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Moreland & Fleisher: too tough?

Are you learning Latin with Latin: An Intensive Course by Moreland and Fleischer? Here's where you can meet other learners using this textbook. Use this board to ask questions and post your work for feedback.

Moreland & Fleisher: too tough?

Postby Talmid » Wed Jun 13, 2007 5:27 pm

Wow. It's been almost a year since somebody last posted a topic on this Moreland & Fleisher board! It seems that this textbook isn't anywhere near as popular as Wheelock's based upon the infrequent activity on this discussion forum.

Anyway, myself having just finished reading M&F for the first time, I'm not surprised that most would prefer using Wheelock's over M&F. My impression is that M&F attempts to package everything there is to know about Latin into a begining grammar book. I think much of M&F would be better suited for an intermediate textbook instead--there is just way too much information about the rare, intricate features of syntax, which I felt was just time-boggling and unnecessary for the beginning student just wanting to learn how to translate. Perhaps it would be better marketed as a beginning and intermediate textbook all wrapped up into one.

Hard to imagine the textbook was originally designed for the 4-week summer workshop courses at UC Berkely and Brooklyn College!

Undoubtedly if the student has the discipline to finish this book and work through all the exercises, he will be better equipped than the student who has only completed Wheelock's. But it will take much longer for him to work through M&F than it would Wheelock's.

Well, these are just my thoughts about the matter. Anybody else care to share some impressions?
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Floyd and Rita's Latin (AKA M&F)

Postby jeleme » Fri Jul 06, 2007 1:57 am

Yikes, I just finished a 5 week Intensive Latin Course using M & F or as I like to call them, Floyd and Rita.

I am afraid that since I put all that Latin into my head so fast, it is going to leave my head equally as fast. Although I probably would have enjoyed a more normal paced class because I might have had a chance to learn more cultural references along with the verbal system, nevertheless I enjoyed the challenge. (Did I just write a 'cum' clause with a 'tamen' in the second clause? I think I did)
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Postby Talmid » Tue Jul 10, 2007 11:58 pm

jeleme -

Thanks for the reply!

I often wonder what professors must think when students are put through such intensive formats for language courses. I saw the same thing in seminary--we had a course called "Gladiator Greek" since only the tough could survive a brutal 7 weeks of Greek four hours every day. At the end these guys were left relying heavily on charts to get them by the second year Greek courses when the traditionally taught Greek students did not need these charts in the same courses.

Anyway, I'm going back again through M&F and finding that I'm learning more and more each time since it certainly did not stick the first time through.
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Postby Jeff Tirey » Fri Jul 25, 2008 7:46 am

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Re: Moreland & Fleisher: too tough?

Postby procrastinator » Mon Aug 23, 2010 2:45 pm

jeleme,

It's funny because I've just been reading a book on memory and it specifically mentions the feeling you're describing, where you crammed for the course and now feel as though it's floating around in your head and about to fall out. The book says that a good way of consolidating what you know is to overlearn, i.e. keep reviewing and testing yourself.
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Re: Moreland & Fleisher: too tough?

Postby procrastinator » Mon Sep 13, 2010 1:43 pm

Just to comment on the difficulty of M&F. I tried reading it to learn Latin by myself after having completed some chapters of Wheelock's, but found that too much material was presented in each chapter. I gave up at chapter 3, where the whole passive system was shown, complete with perfect tenses, the imperfect, and future as well as the present tense. M&F did give a good overview though, which is something that Wheelock doesn't do because it feeds you little pieces at a time (you can look at the tables at the end of the book though if you want).
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Re: Moreland & Fleisher: too tough?

Postby Jefferson Cicero » Wed Oct 06, 2010 4:59 pm

Sometimes I think that M&F is best for those who have already been through Wheelock or some other simpler introduction. If you're going to use it as your primary introduction, definitely take some extra time with it.
'Greek had to be simplified, and Latin had to be replaced with Italian, because we barbarians stole so many Greek and Latin words.'
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