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Lack of Comprehension or Errata?

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Lack of Comprehension or Errata?

Postby brighthouse » Sat Mar 26, 2011 5:42 pm

My son is working on the Grammatica portion of the 1st chapter of the workbook. So far so good until he reached question 20 on syllabification. This exercise requires splitting words into syllables, underlining the long syllable and placing an accent mark on stressed syllables. There are numerous things that have thrown us for a loop but here are the main two:

#1 Why are there accent marks (in the answer key) on the last syllable of three words: antiqua, salvere, and iuvate? From the text we learned that the stress/accent should fall in one of three places - the first syllable, the penult (next to last) if that syllable is long and the word has three or more syllables, or the antepenult (second to last?) syllable if the penult syllable is not long. Are we missing or not understanding something or are there errors in the answer key?

#2 In the word iuvate my son had broken it into syllables that looked like this: i-u-va-te. The workbook had it broken into syllables that looked like this: iu-va-te. I don't think this is a dipthong - 'ui' is a dipthong but not 'iu', correct?

It looks like the words in this exercise aren't following the rules laid out in the text. Any help, corrections, clarifications are very much appreciated!

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Re: Lack of Comprehension or Errata?

Postby jaihare » Sun Mar 27, 2011 1:11 pm

I'm not a Latinist, but I'll take a stab (having gotten further than this in Wheelock myself).

brighthouse wrote:#1 Why are there accent marks (in the answer key) on the last syllable of three words: antiqua, salvere, and iuvate? From the text we learned that the stress/accent should fall in one of three places - the first syllable, the penult (next to last) if that syllable is long and the word has three or more syllables, or the antepenult (second to last?) syllable if the penult syllable is not long. Are we missing or not understanding something or are there errors in the answer key?


You seem to understand. There shouldn't be stress marks on the last syllable of any of these words.

brighthouse wrote:#2 In the word iuvate my son had broken it into syllables that looked like this: i-u-va-te. The workbook had it broken into syllables that looked like this: iu-va-te. I don't think this is a dipthong - 'ui' is a dipthong but not 'iu', correct?


i is a semi-consonant. In this place, 'iu' is like 'ju' and it's one syllable. iu-va-te, where the first syllable is like writing "you" in English. It's not a diphthong, since the i in this case isn't technically a vowel.

brighthouse wrote:It looks like the words in this exercise aren't following the rules laid out in the text. Any help, corrections, clarifications are very much appreciated!


Hope that helped a little. Now if a real student of Latin would step in and verify, that would be great. :)
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Re: Lack of Comprehension or Errata?

Postby calvinist » Tue Mar 29, 2011 5:48 am

jaihare wrote:I'm not a Latinist, but I'll take a stab...

i is a semi-consonant. In this place, 'iu' is like 'ju' and it's one syllable. iu-va-te, where the first syllable is like writing "you" in English. It's not a diphthong, since the i in this case isn't technically a vowel.

Hope that helped a little. Now if a real student of Latin would step in and verify, that would be great. :)


Verified.

Also, Latin never accents the final syllable... never. I'm not sure what the workbook is trying to say. It seems unlikely to have such a consistent typo. I don't have the workbook or I'd look it up. Anyone else have the workbook and can chime in?
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Re: Lack of Comprehension or Errata?

Postby Craig_Thomas » Tue Mar 29, 2011 6:07 am

In Latin, the stress falls naturally on the third-last syllable of a word, but will fall on the second-last syllable if it is long.

The three words you mentioned all have long penults, so the stress should fall there.

In my copy they're correctly given like this (I can't imitate the mark-up exactly, so I've put in capitals those syllables which the text marks with an acute accent):

sal--re

an--qua

iu--te
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Re: Lack of Comprehension or Errata?

Postby jaihare » Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:03 pm

Craig_Thomas wrote:sal-vḗ-re
an-tı̄́-qua
iu-vā́-te


I tried. The accent on the i didn't come out so good. For some reason, the macron shifts right and the accent shifts left. The e and a look OK, I guess. Why don't we have full support for such things already?!?!
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ὁ μὲν Παῦλος τοὺς ἐν ταῖς ἐκκλησίαις μαθητὰς τὴν χωρὶς νόμου δικαιοσύνην τὴν ἐν Χριστῷ ἐδίδασκεν, οἱ δ᾿ ἄλλοι ἀπόστολοι τοὺς ἀνθρώπους ἐδίδασκον τηρεῖν τὸν θεῖον νόμον τὸν χειρὶ Μωϋσέως δοθέντα.
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