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Latin phrase

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Latin phrase

Postby fiddlercrab » Sat Sep 25, 2010 12:22 pm

Hi. I'm wondering ifr anyone might help me develop a correct Latin phrase as follows: As a musician, I want to make a play on the famous dictum "cogito ergo sum" (I think therefore I am). What I want to say is "I play/make music therefore I am". I've come across the word "concentus". Would "concentus ergo sum" work? "Concentus" seems more related to choral music, harmony, etc. I wish there were something more musical instrument based. And even if it is the best word, I have no idea if its grammatical form is right in the context that I want.

Thanks!
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Re: Latin phrase

Postby thesaurus » Sat Sep 25, 2010 3:39 pm

I'd say either "cano ergo sum" or "canto ergo sum." Both verbs mean "I sing/produce music/play an instrument." More generally, it means "I produce melodious sounds" (although I'm not sure of what the subtle difference is between cano/canto).
Horae quidem cedunt et dies et menses et anni, nec praeteritum tempus umquam revertitur nec quid sequatur sciri potest. Quod cuique temporis ad vivendum datur, eo debet esse contentus. --Cicero, De Senectute
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Re: Latin phrase

Postby jamesbath » Sat Sep 25, 2010 10:40 pm

I like what Thesaurus suggested. But if you want to change your original slogan, let me present this idea: "Cano vivere!" -- I sing to live! (If I am not mistaken, the infinitive here is the Infinitive of Purpose).

Of course, I am often wrong and still hacking my way through a dense jungle of linguistic ignorance.
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Re: Latin phrase

Postby furrykef » Sat Sep 25, 2010 10:42 pm

I second thesaurus's suggestion; I was about to make the same one myself.
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Re: Latin phrase

Postby fiddlercrab » Sun Sep 26, 2010 11:26 pm

Thanks for all the responses! I have a couple of follow-up questions and then I'll stop bothering people: Would "cantare" also work? For certain reasons I need my motto to be just a tad longer. Also do both "canto" and "cantare' refer to instrumental as well as singing? I get a more vocal impression from these words.

Now a different motto: How would I best say "In music, happiness"? Thanks again!
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Re: Latin phrase

Postby Kasper » Mon Sep 27, 2010 3:53 am

Much like in English, there appears to be no single latin word for 'I play/make music'. I think cano/canto does primarily imply singing, although perhaps its meaning may be extended to include playing an instrument.

It depends on how much longer you will allow the phrase to be, but "ludo musicam ergo sum" is quite literal and would work, in my opinion. (cf. Vergilius's Eclogua A - "Ille meas errare boves, ut cernis, et ipsum ludere quae vellem calamo permisit agresti.)

In music, happiness = In musica, felicitas.
“Cum ego verbo utar,” Humpty Dumpty dixit voce contempta, “indicat illud quod optem – nec plus nec minus.”
“Est tamen rogatio” dixit Alice, “an efficere verba tot res indicare possis.”
“Rogatio est, “Humpty Dumpty responsit, “quae fiat magister – id cunctum est.”
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Re: Latin phrase

Postby fiddlercrab » Mon Sep 27, 2010 4:26 am

Thanks Kasper! Just one question about "ludo". Does it mean "play" equally to music as "play" in English does to music or games, or is it used more with sports or games? What about "facio" or "feci" as in to make/do music? Or is that used more for a physical object? I know that classical violin makers would typically say in their labels, "facibat anno 17--"
Also, is it "musica" or "musico"?
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Re: Latin phrase

Postby Kasper » Mon Sep 27, 2010 11:06 pm

Yes, ludo can be used to mean to play music. The line I cited from Vergil says "... ipsum ludere quae vellem calamo permisit agresti", which roughly means "and he permits me to play what I like on my country reed-pipe/flute".

I'm not sure about facio; although that is not to say that it could not be used. It has many meanings depending on the context, but, very generally speaking, it has more to do with manufacture, creation, production or composition of something. I know the phrase 'carmina facere' means to compose or write songs/poetry, rather than singing or reading out loud.

Regarding the classical violin makers, i think 'faciebat' refers to the making of the violin, not playing music on it.

The noun is musica. Musico is ablative or dative of musicus, an adjective.

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“Cum ego verbo utar,” Humpty Dumpty dixit voce contempta, “indicat illud quod optem – nec plus nec minus.”
“Est tamen rogatio” dixit Alice, “an efficere verba tot res indicare possis.”
“Rogatio est, “Humpty Dumpty responsit, “quae fiat magister – id cunctum est.”
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Re: Latin phrase

Postby jamesbath » Tue Sep 28, 2010 11:42 am

I copied the text below and included the url because I found it interesting that this choir seemed to use the participle of ludo in its name. I would think it means "Playing Music".

"Chamber choir – Musica Ludens The choir was founded in January 1995. Presently, it has 25 members, but this number is gradually increasing. The musical conductor of the choir between 1995 and 1996 was Marianna Vékey, répétiteur of the Choir of the Hungarian Radio." -- http://www.musicaludens.org/content/cv-our-choir
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Re: Latin phrase

Postby Kasper » Tue Sep 28, 2010 11:22 pm

In Musica Ludens, musica is either nominative or ablative. It would therefore be "music playing", or perhaps "playing with music", but not "playing music".
“Cum ego verbo utar,” Humpty Dumpty dixit voce contempta, “indicat illud quod optem – nec plus nec minus.”
“Est tamen rogatio” dixit Alice, “an efficere verba tot res indicare possis.”
“Rogatio est, “Humpty Dumpty responsit, “quae fiat magister – id cunctum est.”
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Re: Latin phrase

Postby jamesbath » Wed Sep 29, 2010 11:38 am

Kasper wrote:In Musica Ludens, musica is either nominative or ablative. It would therefore be "music playing", or perhaps "playing with music", but not "playing music".


Thanks for clearing that up.
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