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Collar and Daniell

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Collar and Daniell

Postby amans » Tue Aug 11, 2009 5:57 pm

Salvete Textkitters!

I am back after a very long break. Life has its ups and its down, I suppose, and since I am not so happy these days, I thought I would revive a former passion of mine and take up my studies in Greek and Latin again. I have studied these eminent languages before and greatly enjoyed them.

For my present Latin studies, I am using the Collar and Daniell textbook; do others have experience with this book? I find it very easy and hope to be through it within a week or two since I have discovered that what I have already learnt years ago can be re-learnt with relative ease. All the hard work has not been in vain. :D

I would love to hear from others using the C&D; I wonder why there is no particular forum devoted to this learning system since there are fora for three other textbooks. In my estimate C&D's book covers the basic grammar but I do find the repetitiveness of the exercises a bit dull... I have, however, come to a point where there are little stories (#199 on Proserpina), which makes ít more fun in my opinion.

I wonder if anyone else has noted that page 83 of the PDF is missing.

Vobis omnibus diem bonum opto.
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Re: Collar and Daniell

Postby little flower » Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:30 pm

hi amans
Good to have you back in the forum.I was just reviewing some of c@g on some topics i am having difficulties with (eg. gerund and gerundives).Bit clearer if a bit more sparse compared to other texts.Do you have an answer key to the exercises.? It would help a lot if i could refer from the paragraph no's (i.e in the index) rather than page no's (the table of contents).Any ideas.?
thanks
little flower.
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Re: Collar and Daniell

Postby amans » Wed Aug 12, 2009 11:11 am

Hi Little Flower

Thank you. I do not have an answer key but feel free to ask; I would be glad to be of help if I can. I do remember that the gerund and gerundives tend to cause confusion... Docendo discimus; quam discendi rogent.

It is fine with me to refer to paragraph numbers. I just wondered why there was a page missing in the PDF and if any essential information might have been on it. In that case I will need to rely on other books and this forum. :D

Cura ut valeas.
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Re: Collar and Daniell

Postby adrianus » Wed Aug 12, 2009 1:17 pm

Salve amans
Here it is (page 83). // Ecce pagina octoginta tres quam quaeris: http://www.teachyourselflatin.com/First_Year_Latin__Collar_Daniell.php?image_id=83
I'm writing in Latin hoping for correction, and not because I'm confident in how I express myself. Latinè scribo ut ab omnibus corrigar, non quod confidenter me exprimam.
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Re: Collar and Daniell

Postby amans » Wed Aug 12, 2009 4:24 pm

Salve adriane

Tibi gratias magnas refero ut curam habuisti me in hunc situs interretialem referre. :D

Fac valeas.



Post scriptum: I am actually not sure that Latin syntax allows me to add an infitive to curam the way I do but that is what I can come up with stante pede...
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Re: Collar and Daniell

Postby adrianus » Thu Aug 13, 2009 2:23 am

amans wrote:I am actually not sure that Latin syntax allows me to add an infitive to curam the way I do but that is what I can come up with stante pede...

What about this, amans?
Quid de hôc, amans?
"Tibi gratias magnas refero qui curam habueris ut me ad hunc situm interretialem referres."
I'm writing in Latin hoping for correction, and not because I'm confident in how I express myself. Latinè scribo ut ab omnibus corrigar, non quod confidenter me exprimam.
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Re: Collar and Daniell

Postby amans » Thu Aug 13, 2009 5:08 pm

Salve adriane

Ah, so you use an ut clause linked to curam instead of the infinitive. I wonder where one can see rules governing these things.

Perhaps one could also use a gerund in the genitive with cura and a possessive pronoun in the ablative?

Tibi gratias magnas refero cura tua me ad hunc situm interretialem referendi.

As to your particular suggestion:

- Qui: Are you using qui the pronoun here? And is it referring to tibi?

- Habueris: I wonder why you employ the future perfect.

And you are right. It should of course be situm; I should do a little review of th 4th declension. :D
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Re: Collar and Daniell

Postby adrianus » Thu Aug 13, 2009 8:24 pm

Salve amans

You'll find these phrases in lots of places: "cura [verbum modo imperativo scilicet] ut..." et "curam habuit ut..." // passim invenies.

"tibi qui curam habueris" = "to you who [/because you] took [/would have taken] the trouble".
"qui" because//propter hoc "A Relative Clause of Characteristic may express cause or concession" (A&G, §535e),—for example // exempli gratiâ, "peccasse mihi videor qui a te discesserim", "I seem to myself to have done wrong because I have left you" (same place // ibidem).
"habueris" (praeterito perfecto tempore modo subjunctivo) not because // non quod "after a primary tense the Perfect Subjunctive is regularly used to denote any past action" (A&G, §485b) but because // immò propter hoc "A Relative, when used to express cause, regularly takes the Subjunctive" (A&G, §540c).
"referres", because//quià "When a clause depends upon one already dependent, its sequence may be secondary if the verb of that clause expresses past time, even if the main verb is in a primary tense" (A&G, §485j).

Non "curâ tuâ me referendi" sed "de tuâ curâ mei referendi", puto. Fortassè erro. Maybe I'm wrong.
I'm writing in Latin hoping for correction, and not because I'm confident in how I express myself. Latinè scribo ut ab omnibus corrigar, non quod confidenter me exprimam.
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