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Question from Pensum II LLPSI Cap. XXIX

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Question from Pensum II LLPSI Cap. XXIX

Postby pmda » Sat May 28, 2011 10:22 am

Salve,

In Pensa II, Cap XXIX, LLPSI Orberg habet hanc sententiam:

Precibus permoti nautae ei permiserunt ut ante mortem carmen caneret.

Quid est 'Precibus permoti' ? Permotti = ppp

'?.....the sailors allowed him to sing a song before death.'
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Re: Question from Pensum II LLPSI Cap. XXIX

Postby gfross » Sat May 28, 2011 12:29 pm

I took a look at that and found this sentence (XXIX, line 86-7): Nautae precibus eius ita permoti sunt ut manus quidem ab eo abstinerent. Also this (XXVII, 109): His precibus dominus severus tandem movetur. In the margin: preces = verba orantia, quod oratur. And this (XXVII, 92): Colonus ad pedes domini se proicit eumque orat ut patientiam habeat. Strange that Ørberg neglects to give a Latin equivalent of orare in the margin, but there is XXXV, 2 Partes orationes quot sunt? with oratio defined in the margin as sermo. And XX, 50: Sermo eorum est de rebus futuris, with sermo defined in the margin as id quod dicitur, verba.

Here are orat and preces in another context: Homo pius, religiosus, sanctus orat Deum. Homo pius Deo preces dicit.

Verba orantia. Orantia < orans, orantis < orare Vide XIV: Participium

Permoti: XXIX, 86 in the margin permovere: permoti sunt : animi eorum permoti sunt

If I insert a comma, can you understand it now? Precibus permoti, nautae.... Nomen nautae nominativus masculinus pluralis, participium perfectum permoti quoque masculinus pluralis est.

precibus nomen, ablativus pluralis

permoti quibus? permoti precibus = precibus permoti

precibus permoti, nautae = preces permoverunt nautas, ergo nautae ei permiserunt....

Hope this helped! I'm only up to Chapter X, but I have the Grammatica Latina and the Latine Disco Student's Manual supplementary booklets, and they helped. Also Ørberg's method of defining new words on the basis of words previously studied, and his extremely helpful decision to index each word with the chapter and line number where it was first introduced and defined.

I could have translated it for you into English, but that would not be Ørberg's way, so despite my poor knowledge of Latin, I tried to help you as much as possible using Ørberg's references for the most part.

Bonam tibi fortunam!
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Re: Question from Pensum II LLPSI Cap. XXIX

Postby pmda » Sat May 28, 2011 1:39 pm

Many thanks. I will study carefully.
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Re: Question from Pensum II LLPSI Cap. XXIX

Postby pmda » Sun May 29, 2011 3:48 pm

gfross I want to thank you again, very much, for the trouble you've taken with this exhaustive answer.
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Re: Question from Pensum II LLPSI Cap. XXIX

Postby gfross » Mon May 30, 2011 12:33 am

pmda wrote:gfross I want to thank you again, very much, for the trouble you've taken with this exhaustive answer.


You are very welcome! It was fun for me to do it, and I learned a lot, too.
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