Search found 1665 matches

by Hylander
Sun May 12, 2019 12:25 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Ϝ in Homer
Replies: 32
Views: 13990

Re: Ϝ in Homer

He was using the alphabet he had and recognized 'woinos' as an old way of pronouncing 'oinos'. My feeling is still that if the bards preserved all of the archaic words for the sake of meter, then the bards must surely have kept the Ϝ sound where required. The poet or poets of the Iliad and the Odys...
by Hylander
Sat May 11, 2019 12:38 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Ϝ in Homer
Replies: 32
Views: 13990

Re: Ϝ in Homer

That's a good point, but we need to keep in mind that we really have no idea how or when the Iliad and the Odyssey came to be composed and written down. Dictated by an illiterate aoidos to a literate scribe? Composed in writing by a literate poet who was a master of the oral tradition? Composed and ...
by Hylander
Sat May 11, 2019 3:44 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Why is the subjunctive used in this sentence?
Replies: 7
Views: 597

Re: Why is the subjunctive used in this sentence?

It's subjunctive because it implicitly represents what Pyrrhus said to Fabricius: "I am offering you a quarter of my kingdom if you desert." A speech act is implicit in obtulit. I don't think deserturus esset , representing a future indicative verb in direct speech, would necessarily be wrong, but s...
by Hylander
Sat May 11, 2019 2:52 am
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Ϝ in Homer
Replies: 32
Views: 13990

Re: Ϝ in Homer

There's no reason to think that "Homer" was aware of the F or its pronunciation in earlier times. The author or (as I and others suspect) the respective authors of the Iliad and the Odyssey probably didn't pronounce digamma in their everyday speech, because they didn't observe F consistently. It's n...
by Hylander
Sat May 11, 2019 2:28 am
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Ibycus 282 (a).40-48
Replies: 5
Views: 458

Re: Ibycus 282 (a).40-48

Here are two undergraduate-level selections of Greek lyric with commentary: https://www.amazon.com/Greek-Lyric-Selection-Cambridge-Classics/dp/0521633877/ref=sr_1_fkmrnull_1?keywords=budelmann+greek+lyric&qid=1557539638&s=gateway&sr=8-1-fkmrnull https://www.amazon.com/Greek-Lyric-Poetry-Texts/dp/086...
by Hylander
Fri May 10, 2019 1:08 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Scholarly opinions on Xenophon?
Replies: 6
Views: 634

Re: Scholarly opinions on Xenophon?

Caesar is also much more difficult because of constant reported speech and representation. That's exactly why he's a good author to start reading real Latin with. He confronts you with all the gnarly constructions you just learned about in your whirlwind tour of Latin syntax, and his style is large...
by Hylander
Fri May 10, 2019 4:24 am
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Scholarly opinions on Xenophon?
Replies: 6
Views: 634

Re: Scholarly opinions on Xenophon?

People look down on Xenophon because he was neither Thucydides nor Plato. That was his fate. But that doesn't mean he isn't worth reading. My personal opinion is that the Anabasis is a more engaging entry into reading real prose in Greek than Caesar in Latin because things often go wrong in Xenophon...
by Hylander
Fri May 10, 2019 2:00 am
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Ibycus 282 (a).40-48
Replies: 5
Views: 458

Re: Ibycus 282 (a).40-48

I went and cheated by looking in vol. 3 of Campbell's Greek Lyric in the new Loeb series. He takes πέδα as μετεστι (like πάρα for παρεστι), and κάλλεος as a partitive genitive: "for them there is a share of beauty forever", "they have a share in beauty always". The man who is compared to Troilus is ...
by Hylander
Fri May 10, 2019 1:25 am
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Ibycus 282 (a).40-48
Replies: 5
Views: 458

Re: Ibycus 282 (a).40-48

I don't have much to offer beyond a few thoughts. 1. I wonder whether the simile runs something like this: The Trojans and the Greek likened/compared Troilus to "him" (Polycrates, I guess) as thrice refined gold to orichalcum (apparently is a type of bright-red copper, not gold but similar in appear...
by Hylander
Thu May 09, 2019 12:29 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: μεσημβριάς Nonn.D.48.590. and إبصالية واطس للثلاثة فتية القديسين
Replies: 27
Views: 1703

Re: μεσημβριάς Nonn.D.48.590. and إبصالية واطس للثلاثة فتية القديسين

the culturally nuanced image evoked by μεσημβριὰς is of a swooning almost sun-struck woman running alone outdoors, fighting off her own natural inclination to rest.
Aure is a demigoddess or nymph, Breeze personified, and she's seeking a cool place with water and shade to rest in the midday heat.
by Hylander
Thu May 09, 2019 2:07 am
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: μεσημβριάς Nonn.D.48.590. and إبصالية واطس للثلاثة فتية القديسين
Replies: 27
Views: 1703

Re: μεσημβριάς Nonn.D.48.590. and إبصالية واطس للثلاثة فتية القديسين

For them, noon (中午) extends from about 11:30 till about 14:00. It used to be longer, but chairman DXP shortened it at some point. It is a time for eating, resting and not interacting with others. Nobody practices piano or has domestic arguments at that time. It is socially unacceptable to call or c...
by Hylander
Wed May 08, 2019 3:42 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: μεσημβριάς Nonn.D.48.590. and إبصالية واطس للثلاثة فتية القديسين
Replies: 27
Views: 1703

Re: μεσημβριάς Nonn.D.48.590. and إبصالية واطس للثلاثة فتية القديسين

Herodotus doesn't have a specific word for "afternoon" -- because the exact time of noon could not normally be determined with precision in his world -- so he expresses something like the modern English concept as the decline of midday, ἀποκλινομένης δὲ τῆς μεσαμβρίης. Likewise, Aelius Aristides des...
by Hylander
Wed May 08, 2019 12:47 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: μεσημβριάς Nonn.D.48.590. and إبصالية واطس للثلاثة فتية القديسين
Replies: 27
Views: 1703

Re: μεσημβριάς Nonn.D.48.590. and إبصالية واطس للثلاثة فتية القديسين

All of the examples for هذه الظهيره, which I understand as "that afternoon", in the reverso dictionary are rendered "this afternoon" or "that afternoon". If we're trying to understand the meaning of a Greek word from an Arabic translation of a Coptic text that incorporates the Greek word, using an ...
by Hylander
Tue May 07, 2019 10:16 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: μεσημβριάς Nonn.D.48.590. and إبصالية واطس للثلاثة فتية القديسين
Replies: 27
Views: 1703

Re: μεσημβριάς Nonn.D.48.590. and إبصالية واطس للثلاثة فتية القديسين

In any event, if I understand the Coptic text you cited correctly, MECHMBPIAC is not Nonnus' nonce adjective μεσημβριάς. It's the genitive of the noun μεσημβρία (genitive of "time"), as the parallel word ECΠEPAC shows.
by Hylander
Tue May 07, 2019 4:14 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: μεσημβριάς Nonn.D.48.590. and إبصالية واطس للثلاثة فتية القديسين
Replies: 27
Views: 1703

Re: μεσημβριάς Nonn.D.48.590. and إبصالية واطس للثلاثة فتية القديسين

I'm not sure I completely follow your arguments, especially when you get into Coptic and/or Arabic, languages that I know next to nothing about. However, I don't see anything unusual in Nonnus' Greek. Nonnus clearly created his nonce word μεσημβριάς, (it’s “peculiar" in the sense of "unique," not “s...
by Hylander
Tue May 07, 2019 1:32 am
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: μεσημβριάς Nonn.D.48.590. and إبصالية واطس للثلاثة فتية القديسين
Replies: 27
Views: 1703

Re: μεσημβριάς Nonn.D.48.590. and إبصالية واطس للثلاثة فتية القديسين

μεσημβρινός, and presumably μεσημβριάς, mean "noontime", not "all throughout the day." For the "adverbial" usage, see Smyth 1042: 1042. Several adjectives of time, place, order of succession, etc., are used as predicates where English employs an adverb or a preposition with its case: ““ἀφικνοῦνται τ...
by Hylander
Mon May 06, 2019 7:37 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Lysias 1.1
Replies: 2
Views: 255

Re: Lysias 1.1

You’re close but not quite there yet. You haven’t worked in αν . . . ειητε. ύμνο αυτοις is parallel to εμοι earlier in the sentence. “ . . . the same sort of jurors to me as you would be to yourselves if you had undergone. . .”
by Hylander
Sun May 05, 2019 1:52 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: What subjunctive is this? (from Livy)
Replies: 7
Views: 674

Re: What subjunctive is this? (from Livy)

5.9.5 I can't find anything on point about this in Allen & Greenough or in Woodcock, but I think this is a sort of warning -- something like : "Be careful that I don't . . . '" or maybe "Don't let me . . . ". But the verb is imperfect subjunctive, I think, because Servilius' threat is "irrealis", li...
by Hylander
Sat May 04, 2019 3:36 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Επισταμαι
Replies: 12
Views: 948

Re: Επισταμαι

-μη is a Greek deverbal noun suffix. Smyth 840a(6) has some examples and in these instances, at least, -μη is added directly to verb stems. 6. μα_ (nom. -μη): γνώ-μη knowledge (γι-γνώ-σκω know), φή-μη report, omen (φη-μί say), τι_-μή honour (poet. τί_-ω honour), μνή-μη memory (μι-μνῄ-σκω remind). ἐπ...
by Hylander
Fri May 03, 2019 3:52 am
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Επισταμαι
Replies: 12
Views: 948

Re: Επισταμαι

Does the perfect form of the verb serve a syntactic function, or does each verb only have a meaning to convey of itself in isolation? Huh? The perfect would have a semantic function, but this verb doesn't have a perfect, and I think that's for the reason I've explained. ἐπίσταμαι is not a denominat...
by Hylander
Fri May 03, 2019 3:37 am
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: ἄκουε τοίνυν ὡς ἐροῦντος.
Replies: 4
Views: 382

Re: ἄκουε τοίνυν ὡς ἐροῦντος.

Phaedo 96a: ἐγὼ οὖν σοι δίειμι περὶ αὐτῶν, ἐὰν βούλῃ, τά γε ἐμὰ πάθη: ἔπειτα ἄν τί σοι χρήσιμον φαίνηται ὧν ἂν λέγω, πρὸς τὴν πειθὼ περὶ ὧν δὴ λέγεις χρήσῃ. ἀλλὰ μήν, ἔφη ὁ Κέβης, βούλομαί γε. ἄκουε τοίνυν ὡς ἐροῦντος. ἐγὼ γάρ, ἔφη, ὦ Κέβης, νέος ὢν θαυμαστῶς ὡς ἐπεθύμησα ταύτης τῆς σοφίας ἣν δὴ καλ...
by Hylander
Fri May 03, 2019 3:22 am
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Phaed 80c
Replies: 7
Views: 622

Re: Phaed 80c

Yes, that was exactly my point: εστι is not necessary because it's understood with ἀμήχανον. But the idiom as a whole requires further explanation.
by Hylander
Thu May 02, 2019 3:12 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Deictic
Replies: 2
Views: 219

Re: Deictic

"pointing out", here and now, as with the index finger. -ι added to pronouns is deictic.
by Hylander
Thu May 02, 2019 2:02 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Επισταμαι
Replies: 12
Views: 948

Re: Επισταμαι

The middle of of ιστημι is εστημαι, LSJ reports ἕσταμαι for the perfect passive (and presumably middle), which apparently occurs only in the compound διιστημ: 2. Pass., ἵσταμαι: imper. “ἵστασο” Hes.Sc.449, “ἵστω” S.Ph. 893, Ar.Ec.737: impf. ἱστάμην: fut. “στα^θήσομαι” And.3.34, Aeschin. 3.103: more...
by Hylander
Tue Apr 30, 2019 11:13 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Is -"tion" ever pronounced "shun"?
Replies: 9
Views: 866

Re: Is -"tion" ever pronounced "shun"?

Ancient Latin pronunciation is pretty well understood. Allen's Vox Latina lays it out along with the evidence.
by Hylander
Tue Apr 30, 2019 4:16 am
Forum: Koine and Biblical and Medieval Greek
Topic: Χριστὸς ἀνέστη?
Replies: 9
Views: 1092

Re: Χριστὸς ἀνέστη?

You got the underlying principle right: transitive vs. intransitive. "First aorist" and "second aorist" are just labels. The "sigmatic" aorists are traditionally denominated "first aorist".
by Hylander
Mon Apr 29, 2019 3:17 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Elision in Greek Prose
Replies: 3
Views: 339

Re: Elision in Greek Prose

W. Sydney Allen, Vox Graeca 3rd ed. (Cambridge 1987), pp. 96 ff., chap. 4 "Vowel Juncture".
by Hylander
Mon Apr 29, 2019 12:36 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Is -"tion" ever pronounced "shun"?
Replies: 9
Views: 866

Re: Is -"tion" ever pronounced "shun"?

How could we possibly know?
We can be pretty certain that -tio(n-) was pronounced as two syllable because pronouncing it as a single syllable wouldn't scan in Latin verse.
by Hylander
Mon Apr 29, 2019 2:16 am
Forum: Koine and Biblical and Medieval Greek
Topic: Χριστὸς ἀνέστη?
Replies: 9
Views: 1092

Re: Χριστὸς ἀνέστη?

You have it backwards .ἀνέστη is "second" aorist (intransitive); ἀνέστησεν is "first" aorist (transitive).
by Hylander
Sun Apr 28, 2019 12:47 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Ørberg’s Lingua Latina series
Replies: 45
Views: 4197

Re: Ørberg’s Lingua Latina series

Yes, the transitive use (which this is) is very common in poetry. absentem cantat amicam is the second half of a hexameter. Google tells me it's a modification of a line from Horace's Satires, the one about his trip to Brindisi, with the nocturnal emission, I think.
by Hylander
Fri Apr 26, 2019 6:36 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Is -"tion" ever pronounced "shun"?
Replies: 9
Views: 866

Re: Is -"tion" ever pronounced "shun"?

Only in the old-fashioned and discredited English pronunciation of Latin.
by Hylander
Fri Apr 26, 2019 6:31 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Ησσαομαι
Replies: 1
Views: 181

Re: Ησσαομαι

If you rely on the “word study tool”, you’ll often be misled.
by Hylander
Fri Apr 26, 2019 5:22 pm
Forum: Latin Poetry
Topic: Introduction to Latin poetry
Replies: 22
Views: 2449

Re: Introduction to Latin poetry

1. No, h does not block elision. See Allen for a discussion of /h/ in colloquial speech. There's a famous epigram of Catullus about someone who put initial /h/ in the wrong words as an ignorant hypercorrection. Catullus 84. 2. Yes, and as mwh noted, if the following syllable is short, it stays short...
by Hylander
Fri Apr 26, 2019 5:05 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Apuleius, Met. 2.1
Replies: 4
Views: 424

Re: Apuleius, Met. 2.1

cantamina is obviously right, especially since * contamen is not a word that managed to find its way into the Oxford Latin Dictionary. Zimmerman's Oxford text prints cantamina and doesn't even indicate a variant. quo is the reading of the manuscript; qua is a conjecture of Helm in his Teubner editi...
by Hylander
Fri Apr 26, 2019 4:17 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Phaed 88ab
Replies: 4
Views: 288

Re: Phaed 88ab

I would go with what Burnet says (but not necessarily Stedman). He knew Plato better than anyone, certainly much better than I. And reading the passage over again, I see that his explanation makes sense. The εἰ + optative verbs συγχωρήσειεν . . . συγχωροῖ . . . φαίη outline the counterargument to So...
by Hylander
Fri Apr 26, 2019 3:01 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Phaed 88ab
Replies: 4
Views: 288

Re: Phaed 88ab

Addendum: I've changed my mind; this is wrong! Disregard this and see my subsequent post below. I think συγχωροῖ and φαίη can be explained as potential optatives without αν. In English translation, I think this would be "he might not agree" rather than "he would not agree". The optative without αν ...
by Hylander
Thu Apr 25, 2019 3:31 pm
Forum: Latin Poetry
Topic: Introduction to Latin poetry
Replies: 22
Views: 2449

Re: Introduction to Latin poetry

That would be a very big task that would require a lot of time and energy to prepare and do right, and I'm not sure a video would be that useful, You can find the essential information about prosody, scansion and meter in any number of books (provided they were published after about 1920 or so -- if...
by Hylander
Wed Apr 24, 2019 2:59 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Ave, Imperator...
Replies: 8
Views: 946

Re: Ave, Imperator...

ablativus loci or temporis? Think of it as just fundamental ablative. Suetonius wouldn't have thought about the distinction here, and you shouldn't either. Ablative of location and ablative of time are just categories invented by modern grammarians to classify broad ranges of uses of the ablative f...
by Hylander
Wed Apr 24, 2019 2:44 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Phaed 80c
Replies: 7
Views: 622

Re: Phaed 80c

To explain this in more detail, it's an idiom with a word that is understood and dropped. The word is λέγειν, or something like that, so that the full expression would be ὀλίγου ὅλον μένει ἀμήχανον λέγειν ὅσον χρόνον. And of course εστι would not be needed in the expression ἀμήχανον [λέγειν]. χρόνον...
by Hylander
Wed Apr 24, 2019 4:12 am
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Phaed 80c
Replies: 7
Views: 622

Re: Phaed 80c

See LSJ ἀμήχανος: freq. in Pl. with “οἷος, ὅσος, ἀμήχανον ὅσον χρόνον” Phd 95c; ἀμηχάνῳ ὅσῳ πλέονι by it is impossible to say how much more, R.588a; “ἀμή χανόν τι οἷον” Chrm.155d. Adv., “ἀμηχάνως ὡς εὖ” R.527e; “ἀ. γε ὡς σφόδρα” Phdr.263d. http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%...