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Problem with Fabius Maximus, and a qua

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Problem with Fabius Maximus, and a qua

Postby phil » Tue Jul 20, 2010 10:26 pm

Fabius Maximus is closely following, but not engaging with Hannibal's army.

Dux neque occāsiōnī reī bene gerendae deerat, sī qua ab hoste darētur, neque ūllam ipse hostī dabat. Itaque cum ex levibus proeliīs superior discēderet, mīlitem minus iam coepit aut virtūtis suae aut fortūnae paenitēre, et ipse Cunctātōris nomen et laudem summī ducis meruit.

The general was neither averse to the opportunity of fighting a battle, if one were given by the enemy, nor did he himself give an opening to them. And so, although he had emerged victorious from a few skirmishes, (and this is where it all turns to custard) he began to regret the soldier less now, either of his own valour or luck, and he himself merited the name of Delayer, and the renown of a great leader.

Can someone help with that middle bit?

And that qua, without the macron. I can't find it anywhere. Whitaker's Words program has it as a pronoun, feminine, nominative, singular, but I can't find it in either of my dictionaries, or Wheelock. Am I blind?

Phil
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Re: Problem with Fabius Maximus, and a qua

Postby adrianus » Thu Jul 22, 2010 12:02 am

Salve phil

quā, i.e., by/in some way, for some reason
quā, id est, quā viā, quà ratiōne, aliquā ratiōne
(Virgilius "si qua fata sinant" = "if somehow the fates would permit")

Maybe this // Fortassè hoc:
"Therefore when he did emerge victorious from light encounters, it came about* from the soldiery being less indeed dissatisfied with its own power or chance[s]"
[i.e., he only fought small battles that he was optimistic about winning
id est, proelia sola gessit quae ferre potuit]

aliquem alicuius rei paenitere

* "...it took its beginning/had as its origins/arose that the soldiery was..."
I'm writing in Latin hoping for correction, and not because I'm confident in how I express myself. Latinè scribo ut ab omnibus corrigar, non quod confidenter me exprimam.
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Re: Problem with Fabius Maximus, and a qua

Postby Carolus Raeticus » Thu Jul 22, 2010 11:32 am

Salve Adriane!

Phil quotes the sentence
Dux neque occāsiōnī reī bene gerendae deerat, sī qua ab hoste darētur, neque ūllam ipse hostī dabat.

and I am wondering:

Why can't the qua in that sentence be the shortened form of aliqua? I remember that there is a rule that after "si, nisi, ne, num, quo, ubi, quanto, cum" the "ali" in "aliqu*" is dropped. If that were the case qua would mean aliqua and would refer to occasioni. That part of the sentence might be rendered like: "[...] if any [opportunity] was given by the enemy." Isn't that also a possible solution?

Valete commilitones!

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Re: Problem with Fabius Maximus, and a qua

Postby adrianus » Thu Jul 22, 2010 1:26 pm

That's more appropriate indeed, I reckon, Carolus.
Id certè aptius est, puto, Carole.
I'm writing in Latin hoping for correction, and not because I'm confident in how I express myself. Latinè scribo ut ab omnibus corrigar, non quod confidenter me exprimam.
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Re: Problem with Fabius Maximus, and a qua

Postby phil » Sat Jul 24, 2010 1:50 am

thanks muchly. aliqua.I hadn't come close to thinking of that.Cheers.
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Re: Problem with Fabius Maximus, and a qua

Postby phil » Mon Aug 02, 2010 2:50 am

I've been looking at this some more, and I find that paenitēre can sometimes be used personally. Here's what I found in a dictionary:

Paenitēre I Personal, A Trans.: to cause to regret, to displease: me haec condicio, Pl B Intrans : to be sorry, to regret (with GEN., and only in inf., Part., and Gerund): adsuefacere militem minus virtutis paenitere sua, Liv ...

That last quote is almost identical with the one I was having trouble with and I'm wondering if paenitere is being used personally here. "And because he'd been successful in those skirmishes, he was displeasing the soldiery less now, because of his (Fabius's) courage and successes, ...

Am I on to something? Phil.
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