαθὸν τῇ πομφόλυγι συνεστώσῃ ἢ κακὸν διαλυθείσῃ;

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