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Meaning of revertere!

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Meaning of revertere!

Postby pmda » Mon Jan 31, 2011 9:47 am

In Orberg's LLPSI he has: Ariadna amicum suum fugientem vocavit: "Theseu! Theseu! Revertere ad me!"

I take it that 'revertere!' here is passive imperative and means something like 'be returned to me'. I'm not clear of the difference in use between the passive and active in this verb.
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Re: Meaning of revertere!

Postby Alatius » Mon Jan 31, 2011 11:43 am

Edit: What Adrianus said. :)
Last edited by Alatius on Mon Jan 31, 2011 11:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Meaning of revertere!

Postby adrianus » Mon Jan 31, 2011 11:43 am

"Revertor" verbum et deponens est, ergo "anglicè "Return!" est "Revertere!"
"Revertor" is also a deponent verb, so "Revertere!" means also "Return!"

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Re: Meaning of revertere!

Postby pmda » Mon Jan 31, 2011 12:57 pm

So the table in 501 Latin Verbs showing 'active' and 'passvive' forms are really showing two columns that mean exactly the same thing...!!??
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Re: Meaning of revertere!

Postby furrykef » Mon Jan 31, 2011 8:15 pm

No, a passive imperative doesn't mean the same thing as an active. It's just that the imperative of a deponent verb is going to be passive in form but active in meaning, just like virtually everything else about deponent verbs (participles aside).

I believe passive imperatives are pretty rare outside of deponent verbs, though. A passive command for an active verb can be rephrased such that the passive imperative is not needed. Besides, how often have you needed a passive imperative in English? "Be carried on his shoulders!" is more awkward than "Let him carry you on his shoulders!" ("Tē umerīs ferat"), isn't it? :)
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Re: Meaning of revertere!

Postby adrianus » Mon Jan 31, 2011 9:00 pm

furrykef wrote:Besides, how often have you needed a passive imperative in English?

Often when you want to be abusive! And often with negative orders.
Saepè anglicè taliâ voce modo imperativo uteris contumeliosé! Saepè et cum jussu negativo.
I'm writing in Latin hoping for correction, and not because I'm confident in how I express myself. Latinè scribo ut ab omnibus corrigar, non quod confidenter me exprimam.
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Re: Meaning of revertere!

Postby pmda » Mon Jan 31, 2011 10:22 pm

Yes but if 'Revertor" is also a deponent verb, so "Revertere!" means also "Return!''' then what is the difference in meening between the active and passive forms of this verb?
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Re: Meaning of revertere!

Postby adrianus » Mon Jan 31, 2011 10:37 pm

None (almost), unless that between "Go!" and "Be gone!" or, more appropriately here, "Back!" and "Get back!" in English. Check the dictionary for some small differences depending on context.
Nulla (paenè) differentia, nisi ea inter anglicè "Go!" et "Be gone!" vel hîc aptiùs "Back!" et "Get back!" In dictionarium humiles inquire de contextu pendentes.
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Re: Meaning of revertere!

Postby furrykef » Tue Feb 01, 2011 7:25 am

Do deponent verbs even have active imperatives? :?

Wheelock -- though it is not an exhaustive reference -- only lists the passive imperative forms for deponent verbs.
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Re: Meaning of revertere!

Postby adrianus » Tue Feb 01, 2011 1:22 pm

furrykef wrote:Do deponent verbs even have active imperatives?

No (if you're not referring to the active sense of the passive voice). But pmda means the anomalous situation of "reverte" from "reverto" as a non-deponent and "revertere" from "revertor" as a deponent.
Non habent (at certè sensum activum è voce passivâ surgit). Pmda autem formas deponentem (de "revertor") et non deponentem (de "reverto") ut anomalias distinguit.
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Re: Meaning of revertere!

Postby furrykef » Tue Feb 01, 2011 11:54 pm

Ah. I hadn't come across that before.
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