Search found 250 matches

by Victor
Sun Jan 11, 2015 5:55 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: id est ante vīgintī diēs - Famlia Romana XXXIII Lines 49–50
Replies: 3
Views: 1633

Re: id est ante vīgintī diēs - Famlia Romana XXXIII Lines 49

[I'm having trouble with the last clause, id est ante vīgintī diēs . My literal rendering doesn't seem to fit. He's complaining about the slow speed of the tabellarius, so shouldn't it be something like, "That's a whole twenty days!" The Latin just says "That's twenty days ago". Commentary on how e...
by Victor
Sun Jan 11, 2015 4:27 pm
Forum: Civilization and Culture of the Greeks and Romans
Topic: differences between spoken and written Ancient Greek
Replies: 8
Views: 5641

Re: differences between spoken and written Ancient Greek

When you emphasize that the cultural elite of Athens was in no way systemized it doesn't seem to me so alien from the cultual elite of modern western countries such as Britain. The biggest divergence is the way Greek tradgedy seems to have been both high art and mass entertainment. I don't see any ...
by Victor
Thu Jan 08, 2015 3:23 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Vowel lengthening
Replies: 1
Views: 1215

Re: Vowel lengthening

Reading Califf's Latin Meter and Verse Composition and surprised by the talk of 'lengthened vowels': surely it is the syllable and not the vowel that is long in virtue of the vowel's position? Is this merely impræcicely expressed or am I missing something? Quotation of the passage in question would...
by Victor
Wed Jan 07, 2015 3:32 am
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: What is the Grammar-Translation method?
Replies: 101
Views: 34327

Re: What is the Grammar-Translation method?

Though those of you who feel traditional methods need defending have explained that traditional methods are not as narrow as its critics allege I am still unclear as to exactly what you are defending. Probably defending their faith in a learning approach that has suited them and many they know admi...
by Victor
Tue Jan 06, 2015 3:36 pm
Forum: Koine and Biblical and Medieval Greek
Topic: Revelation 3:10: Roman Empire or Whole World?
Replies: 7
Views: 5506

Re: Revelation 3:10: Roman Empire or Whole World?

I agree on the first point, the question would be, though, whether the incidents are of a global character (even though some are not affected)? Is there a way of limiting "ἐπὶ τῆς γῆ" to certain space boundaries without qualifiers such as in Mt 2:20: "πορεύου εἰς γῆν Ἰσραήλ"? If γῆ without a qualif...
by Victor
Fri Jan 02, 2015 8:19 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Question from Orberg LLPSI Cap XLIII
Replies: 2
Views: 1190

Re: Question from Orberg LLPSI Cap XLIII

I suspect uter is chiefly what threw you off.
regem Romanum deos facere testes means ..."that the Roman king makes the gods witnesses..."
uter means "which (of two)"; uter prius populus means "which nation first".
ut begins a purpose clause.
by Victor
Thu Jan 01, 2015 2:47 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: BLD 1st year Latin, what for 2nd year?
Replies: 8
Views: 2822

Re: BLD 1st year Latin, what for 2nd year?

Like Qimmik, for my second year I'd find real Latin a more tantalising prospect than the simplified Latin of a coursebook. Two excellent introductions to real Latin are the works of Kennedy and Davis: Two Centuries of Roman Prose and Two Centuries of Roman Poetry , published by Macmillan. Being in m...
by Victor
Sat Dec 20, 2014 10:31 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: What is the Grammar-Translation method?
Replies: 101
Views: 34327

Re: What is the Grammar-Translation method?

And is it wrong to say that all people of average intelligence can learn a second language? ...I honestly admire those who can make the switch from analysis to synthesis, from grammatical explanations to comprehension. I just don't think it works for typical language learners. It sounds like you're...
by Victor
Sat Dec 06, 2014 12:40 am
Forum: Latin For Beginners by D'Ooge
Topic: Altera vs. Alius
Replies: 4
Views: 5025

Re: Altera vs. Alius

Thanks, I don't know how I missed that. The book is clearly in the wrong, and I wasn't being very helpful. If, on the other hand, the book had said "One boy likes chickens, the next horses", then perhaps either alter or alius would have been OK, since "the next" can leave it open, I think, whether t...
by Victor
Thu Dec 04, 2014 11:44 pm
Forum: Latin For Beginners by D'Ooge
Topic: Altera vs. Alius
Replies: 4
Views: 5025

Re: Altera vs. Alius

kingbenlucas wrote: I have noted that alius is used with several items and alter with two (108.). But in this instance it is between two! Is my answer wrong?
alius...alius is not necessarily out of place here.
Think of it this way: alius...alius means "one...another"; alter...alter means "one...the other".
by Victor
Sun Nov 30, 2014 11:56 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: History of Classical Languages Pedagogy
Replies: 10
Views: 5276

Re: History of Classical Languages Pedagogy

Damoetas wrote:I think we still use a lot of pre-WWII language pedagogy, and this is not necessarily a good thing!
What aspects of it make you say using it is not a good thing?
by Victor
Sun Nov 30, 2014 6:57 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: nec vērō quidquam - Familia Romana - XXXII Lines 125-126
Replies: 2
Views: 1474

Re: nec vērō quidquam - Familia Romana - XXXII Lines 125-126

In Latin, it's never et numquam or et nullus , as we would expect in English. You do see these quite often actually. It sounds like you're interpreting guidance from a prose composition manual as a hard and fast rule. The way some of them occasionally lay down the law makes that a forgivable mistake.
by Victor
Sun Nov 30, 2014 6:40 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Why is it that dictionaries don't have entries
Replies: 4
Views: 1887

Re: Why is it that dictionaries don't have entries

I have no idea how irregular perfect forms were looked up before Google! You either made an educated guess, or consulted an alphabetical list of irregular verbs (showing their principal parts), or made sure you were reasonably well acquainted with that list to begin with - in ascending order of des...
by Victor
Tue Nov 25, 2014 5:41 pm
Forum: Wheelock's Latin
Topic: workbook ch. 34 English to latin translation exercise
Replies: 2
Views: 5044

Re: workbook ch. 34 English to latin translation exercise

sentence: about to die, he dared to speak freely--Moriturus libere loqui/dicere ausus est according to the answer key but I said moriturus esse......? what am I missing here? The answer to your question is in the English translation you've quoted. "About to die" is moriturus; moriturus esse would b...
by Victor
Tue Nov 04, 2014 1:24 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Perversi difficile corriguntur Ecclesiastes 1:15
Replies: 4
Views: 2358

Re: Perversi difficile corriguntur Ecclesiastes 1:15

which by the way has a unique feature: it underlines the main syllables to stress in order to read aloud intelligently. Int That clearly doesn't apply to the dictionary as a whole. The underlinings that there are certainly seem to indicate stressed syllables, but many of the entries have no underli...
by Victor
Tue Oct 28, 2014 2:14 am
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Poll: When did you first begin serious study of Greek
Replies: 19
Views: 11607

Re: Poll: When did you first begin serious study of Greek

Being a Chinese native myself, it is quite difficult for laymen to recognize all characters in a given text with perfect precision, but discerning the meaning of the sentences as a whole is not often as difficult. As Chinese is an analytical language, it is fairly easy to make an educated guess abo...
by Victor
Tue Oct 28, 2014 1:00 am
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Poll: When did you first begin serious study of Greek
Replies: 19
Views: 11607

Re: Poll: When did you first begin serious study of Greek

A few years later I started learning Chinese, and it forced me to learn some very disciplined study techniques both to master the writing system and to hear and reproduce the tone distinctions. What level of recall has your mastery of the writing system given you? Are you saying that if someone rea...
by Victor
Fri Oct 17, 2014 5:41 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: δεῖ + present participle
Replies: 1
Views: 1192

Re: δεῖ + present participle

Why are σῴζουσάν and οὖσαν present participles? I would have expected them to be infinitives, like οἰκεῖν. The participles specify the two broad duties that, according to the speaker, managing a home well consists in: ..."she needs to manage the home well, taking care of matters indoors, and being ...
by Victor
Sun Oct 12, 2014 1:48 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: More Medieval/Scholastic Latin
Replies: 9
Views: 4300

Re: More Medieval/Scholastic Latin

Vladimir wrote:And why is the star is said to be shining "ut solis radium" and not "radius"?
Presumably so that the final syllable of the line harmonises with that of the next. Neuters were generally lost, not gained, as Latin evolved towards Romance.
by Victor
Sun Oct 12, 2014 1:34 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Help finding a new word
Replies: 11
Views: 4337

Re: Help finding a new word

The full controversy over telegram/telegrapheme can be found here: http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=XSlcAAAAQAAJ&printsec=frontcover&source=gbs_ge_summary_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q&f=false - assuming Google lets you access it. I think arguments over how many angels could fit on a pin-head were less of a...
by Victor
Sun Oct 12, 2014 12:11 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: More Medieval/Scholastic Latin
Replies: 9
Views: 4300

Re: More Medieval/Scholastic Latin

Vladimir wrote:For example, what does serrato mean?
One explanation is that it's Serrato (with a capital S). Taken with monte it's a reference to Monte Serrato or Montserrat, the home of Santa María de Montserrat Abbey.
by Victor
Sun Oct 05, 2014 9:26 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: "Quote ... end quote" in Latin?
Replies: 3
Views: 2066

Re: "Quote ... end quote" in Latin?

In English, when we read something out loud, we often signal a quoted passage by saying "quote ... end quote." Perhaps this is more prevalent in America than in the UK. I've never felt the need to use "quote...unquote", nor its more graphic cousin the two index fingers held parallel and wiggled up ...
by Victor
Wed Sep 10, 2014 8:49 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Found: Latin-(Greek)-English index of plants and trees
Replies: 3
Views: 1983

Re: Found: Latin-(Greek)-English index of plants and trees

Greetings, I can't speak to its accuracy, but it looks useful. (I hope I'm not the only one who struggles to no end with plant names!) Well done and thanks! I suspect from entries such as "Arbor Judae - Judas his tree " (for Judas' tree ) that the index is of some age. Everyone struggles with plant...
by Victor
Sun Sep 07, 2014 11:02 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: coitu femineo
Replies: 29
Views: 11257

Re: coitu femineo

Paul Derouda wrote:Well, couldn't the point of ἀμφότεροι be specifically that "both parties have done a terrible deed"
Yes, that's the point. Did I ever imply otherwise? I can't see where, if I did.
by Victor
Sun Sep 07, 2014 6:00 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: coitu femineo
Replies: 29
Views: 11257

Re: coitu femineo

Well, the way I see it, whether anything specific is intended depends on the exact meaning of κοίτη γυναικός (I'm only commenting the Greek version). I don't see why it couldn't mean "intercourse of a woman", "intercourse like a woman", and thus be an explicit statement that the passive role is int...
by Victor
Sat Sep 06, 2014 3:49 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: coitu femineo
Replies: 29
Views: 11257

Re: coitu femineo

As it is, I see nothing in either the Hebrew, Greek LXX, or Latin which indicates either active or passive in terms of the activity. I would read it as a general statement that would encompass both. This must be right. Whilst subsequent discussions about active and passive roles may have been inter...
by Victor
Mon Sep 01, 2014 5:06 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: How to pronounce "energicus"?
Replies: 8
Views: 3397

Re: How to pronounce "energicus"?

You are right, on the other hand: the derivation of the magicus adjective from magīa was done here already in Greek in μαγικός . With energīcus/energicus we derive it purely in a Latin environment (though you could theoretically think of the derivation here happening through Greek too, analogically...
by Victor
Sun Aug 31, 2014 11:52 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: How to pronounce "energicus"?
Replies: 8
Views: 3397

Re: How to pronounce "energicus"?

Godmy wrote:The "ī" is long (because of energīa from ἐνέργεια ), so it must carry the accent.
The trouble is the i is not necessarily long in energicus just because the i of energia is long.
What happens with magia/magicus?
by Victor
Sun Aug 31, 2014 1:47 am
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: κατασοφιστεύω vs. κατασοφίζομαι in Comenius
Replies: 5
Views: 2011

Re: κατασοφιστεύω vs. κατασοφίζομαι in Comenius

Hello, I have a question about a passage in a Latin-Greek edition of the Janua Linguarum by Comenius. (See this thread if you'd like it in proofreading-in-progress transcribed form. Many thanks to bedwere for his ongoing proofreading of the Greek.) 918. Φιλιωθείς τινι ἀκάκως, ἀπλάστως, ἀδόλως αὐτῷ ...
by Victor
Thu Aug 28, 2014 7:54 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Demosthenes' De Corona in 10 weeks
Replies: 59
Views: 31819

Re: Demosthenes' De Corona in 10 weeks

(as long as you take Demosthenes' distortions and outright lies with more than a grain of salt). And Yunis is very good on alerting the reader to Demosthenes' rhetoric--his framing of the case, his tricks, his evasions and his outright lies. It's hard to tell how much disapproval of Demosthenes' be...
by Victor
Sun Aug 24, 2014 6:53 pm
Forum: Koine and Biblical and Medieval Greek
Topic: Converting a noun into an adjective ?
Replies: 20
Views: 13193

Re: Converting a noun into an adjective ?

But this leads either to linguistic nonsense or else to Modalism. Certainly, Trinitarianism is discounted by such an understanding, and such a translation. You don't have to take it from me of course. I'm afraid its tendency to nonesense is entirely a product of the collective failure of theists to...
by Victor
Sun Aug 24, 2014 2:20 pm
Forum: Koine and Biblical and Medieval Greek
Topic: Converting a noun into an adjective ?
Replies: 20
Views: 13193

Re: Converting a noun into an adjective ?

Isaac Newton wrote: What can "god" (with a small "G") possibly mean if not "a god" or "a divine thing" ?
"God", as already stated:
mwh wrote:What he actually says is simply “god” (“God” if you prefer).
by Victor
Fri Aug 15, 2014 7:44 pm
Forum: Open Board
Topic: Salve
Replies: 3
Views: 2218

Re: Salve

Well, now I have retired and I have quite a few texts and textbooks on Greek and am wading through it. However, I would like to see a Greek-Latin Lexicon, possibly the one by Chrestos Adamantios (1908) added to the textkit resources. I look forward to the forum. Thanks, everyone. Colby One other Gk...
by Victor
Fri Jul 25, 2014 11:58 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Materials for reading Homer in Greek
Replies: 36
Views: 26387

Re: Materials for reading Homer in Greek

BenThumb wrote:Hi Scribo, where can I get a copy of Chantraine's book? I can't find it on Amazon or eBay. I'm in the UK if that helps. Thanks.
Chantraine's Grammaire Homérique is available through Amazon UK, but it's probably cheaper to get 2nd hand copies through Abebooks.
by Victor
Fri Jul 25, 2014 6:59 pm
Forum: Koine and Biblical and Medieval Greek
Topic: Omitting verbs in Greek sentences
Replies: 12
Views: 7527

Re: Omitting verbs in Greek sentences

Victor, To reiterate, anything can be omitted. Possibly you intended to address Vladimir, rather than me? [ I just did a search on τὸ ἐκ τοῦ πατρὸς ἐκπορευόμενον and found 28 passages in the church fathers, Epiphanius, Gregorius Nazianzenus, Athanasius, Basilius, Joannes Chrysostomus, Cyrillus, Joa...
by Victor
Fri Jul 25, 2014 6:49 pm
Forum: Civilization and Culture of the Greeks and Romans
Topic: Oidipous Tyrranos (Sophokleous)
Replies: 4
Views: 3905

Re: Oidipous Tyrranos (Sophokleous)

what do you mean by pregnant with irony specifically, what did you have in mind? irony is a loaded word, so i'm curious as to what you meant. Loadedness is what irony is all about, and a large part of the dramatic impact of O.T. is in its irony. So I don't find it curious at all that Scribo says O....
by Victor
Thu Jul 24, 2014 4:56 pm
Forum: Koine and Biblical and Medieval Greek
Topic: Omitting verbs in Greek sentences
Replies: 12
Views: 7527

Re: Omitting verbs in Greek sentences

No, I can't, you may be right. But how would you translae in Greek a sentence like this: Confitemur etiam Spiritum vivum et sanctum, Paracletum vivum, qui ex Patre et Filio ? The Latin you quote is apparently a translation from the Syriac. Possibly Syriac syntax, or merely a desire for abbreviation...
by Victor
Thu Jul 24, 2014 1:15 am
Forum: Koine and Biblical and Medieval Greek
Topic: Omitting verbs in Greek sentences
Replies: 12
Views: 7527

Re: Omitting verbs in Greek sentences

If the verb of a Greek phrase is omitted, does it necessarily mean that it is the verb εἰμί? E.g., in some Creeds or in some works by Fathers of the Church sometimes we can see expressions like this: πιστεύομεν εἰς τὸ Πνεύμα τὸ Ἅγιον ὃ ἐκ τοῦ Πατρὸς καὶ τοῦ Υἱοῦ or something of this kind. So should...
by Victor
Mon Jul 21, 2014 10:49 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Greek Grammars
Replies: 20
Views: 9031

Re: Greek Grammars

One of the things that I don't like about the traditional grammar translation model is that the text books start you with memorization of paradigms. I think that is backwards. One of the things I like about the traditional approach is that it does start you off with serried ranks of paradigms. It's...
by Victor
Thu Jul 10, 2014 1:01 am
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Iliad 9, 225-227
Replies: 50
Views: 27035

Re: Iliad 9, 225-227

And you have to remember Dr. Johnson's words about the dancing dog (actually, he said that a female preacher is like a dancing dog--but of course I can't say that today): the wonder is not that it's done well, but that it's done at all. I think that captures the essence of it, yes; a fairground att...