artistry in the use of HIC and ILLE

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blutoonwithcarrotandnail
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artistry in the use of HIC and ILLE

Post by blutoonwithcarrotandnail »

hello,
good afternoon,

is there an etiquette in formal latin/roman language which
to use first in contrast of two objects/people.

Hic ager est latus, ille est angustus.

Could you write:

Ille ager est latus, hic est angustus.

how about:

Ille ager est latus, ille est angustus.


Further, are ILLE and HIC fit for any noun/person/object
in the latin lanauge or is it only fit for some words?



Are there words you would never use ILLE or HIC to substitute
for?

thank you so much

btwcarrotandnail
cuts like ice cream fast like a razor blade

adrianus
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Re: artistry in the use of HIC and ILLE

Post by adrianus »

blutoonwithcarrotandnail wrote:Could you write:

Ille ager est latus, hic est angustus.

how about:c

Ille ager est latus, ille est angustus.
You could write either. There is no rule on this.
Utrumque scribere potes. De hoc non est regula.
blutoonwithcarrotandnail wrote:Further, are ILLE and HIC fit for any noun/person/object
in the latin lanauge or is it only fit for some words?
They're suitable for all words, I would say, though less likely to be applied to abstract nouns, I can imagine.
Omnibus verbis apta ista pronomina, ut credo, etsi rarò cum nominibus mente conceptis collocentur, imaginor.
I'm writing in Latin hoping for correction, and not because I'm confident in how I express myself. Latinè scribo ut ab omnibus corrigar, non quod confidenter me exprimam.

blutoonwithcarrotandnail
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Re: artistry in the use of HIC and ILLE

Post by blutoonwithcarrotandnail »

adrianus wrote:
Ille ager est latus, hic est angustus.

Ille ager est latus, ille est angustus.


You could write either. There is no rule on this.
In the identical context do they have the same meaning if you
want them to?

thank you

good day

bluetoonwithcarrotandnail
cuts like ice cream fast like a razor blade

adrianus
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Re: artistry in the use of HIC and ILLE

Post by adrianus »

blutoonwithcarrotandnail wrote:In the identical context do they have the same meaning if you
want them to?
In my opinion, the difference between "hic" (this) and "ille" (that) is small but always significant. I didn't mean "Ille ager est latus, hic est angustus" and "Ille ager est latus, ille est angustus" have exactly the same meaning.
Meâ sententiâ, parvum at semper significans discrimen inter hic and ille pronomina demonstrativa. Nolui dicere haec eandem significationem habere: "Ille ager est latus, hic est angustus" et "Ille ager est latus, ille est angustus".
I'm writing in Latin hoping for correction, and not because I'm confident in how I express myself. Latinè scribo ut ab omnibus corrigar, non quod confidenter me exprimam.

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Hampie
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Re: artistry in the use of HIC and ILLE

Post by Hampie »

adrianus wrote:
blutoonwithcarrotandnail wrote:In the identical context do they have the same meaning if you
want them to?
In my opinion, the difference between "hic" (this) and "ille" (that) is small but always significant. I didn't mean "Ille ager est latus, hic est angustus" and "Ille ager est latus, ille est angustus" have exactly the same meaning.
Meâ sententiâ, parvum at semper significans discrimen inter hic and ille pronomina demonstrativa. Nolui dicere haec eandem significationem habere: "Ille ager est latus, hic est angustus" et "Ille ager est latus, ille est angustus".
That’s not suppose to be an ‹et› or ‹atque›?
Här kan jag i alla fall skriva på svenska, eller hur?

adrianus
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Re: artistry in the use of HIC and ILLE

Post by adrianus »

It is, Hampie. A slip.
Sic, Hampie. Lapsum curae!
I'm writing in Latin hoping for correction, and not because I'm confident in how I express myself. Latinè scribo ut ab omnibus corrigar, non quod confidenter me exprimam.

blutoonwithcarrotandnail
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Re: artistry in the use of HIC and ILLE

Post by blutoonwithcarrotandnail »

adrianus wrote:In my opinion, the difference between "hic" (this) and "ille" (that) is small but always significant.

I didn't mean "Ille ager est latus, hic est angustus" and "Ille ager est latus, ille est angustus" have exactly the same meaning.
The slight difference is contextual correct?

Is there an inate difference in the translation of ILLE vs. HIC in this case?

ILLE = HIC

all differences are essentially contextual
the proof is in the pudding? (since they can be equal at times it is true that they are equal)


thank you
good day
cuts like ice cream fast like a razor blade

blutoonwithcarrotandnail
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Re: artistry in the use of HIC and ILLE

Post by blutoonwithcarrotandnail »

adrianus wrote:In my opinion, the difference between "hic" (this) and "ille" (that) is small but always significant.

I didn't mean "Ille ager est latus, hic est angustus" and "Ille ager est latus, ille est angustus" have exactly the same meaning.
The slight difference is contextual correct?

Is there an inate difference in the translation of ILLE vs. HIC in this case?

ILLE = HIC

all differences are essentially contextual
the proof is in the pudding? (since they can be equal at times it is true that they are equal)


thank you
good day
cuts like ice cream fast like a razor blade

Sinister Petrus
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Re: artistry in the use of HIC and ILLE

Post by Sinister Petrus »

If ILLE = HIC, then THIS = THAT.

They are demonstrative adjectives/pronouns. No more no less.

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