Search found 342 matches

by Aetos
Tue Jul 02, 2019 3:13 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 71-92
Replies: 37
Views: 4510

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 71-92

Seneca can probably give you a more definite answer, but I'm pretty sure that it works like a critical apparatus, and Dindorf is simply citing the manuscripts where the displayed scholion appears. This of course is important because it lends more authenticity and credibility to the wording of the sc...
by Aetos
Tue Jul 02, 2019 11:45 am
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 71-92
Replies: 37
Views: 4510

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 71-92

There are others here who can give you a more detailed explanation, but I'll have a go: The letters refer to the manuscripts the scholia appear in, categorised by the library they reside in, thus: B,E = Mediolansis Bibliothecae Ambrosianae (Milan) H= Harleianus Musei Britannici (British Museum) P= H...
by Aetos
Mon Jul 01, 2019 5:39 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Learning Latin only to understand Classics.
Replies: 20
Views: 1899

Re: Learning Latin only to understand Classics.

50 years ago, my first year Greek class had 3 students (myself included). My Catullus class filled a average sized classroom (let's say 30 desks). Amazingly, they have kept the Greek program alive to this day!
by Aetos
Mon Jul 01, 2019 12:27 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: meno 99a
Replies: 5
Views: 764

Re: meno 99a

Hi Barry, It got me wondering too, so I checked out that reference to Lachmann in Lewis & Short. Apparently, it was spelt as genetivus casus up until the sixth century! Here's the link: https://archive.org/details/bub_gb_7jc8AQAAMAAJ/page/n17 The german grammars have it written with the i (Genitivus...
by Aetos
Sun Jun 30, 2019 11:45 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 71-92
Replies: 37
Views: 4510

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 71-92

Line 74 φέρεν , second foot is long because ἐσθῆτα previously had a digamma at the beginning of the word, so φέρεν ϝεσθῆτα
by Aetos
Sun Jun 30, 2019 12:28 am
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Il. 6.2-3 Genitive Absolute?
Replies: 10
Views: 1140

Re: Il. 6.2-3 Genitive Absolute?

Hi Joel, I checked N497ff. in Ameis and he makes the same comment as he does in Z3 (ἀλλήλων ist von τιτυσκομένων abhängig). He doesn't call this a genitive absolute, rather he's noting that ἀλλήλων is the object of τιτυσκομένων in N497ff., and of ἰθυνομένων in Z3. Only in Z3 does he add the note tha...
by Aetos
Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:43 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Il. 6.2-3 Genitive Absolute?
Replies: 10
Views: 1140

Re: Il. 6.2-3 Genitive Absolute?

Ironically, the German that Seymour bases his notes on is none other than Ameis, who calls this a genitive absolute with an implied subject. Here's the page in Ameis:
https://imgur.com/a/dSZUyUq
by Aetos
Fri Jun 28, 2019 11:26 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Il. 6.2-3 Genitive Absolute?
Replies: 10
Views: 1140

Re: Il. 6.2-3 Genitive Absolute?

Thanks for posting the image, Joel. As you can see, this is under Paragraph 19 in his introduction.
by Aetos
Fri Jun 28, 2019 8:51 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Il. 6.2-3 Genitive Absolute?
Replies: 10
Views: 1140

Re: Il. 6.2-3 Genitive Absolute?

Can't find Para. 3, but here's what Seymour has to say about the genitive absolute in Homer: https://archive.org/details/firstthreebooks02homegoog/page/n27 EDIT: I should say I found para. 3, but it has nothing to do with uses of the genitive. Para. 3 in Seymour's introduction contains the definitio...
by Aetos
Fri Jun 28, 2019 6:00 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Il. 6.2-3 Genitive Absolute?
Replies: 10
Views: 1140

Re: Il. 6.2-3 Genitive Absolute?

Leaf's commentary shows it as a genitive absolute. "as they aimed at one another", (with no subject) Willcock just gives the same translation, which would be a normal translation for a gen. abs. Ameis as well indicates that it's a g.a. with an implied subject of "die Kämpfer" (οἱ μαχητοί or in this ...
by Aetos
Sun Jun 23, 2019 4:47 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 48-70
Replies: 44
Views: 3542

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 48-70

I still don’t quite understand Witte’s idea why the 4th foot needs to be joined to the 5th (thus preventing the bucolic diaresis, if you like). As mwh points out, it's not about preventing Bucolic Diaeresis (in which case it would affect 60% of the Homeric corpus). It goes back to Witte's theory th...
by Aetos
Sat Jun 22, 2019 11:26 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 48-70
Replies: 44
Views: 3542

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 48-70

Thank you, Michael. I've spent most of the day reading Samuel Bassett's "The Theory of the Homeric Caesura According to the Extant Remains of the Ancient Doctrine " (see my link above) trying to gain a better understanding of the phenomenon. He makes several references to Witte, although he mentions...
by Aetos
Fri Jun 21, 2019 10:19 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 48-70
Replies: 44
Views: 3542

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 48-70

No, I think I'm completely out of my depth here and we both need saving! mwh should be along any minute now... I'm afraid I just don't understand metrics well enough to accurately interpret what I'm reading. That I will try to rectify over the next few years! Seriously though, I've got to learn a lo...
by Aetos
Fri Jun 21, 2019 8:11 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 48-70
Replies: 44
Views: 3542

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 48-70

is he just saying that the preposition in the compound is a convenient way of maintaining Hermann's bridge, even if the new verb isn't semantically different? According to the article, it's just one of a number of ways to the prevent the word break. Sean, I've only read the article through to the p...
by Aetos
Fri Jun 21, 2019 5:46 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 48-70
Replies: 44
Views: 3542

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 48-70

If we take Heubeck & al.'s reading, the dream is already in the past, she has woken up and the ὄνειρον is her memory of the dream she has just had. Is this an unreasonable distinction to make? I looked up the article by Witte referred to by Hainesworth in the note and here's a link: https://www-jst...
by Aetos
Fri Jun 21, 2019 10:15 am
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 48-70
Replies: 44
Views: 3542

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 48-70

I've posted pages 310-311 of Stanford's commentary, which cover this week's reading on archive.org.:

https://archive.org/details/OdysseyStanford002
by Aetos
Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:23 am
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Herodotus 3.134
Replies: 3
Views: 456

Re: Herodotus 3.134

Hi Paul, I think this is a potential optative, where Atossa is expressing her opinion that he should do something now, while he's young. She can't really command him, so she can only point out the propriety of such an action. She has already set the tone in line 2 with " οἰκὸς δέ ἐστι…"At least that...
by Aetos
Fri Jun 14, 2019 7:25 pm
Forum: Latin Poetry
Topic: best edition of aeneid
Replies: 11
Views: 1236

Re: best edition of aeneid

If you want to go just one step beyond interlinears, there's Charles Knapp's Virgil . It's available on the archive.org site. I happen to have it in my library and was leafing through it the other day and thought this would be good for someone's first attempt at Virgil. The commentary is in a split ...
by Aetos
Mon Jun 10, 2019 10:49 am
Forum: Civilization and Culture of the Greeks and Romans
Topic: Frater Felix: A surprising purchase
Replies: 2
Views: 716

Re: Frater Felix: A surprising purchase

Apparently their purchases didn't entitle them to the free alarm clock radio.
by Aetos
Mon Jun 10, 2019 10:01 am
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 1-23
Replies: 43
Views: 3881

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 1-23

Hi Paul, I just read the highly entertaining thread on LfgrE. Aside from theft or raiding my pension fund is there any other access yet to this incredible resource? I found one copy of Band 2 on Amazon for US 21.00. All other Volumes appear to be unavailable. I suspect that what you found for $21 a...
by Aetos
Sun Jun 09, 2019 10:48 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 1-23
Replies: 43
Views: 3881

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 1-23

Hi Paul,
I just read the highly entertaining thread on LfgrE. Aside from theft or raiding my pension fund is there any other access yet to this incredible resource? I found one copy of Band 2 on Amazon for US 21.00. All other Volumes appear to be unavailable.
by Aetos
Sun Jun 09, 2019 2:18 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 1-23
Replies: 43
Views: 3881

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 1-23

Seneca 2008 said: The important thing is to recognise the form preverb/preposition ... verb without always wanting to reconstruct a compound verb. It is interesting that according to Pulleyn (Iliad 1 OUP 2000) to call this phenomenon tmesis “is misleading in that it implies that the epic dialect has...
by Aetos
Fri Jun 07, 2019 3:04 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 1-23
Replies: 43
Views: 3881

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 1-23

For the 4th narrative question, why the handmaidens are sleeping on either side of the door, Ameis in his Odyssee für Schulgebrauch, offers simply, "zur Bewachung" (as guards, sentinels, lit. for the purpose of watching out for)
by Aetos
Fri Jun 07, 2019 11:33 am
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 1-23
Replies: 43
Views: 3881

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 1-23

Morphology questions: Here are some brief notes from Stanford's Commentary: Line 2: "Worn out with sleepiness and toil." ὕπνος is also used to denote sleepiness in the Iliad, Book X, 98. Line 6: Stanford's comments are in line with Smyth, although he goes as far as to say -φι could be considered "al...
by Aetos
Mon Jun 03, 2019 9:43 am
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Introduction
Replies: 13
Views: 2447

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Introduction

Try checking "show cover page in two page view" in the View/ Display Pull Down Box from the Menu Bar. If the menu bar isn't showing, press F9 to toggle it.
by Aetos
Sat Jun 01, 2019 8:09 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Herdotus, III, 36,5
Replies: 25
Views: 1953

Re: Herdotus, III, 36,5

Hi Paul,
That's the exact same text as in Hude, i.e. μεταμελήσῃ ,ἐπιζητῇ and ποθῇ are the same forms in Hude's edition(old version of the OCT). I think Bart got his quote from Perseus, which comes from the Loeb (Godley) edition.
by Aetos
Sat Jun 01, 2019 4:34 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Greek word in Pexenfelder's "Apparatus eruditionis"
Replies: 2
Views: 412

Re: Greek word in Pexenfelder's "Apparatus eruditionis"

Hi Carole,
It's περιφραστικῶς = periphrastically. I think it's synonymous with "cum circumlocutione"
Here's a link to a guide to greek ligatures:
http://bibletranslation.ws/down/ligatures.pdf
by Aetos
Sat Jun 01, 2019 4:25 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Herdotus, III, 36,5
Replies: 25
Views: 1953

Re: Herdotus, III, 36,5

I was a little sloppy in that first post, and corrected this mistake a couple posts later: "In any event, when Randy mentioned that Abicht had the first clause in the indicative (μεταμελήσεται… λάμψονται), I dug a little deeper and saw that in Hude's Critical Apparatus (I'm using the OCT) μεταμελήσε...
by Aetos
Sat Jun 01, 2019 12:38 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Herdotus, III, 36,5
Replies: 25
Views: 1953

Re: Herdotus, III, 36,5

This is from Macaulay's notes to Book III: https://archive.org/details/book3editedwithi00herouoft/page/126 Amy Barbour also talks about it in her Selections from Herodotus , Introduction, p. 39 (para. 156): https://archive.org/details/Barbour1001 Smyth 2283 mentions how ἤν derived (εἰ & ἄν), so if y...
by Aetos
Sat Jun 01, 2019 10:53 am
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Herdotus, III, 36,5
Replies: 25
Views: 1953

Re: Herdotus, III, 36,5

I do know he was fond of introducing his apodoseis with δέ after personal pronouns, which explains "οἱ δὲ έκφήναντες…". From what I've read, he occasionally omits ἄν, which may explain why we see εἰ, instead of ἤν (ἐι+ἄν) in the first condition, εἰ … μεταμελήσῃ, οἱ δὲ … λάμψονται.
by Aetos
Fri May 31, 2019 7:44 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Herdotus, III, 36,5
Replies: 25
Views: 1953

Re: Herdotus, III, 36,5

I didn't know the CA had changed again. I did notice that the organisation of the Sigla had changed from the editions posted on archive.org and my hard copy. I'm guessing that d now includes the Parisinus codex. A is the Laurentianus LXX,3 in Hude as well. In any case, Wilson's edition would certain...
by Aetos
Fri May 31, 2019 7:33 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Herdotus, III, 36,5
Replies: 25
Views: 1953

Re: Herdotus, III, 36,5

Geez, after all that fine attention to detail, I blow it on a typo! Anyway, I'm going out on a limb here and say that whether or not these are fut. most/more vivid conditionals, in neither case would ἄν be required. If I understand future conditionals (and I probably don't), the only time ἄν would b...
by Aetos
Fri May 31, 2019 4:59 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Herdotus, III, 36,5
Replies: 25
Views: 1953

Re: Herdotus, III, 36,5

Hi Randy, In the critical apparatus, here are the following alternative readings: μεταμελήσῃ = μεταμελήσει d [V] P ἐπιζητῇ = ἐπιζητεῖ P : -τήσει d (ει D2) [V] d= D cod. Vaticanus 2369 R cod. Vaticanus 123 S cod. Sancroftianus (Cantabr. Emm. 30) V cod. Vindobonensis LXXXV P= cod. Parisinus 1633 Abich...
by Aetos
Fri May 31, 2019 3:28 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Herdotus, III, 36,5
Replies: 25
Views: 1953

Re: Herdotus, III, 36,5

Sorry to have been gone so long, but one of my projects happens to be reading Herodotus ( along with the Iliad and working through Dr. Claxton's Attica, as well as refreshing my Latin). I read this passage just a couple of weeks ago and didn't give it much more thought than to consider it having a p...
by Aetos
Sat Feb 09, 2019 10:12 pm
Forum: Open Board
Topic: An English-Greek Dictionary Upload Request
Replies: 4
Views: 641

Re: An English-Greek Dictionary Upload Request

Yeah, much cleaner. Enjoy! I just saw your p.s.: I was just going with the language tag at Hathi Trust, which indicates the languages are English and Modern Greek. (1453-).I thought you probably wanted to look at some Modern Greek for comparison in connexion with your project, so I didn't give it a ...
by Aetos
Sat Feb 09, 2019 9:59 pm
Forum: Open Board
Topic: An English-Greek Dictionary Upload Request
Replies: 4
Views: 641

Re: An English-Greek Dictionary Upload Request

I haven't figured out how to do a preview yet, but here's the file: https://ia601504.us.archive.org/24/items/AnEnglishGreekLexiconByG.M.Edwards./An%20English-Greek%20lexicon%20%20by%20G.M.%20Edwards.%20.pdf EDIT: I guess Archive.org processes the preview. In the meantime, you can download the book t...
by Aetos
Wed Jan 23, 2019 8:56 pm
Forum: Greek Textbooks and Study Groups
Topic: Attica Intermediate Greek Answer Kwy
Replies: 2
Views: 3380

Re: Attica Intermediate Greek Answer Kwy

You'll need to set up an account with Yale University Press and then apply for instructor access. After that, you'll probably get an automatic reply denying access (unless you can provide instructor credentials)At this point, try sending an email explaining that your need for the answer key is due t...
by Aetos
Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:27 pm
Forum: Open Board
Topic: First post
Replies: 5
Views: 981

Re: First post

As you can see, there is some definite disagreement on the relative merits of Pharr! All you have to do is search for "Pharr" on the forums and you'll see what I mean. mwh mentions Paul Derouda's thoughts on Pharr and I will say that for the most part, I agree with Paul's view. By the time I found t...
by Aetos
Mon Dec 31, 2018 9:22 pm
Forum: Open Board
Topic: First post
Replies: 5
Views: 981

Re: First post

Welcome to Textkit! Like yourself, I carried Pharr around for years (40+!), having started it at college and after retiring made finishing it one of my first goals in continuing the study of Greek. I went through Pharr cover to cover, doing all the exercises, learning all the forms, doing the scansi...
by Aetos
Sun Dec 23, 2018 6:12 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: The preposition "af"
Replies: 1
Views: 482

Re: The preposition "af"

Check the definition of "ab" in Lewis & Short. In a nutshell, "af" is a weakened form of "ap", which in turn is "analogous to the preposition apud". Cicero considered it archaic.

http://logeion.uchicago.edu/ab