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§. 378. ΈΞΕΡΣ&a

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§. 378. ΈΞΕΡΣ&a

Postby Episcopus » Sat Nov 29, 2003 2:11 pm

Volo per hunc librum, sed latiná anglice longá nunc est mihi paulo difficilior. Gratias quibuscumque dantibus mihi auxilium agam. (at si haec non vera sint, me novo huic linguae dare auxilium debetis!)

Anyhow...

I. 1. Puer timens ne capiatur fugit.
The boy fearing lest he should be captured fled.

*Why is the 'capiatur' present and 'fugit' perfect? Is that because a participle goes at the same time as the main verb? (Simple sentence I know)

2. Aquila irá commota avís reliquas interficere conata erat.
The eagle, which had been moved by anger had tried to kill the remaining birds.
(interesting how the latin people say to kill inter+facere, to do between, and colloquially many britons say "do" or "do in" I suppose if you slay some one you cut them in half, do them between)

3. Milites ab hostibus pressi tela iacere non potuerunt.
The soliders since they had been (or who had been) hard pressed by the enemy could not hurl their weapons.

4. Caesar decimam legionem laudaturus ad primum agmen progressus est.
Caesar since he was about to praise the tenth legion moved forward to the van.

5. Imperator hortatus equites ut fortiter pugnarent signum proelio dedit.
The general after he had urged the horsemen to fight bravely gave the sign of battle.

6. Milites hostís octo milia pasuum insecuti multis cum captivis ad castra reverterunt.
The soldiers, after they had pursued the enemy for eight thousand paces returned to camp with many captives.

7. Sol oriens multos interfectos vidit.
As the sun was rising it saw many who had been slain.

8. Romani consilium audax suspicati barbaris sese non commiserunt.
The Romans since they had suspected the bold plan did not commit themselves to the savages.

(If suspicior, ari, atus is to suspect, how can you say 'he is suspected')

9. Navis e portu egressa nullo in periculo erat.
The ship after it has disembarked from the harbour was in no danger.

II. 1. The army was in great danger marching through the enemy's country.
Exercitus contendens (or iter faciens) per hostium provinciam magno in periculo erat.

2. Frightened by the length of the way, they longed for home.
Ii longitudine viae perterriti domum desiderabant.

3. When the scouts were about to set out they heard the shouts of victory.
Exploratores profecturi clamores victoriae audiverunt.

4. When we had delayed many days we set fire to the buildings and departed.
Nos dies duos (or dua) morati aedificia incendimus discessimusque.

5. While living at Rome I heard orators much better than these.
Romae habitans oratores multo meliores quam hos audivi.

6. The soldiers who are fighting across the river are no braver than we.
Milites trans flumen pugnantes sunt nihilo nobis fortiores.

...I always wondered, it would sound bad in latin if every relative clause that is in the English were translated into latin. It's quite a good way, to add subordinating conjunctions which best manifest the meaning. As it becomes more difficult it depends more on the translator to show the meaning of the latin which, if translated literally, will not be natural. Yet sometimes "The soldiers fighting across the river..." works fine and there is no great need to make it into a relative clause.
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Re: §. 378. ΈΞΕΡ&#93

Postby Skylax » Sat Nov 29, 2003 3:43 pm

Episcopus wrote:I. 1. Puer timens ne capiatur fugit.
The boy fearing lest he should be captured fled.

*Why is the 'capiatur' present and 'fugit' perfect? Is that because a participle goes at the same time as the main verb? (Simple sentence I know)

fugit (short u) is present.
2. Aquila irá commota avís reliquas interficere conata erat.
The eagle, which had been moved by anger had tried to kill the remaining birds.
(interesting how the latin people say to kill inter+facere, to do between, and colloquially many britons say "do" or "do in" I suppose if you slay some one you cut them in half, do them between)

Here inter indicates an exclusion, an elimination, cf. interimo, intereo, interdico...
8. Romani consilium audax suspicati barbaris sese non commiserunt.
The Romans since they had suspected the swift plan did not commit themselves to the savages.

audax "bold, daring". Why "swift"? Here consilium audax means obviously "a treacherous plan".
(If suspicior, ari, atus is to suspect, how can you say 'he is suspected')

You just can't. You must either use an other verb or say it in an other way : Omnes eum suspicantur. Quidam eum suspicatur. Quis eum non suspicatur? And so on.

II. 1. per hostium provinciam

Or per hostium fines

2. viae

Or itineris
many days
dies duos (or dua)

dua : maybe duas? Say rather dies multos
When feminine, DIES means "a date".
5. While living at Rome I heard orators much better than these.
Romae habitans oratores multo meliores quam hos audivi.

Here I made a mistake : I had written hi instead of the correct HOS. The Ablative HIS (without QUAM) would also be possible.
6. The soldiers who are fighting across the river are no braver than we.
Milites trans flumen pugnantes sunt nihil[o nobis fortiores.

My answer was simply : nobis fortiores non sunt What is suggesting to use nihilo ?

.
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Postby Episcopus » Sat Nov 29, 2003 5:31 pm

As always thank you very much Sylax for your interesting informed corrections :)

1. fugit! :oops:

dua, duos...why did I put two instead of many, I meant multos :oops:


6. The soldiers who are fighting across the river are no braver than we.
Milites trans flumen pugnantes sunt nihilo nobis fortiores.

I don't know how to do the ablative of measure of difference (i.e. much more - multo plures episcopi etc.) in french, but the "no" suggests "by nothing". If you could tell me how to do it in french... :wink:

:P Gratias tibi ago (again!)
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Re: §. 378. ΈΞΕΡ&#93

Postby benissimus » Sun Nov 30, 2003 2:55 am

Episcopus wrote:
I. 1. Puer timens ne capiatur fugit.
The boy fearing lest he should be captured fled.


I'm not sure why you put "lest" here. Typically these sentences are translated like "The boy, fearing that he may be captured, flees." ...where UT and NE seem to have inverse meanings in fear clauses. Or maybe you chose that word on purpose...
flebile nescio quid queritur lyra, flebile lingua murmurat exanimis, respondent flebile ripae
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Postby Episcopus » Sun Nov 30, 2003 3:49 pm

It just sounded better like that. Had it been "...ut caperetur" I would have written "...that he might not be captured" or something similar.
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