Search found 196 matches

by Ulpianus
Thu Apr 13, 2006 12:39 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Mea culpa! A call to confession.
Replies: 27
Views: 9734

Mea culpa! A call to confession.

Anyone reading this board knows that this forum is frequented by a number of talented people ... In the interests of balance, and to encourage those who are starting out, I thought it might be interesting if some of the more experienced were willing to admit their persistent faults. Who knows, newer...
by Ulpianus
Wed Apr 12, 2006 10:26 pm
Forum: Open Board
Topic: Whats easier to learn?
Replies: 85
Views: 26634

Good luck.
by Ulpianus
Wed Apr 12, 2006 10:21 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Register Your Vote for a Lingua Latina Forum - Anyone?
Replies: 11
Views: 3124

I've voted no. In case that seems churlish, I think I should explain my vote. It's absolutely not intended as an attack on Latina Lingua , which I know next-to-nothing about, except its general method, which like every other method has its good and not so good points. There's really not that much tr...
by Ulpianus
Wed Apr 12, 2006 11:47 am
Forum: Open Board
Topic: Whats easier to learn?
Replies: 85
Views: 26634

13 certainly doesn't matter. It's not early to start learning at all. People here used to start Latin at 8, Greek at 11. I think John Stuart Mill could read Greek fluently by the age of 7 or something terrifying. Hell, people used to be translating Latin poetry into Greek poetry at 16! But ... 13 ca...
by Ulpianus
Tue Apr 11, 2006 4:13 pm
Forum: Open Board
Topic: Whats easier to learn?
Replies: 85
Views: 26634

I would say then, unless you dislike it strongly, stick with "Latin for Beginners". At least for a bit. It's free. You will get help here with it. You won't need a dictionary for a bit. When you do need one, a tiny pocket dictionary will be quite adequate at first: the Oxford is fine. And, as a refe...
by Ulpianus
Tue Apr 11, 2006 4:02 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Dubitantum
Replies: 6
Views: 1511

Lucus Eques wrote:That would be "dubitantium"
O, yes, I suppose it probably would be, unless in poetry. Sorry. Well we'll have to guess whether this is (a) typo for dubitandum, (b) typo for dubitantium or (c) dubitantum and poetic. OP presumably knows, and he's got every possible answer now.
by Ulpianus
Tue Apr 11, 2006 1:51 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Dubitantum
Replies: 6
Views: 1511

Surely, if original post correct, dubitantum: from dubitans, present participle of dubito, genitive plural, not gerund/gerundive: "of those hesitating".
by Ulpianus
Tue Apr 11, 2006 1:13 pm
Forum: Open Board
Topic: Whats easier to learn?
Replies: 85
Views: 26634

Sorry, while I was writing that (too long) reply, you posted to say you had decided on Latin, and looking for book recommendations. A lot depends on what you like, and your background. You will get more useful recommendations if people know: What experience of learning languages in general do you ha...
by Ulpianus
Tue Apr 11, 2006 1:02 pm
Forum: Open Board
Topic: Whats easier to learn?
Replies: 85
Views: 26634

I would say that, with a possible exception given below, the case for trying Latin first is very strong. 1. Latin is easier at first. This is not just because its alphabet is familiar. There are other things about Latin that are easier, too, at least initially, including, e.g., the verbal system, ac...
by Ulpianus
Wed Jan 19, 2005 10:58 pm
Forum: Open Board
Topic: The Death of Grammar
Replies: 26
Views: 5299

Well ... if the research shows that teaching grammar formally does not improve writing skills, one has surely got to take that seriously. And it is not obviously true that one really needs to understand grammar systematically in order to use language expressively and well. If one adds in the additio...
by Ulpianus
Wed Jan 19, 2005 10:39 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: help with aeneid 3 translation.
Replies: 4
Views: 1465

On impositis dapibus I agree (if I may presume to do so) with Pharr. I think the lines are puzzling because it's hard to see the connections between what is said. I'd say that was because they're not there: V. picks up individual details to suggest an overall scene of activity: "In the middle of the...
by Ulpianus
Tue Jan 18, 2005 2:36 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Vulgate Usage Question
Replies: 16
Views: 3849

As others have pointed out, autem is a connective implying contrast. In this case it makes sense in the context of the previous verse: "in propria venit et sui eum non receperunt." The people one might have expected to accept him did not accept him, but to those who did ... I don't believe there was...
by Ulpianus
Sun Oct 03, 2004 9:42 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Bello Gallico
Replies: 24
Views: 6492

Punctuation is largely,* I think, editorial. Caesar would have written (actually probably dictated) to produce a text written entirely in capitals, without punctuation, and without space between words. DUMINHISLOCISCAESARNAVIUMPARANDUMCAUSAMORATUREXMAGNA PARTEMORINORUMADEUMLEGATIVENERUNTQUISEDESUPER...
by Ulpianus
Tue Sep 28, 2004 12:10 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Humming hedges (or Virgil's Eclogues I)
Replies: 9
Views: 2804

Sorry, I wasn't clear. I meant that florem in the phrase saepes ... salicti is acc.sg. Salicti is certainly gen.sg. "of the willow-grove".
by Ulpianus
Mon Sep 27, 2004 11:18 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Humming hedges (or Virgil's Eclogues I)
Replies: 9
Views: 2804

I think B is right saepes is singular : saepes, saepis (3rd declension). The e is long which fits the metre. Florem in saepes ... salicti is accusative singular -- it is the direct object of depasco; the bees are the indirect object : having fed the flower or the willow grove to the Hyblaen bees. (I...
by Ulpianus
Mon Sep 27, 2004 10:12 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Catullus II
Replies: 5
Views: 2221

I believe the MS text is corrupt and is generally corrected, including the reversal of lines 7 and 8 which you have here.* The corruption continues thereafter, with what is generally thought to be a gap in the manuscript after 8 and before 9. Other texts do not reverse the lines, but most make other...
by Ulpianus
Wed Jun 02, 2004 9:12 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: subjunctive perfect vowel lengths
Replies: 3
Views: 1610

Both forms can be found (i.e. both long and short i). A+G suggest that the original form was long-i, but that short i became common precisely because of assimilation to the fut. perf.

Grammars seem to vary: some mark the i long, some leave it short, and some mark it as being either long or short.
by Ulpianus
Wed Apr 14, 2004 7:30 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: latin translations to english
Replies: 8
Views: 3822

Yes, I see. Like -ize and -ise in English. Variant spellings, each equally "acceptable".
by Ulpianus
Wed Apr 14, 2004 11:21 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: latin translations to english
Replies: 8
Views: 3822

there is no meaningful palaeographical distinction between inp- and imp-. Thanks, that's interesting. I would have imaginedthat there was a clear paleographical distinction between inp and imp (they are not "the same", in the sense that, say, uncial "A" is the same as miniscule "a" though they look...
by Ulpianus
Wed Apr 14, 2004 6:36 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: latin translations to english
Replies: 8
Views: 3822

According to Perseus in, but I don't have the text in print, so I can't cross-check it. Odd I agree.
by Ulpianus
Tue Apr 13, 2004 9:26 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: latin translations to english
Replies: 8
Views: 3822

It's Lk 1:37 (more or less) in English: an explanation of how the barren Elizabeth has become pregnant. The Vulgate has quia non erit inpossibile apud Deum omne verbum , which seems at first sight an odd use of verbum but is very close to the Greek ὅτι οὐκ ἀδυνατήσει παρὰ τοῦ θεοῦ πᾶν ῥῆμα. . Perhap...
by Ulpianus
Wed Apr 07, 2004 7:50 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: re: cases combining
Replies: 3
Views: 1674

Why should it only be nominatives that precede genitives? So far as I know, there is no (grammatical) limit on the case or number of the noun to which a genitive may, as it were, attach. Consider the position in English: 1. Harold's cat scared me. (cat = subj = nom) 2. I scared harold's cat. (cat = ...
by Ulpianus
Mon Apr 05, 2004 7:06 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: declension case order...
Replies: 13
Views: 5626

It's a curse, isn't it. In England we use the same order as the French one you list (NVAGDA). It was introduced here in the late nineteenth century. It does actually have some advantages, because the similarity of NVA in many declensions makes for patterns that are easier to memorise. And some disad...
by Ulpianus
Fri Apr 02, 2004 12:16 am
Forum: Open Board
Topic: The sound of Greek
Replies: 13
Views: 3511

Trying to avoid the flames ... Something about the Erasmic phonology of the Hellenic language. He claims that "?" sounds as "ee" and "?" sounds as "oo". To me that sounds stupid. Based on the speaking I think it is the dilects that has changed the H to E or the opposite. Also, the word ????? based o...
by Ulpianus
Thu Apr 01, 2004 11:40 pm
Forum: Open Board
Topic: Which books matter most to you?
Replies: 12
Views: 2739

Which books matter most to you?

Benissimus recently established just how many books we all have. I have a slightly different question: Of your many books, which ones do you like or need most? If you had to strip your library down to just three books, which ones would you keep, and why? My choices: Oxford Latin Dictionary A simply ...
by Ulpianus
Thu Apr 01, 2004 10:30 pm
Forum: Wheelock's Latin
Topic: Loci Antiqui
Replies: 3
Views: 7366

I'll give you a few pointers to the second one, and see if you can put them together: (1) fui = 1st person not third (2) venit ad me salutandum filius amici cuiusdam "the son of a certain friend came to pay his respects to me" filius is the subject (3) adduxerat = pluperfect (had brought) (4) you ha...
by Ulpianus
Thu Apr 01, 2004 10:05 pm
Forum: Wheelock's Latin
Topic: Loci Antiqui
Replies: 3
Views: 7366

Pretty good: but some of the translations aren't really making sense -- which is usually a sign something is wrong. I'll do the first one. Passage 1 starts correctly. Then text reads "Quemadmodum," inquis, "in urbe potuisti?" Circenses erant quo genere spectaculi ne levissime quidem teneor. Nihil no...
by Ulpianus
Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:12 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: How much vocabulary does one need?
Replies: 5
Views: 2477

There's some discussion in this thread, including a link I posted to an interesting list of the "most important" words. The bottom line seems to be: about 1500 words or so. Of course, you can start reading Latin much sooner. Each author tends to have his favourite vocabulary.
by Ulpianus
Wed Mar 31, 2004 11:17 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: ablative help, please?
Replies: 5
Views: 2289

I think I agree with Phil. As I understand it: (1) Ablative with a or ab = ablative of agent. The agent is always either a person or a personified thing. (2) Ablative used to express the instrument or means by which something occurs. No preposition. Generally of things, rather than people, though oc...
by Ulpianus
Tue Mar 30, 2004 10:15 pm
Forum: Wheelock's Latin
Topic: loci antiqui #7
Replies: 7
Views: 8346

Not such an odd meaning: "res repetere" is also idiomatic: to demand satisfaction/restoration of wrongly acquired property from a foreign power: OLD 9 (noting: a formal ultimatum). Perhaps "satisfaction" is too loose "restitution having been formally demanded" or something of that sort might be bett...
by Ulpianus
Tue Mar 30, 2004 9:30 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: I think, therefore I am dangerous
Replies: 5
Views: 4721

Could you live with "tyrant" as a one word encapsulation of what you have in mind?

cogito ergo tyranni infestus sum

(or, for a more home-grown Roman version: dictatori).
by Ulpianus
Tue Mar 30, 2004 9:22 pm
Forum: Wheelock's Latin
Topic: loci antiqui #7
Replies: 7
Views: 8346

I would translate: So a war cannot be considered just unless it is conducted after satisfaction has been demanded or it is preceded by an official declaration. bellum gerere is idiomatic: to wage/conduct a war. I take "rebus repetitis" as ablative absolute: satisfaction having been demanded. The ess...
by Ulpianus
Sun Mar 28, 2004 9:27 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: I think, therefore I am dangerous
Replies: 5
Views: 4721

In principle, and as a matter of grammar, this is easy: cogito ergo --- sum , where --- is an adjective meaning "dangerous". The only thing to do is choose the adjective. But this is harder than you might think, because whereas "dangerous" in English is a word which has acquired some postive connota...
by Ulpianus
Sun Mar 28, 2004 9:10 pm
Forum: Open Board
Topic: Advice on Learning Classical Languages
Replies: 6
Views: 1861

No doubt the Greek experts (which I am not) can chime in. But as a Latinist who has only occasionally dipped his toe into Greek, I can see no good reason why one should need to learn Latin first. I guess if one was an English speaker hell-bent on learning both there might conceivably be arguments fo...
by Ulpianus
Sat Mar 27, 2004 12:03 am
Forum: Wheelock's Latin
Topic: Ch7 PR13
Replies: 7
Views: 8206

I definitely would avoid doing Latin when you are really sleepy. I look at some of the things I write on my homework the day after I stayed up writing it in any subject, and I wonder what I was thinking... misspelled words, reversed meanings, repeated phrases... :roll: Etiam Homerus dormitat. Sadly...
by Ulpianus
Fri Mar 26, 2004 11:53 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Shifty infinitive tenses. argh
Replies: 6
Views: 2772

The trouble here is really that English makes changes that Latin does not. In English, we alter the tense of the original verb in reported speech: He said, "I am helping her" => He said he was helping her He said, "I have helped her" => He said he had helped her He said, "I will help her" => He said...
by Ulpianus
Tue Mar 23, 2004 3:39 pm
Forum: Open Board
Topic: Some rambling thoughts on learning Latin
Replies: 21
Views: 5849

There's a lot here that I agree with, and a little bit on which we probably disagree, or would add. Just two points, then: 1. I would not be quite as dismissive as you are of "fake" Latin in the early stages. There are quite a few constructions and forms which are sufficiently "advanced" that you wi...
by Ulpianus
Tue Mar 23, 2004 12:19 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Please, help with Commentariolum petitionis
Replies: 1
Views: 1494

I find this very hard. I think I would understand it along these lines, though I feel highly lacking in confidence that I am correct. It's often easier, at least, to work from the errors of others rather than one's own blank slate. "I know, since I was present, what these men's cronies accepted and ...
by Ulpianus
Sat Mar 20, 2004 10:14 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: #5 Mixed Consecutive and Result Clauses
Replies: 3
Views: 2347

1. We have come to defend the walls. moenia ad defendenda venimus. 2. He went away so quickly that we never saw him again. tam celeriter abiit ut eum numquam postea conspiceremus. 3. He is so brave that he does not fear the enemy, but loves battles. tam fortis est ut hostes non timeat sed proeliis s...
by Ulpianus
Sat Mar 20, 2004 12:32 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: What now?
Replies: 7
Views: 3478

I'm sorry you don't like Catullus, Episcope. Have you been reading the soppy stuff (sparrows and all that) which I rather like but probably only due to my advancing years? It's not all like that, by any means; some of it is strong in every sense.