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Pronunciation - is wheelockslatin.com a suitable aid?

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Pronunciation - is wheelockslatin.com a suitable aid?

Postby Lefwynium » Wed Jun 10, 2009 9:35 am

I started LFB on Monday and have so far focused soley on pronunciation. Aside from the trilled r, I want to perfect everything bar speed before I continue. The thing is, having sought out a website (http://wheelockslatin.com/chapters/introduction/introduction_consonants.html) that demonstrates the pronunciation in the book, I've come across a few omitted rules, like:

Between two vowels within a word i served in double capacity: as the vowel i forming a diphthong with the preceding vowel, and as the consonant like English y: reiectus ( = rei yectus) maior ( = mai yor), cuius ( = cui yus.) Otherwise it was usually a vowel.


Did pronunciation evolve with the language across time, and if so, do the rules put forth at wheelockslatin.com apply to "The Golden Age of Roman Lettering"?

Thanks,
Lefwynium
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Re: Pronunciation - is wheelockslatin.com a suitable aid?

Postby modus.irrealis » Wed Jun 10, 2009 12:51 pm

The pronunciation did change, quite a bit in fact as Latin turned into the Romance languages, so the Classical pronunciation is something that we have to reconstruct using different evidence, and people can disagree on things. A really good resource, though, for learning about what we know about the Classical pronunciation is Vox Latina by Allen. There's also Sturtevant's The pronunciation of Greek and Latin, which is available online. The wheelocks site as far as I know teaches the classical pronunciation.

About i between two vowels, that rule is right for the most part, but it seems the situation is a little more complicated. You can preview what Vox Latina says at http://books.google.ca/books?id=aexkj_0 ... a#PPA39,M1.
Last edited by modus.irrealis on Thu Jun 11, 2009 4:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Pronunciation - is wheelockslatin.com a suitable aid?

Postby nov.ialiste » Wed Jun 10, 2009 11:15 pm

Lefwynium wrote:Did pronunciation evolve with the language across time, and if so, do the rules put forth at wheelockslatin.com apply to "The Golden Age of Roman Lettering"?

Thanks,
Lefwynium

I have a copy of the book Vox Latina.

The list of rules at the page that you linked seem to agree with Vox Latina which concentrates on the pronunciation of the "Golden Age", as well as can be reconstructed. If you have any specific questions I could look in Vox Latina for you to find what it says.
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Re: Pronunciation - is wheelockslatin.com a suitable aid?

Postby Lefwynium » Thu Jun 11, 2009 8:36 am

Well, it appears a copy of Vox Latina might be rather useful. For the meantime I'll flick through Sturtevant's offering and continue referring to Wheelock. Thanks!
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Re: Pronunciation - is wheelockslatin.com a suitable aid?

Postby metrodorus » Tue Aug 18, 2009 7:06 pm

There is a semi- restored classical pronunciation, that Latin teachers in the USA call "American Scholastic". You may well have come across this on the Wheelock site.
I run various Latin sites, including Schola and the Latinum YouTube channel - the main portal to these is http://latinum.org.uk
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Re: Pronunciation - is wheelockslatin.com a suitable aid?

Postby Os Ridiculum » Thu Aug 27, 2009 10:20 pm

My thoughts.

It is certainly worth the effort to work at this; but, take this with 'a grain of salt'.

Pronunciation most likely varied in Latin as much as any other language. Compare English pronunciation around the USA for example. A southern draw, Y'all. A New England 'kaw' for car, a New Yorkers special version, California variations, etc. :?

What happend to 'h' in parts of England. Is it Harry or arry?
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Re: Pronunciation - is wheelockslatin.com a suitable aid?

Postby metrodorus » Wed Nov 25, 2009 7:07 pm

Of course pronunciation varied in Latin in ancient times - no-one in their right mind would dispute that, and indeed there is a whole poem by Catullus dealing with someone with an 'h' problem.
The restored Classical is the restoration of the pronunciation of the highly educated classes ( the ones, basically, who wrote what has come down to us). There is an enormous volume of evidence for this pronunciation - and, on most matters, little remains to be disputed, with wide agreement on the main features between the main experts - most recently Siher, then Allen, and Sturtevant. Their writings on this topic, and the accumulation of over 150 years of scientific linguistic analysis, amounts to a fair body of evidence, that for many aspects of the educated Roman's pronunciation around the age of Augustus, is rock solid.
I run various Latin sites, including Schola and the Latinum YouTube channel - the main portal to these is http://latinum.org.uk
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