The case of Agamemnon

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Interaxus
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The case of Agamemnon

Post by Interaxus »

In Legends of Gods and Heroes (Morton) I read the following sentences:

Clytaemnestra, uxor Agamemnonis, iram acerbam in maritum suum fovebat.
C, A's wife, cherished a bitter hatred against her husband

Ferebatur Agamemnon novis nuptiis studere.
It was reported that A desired a new marriage

(Clytaemnestra) Agamemnonem, nihil fraudis suspicantem, in balneo inermem occidit.
C killed the unarmed A, suspecting no treachery, in his bath

WHY, in the second sentence, IS Agamemnon NOT ACCUSATIVE? Is it not an accusative + infinitive construction? :?

Cheers,
Int

Alatius
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Re: The case of Agamemnon

Post by Alatius »

Check your dictionary: feri is personal, and takes nom. c. inf. (Jmf. svenska: "Han sades...", ej *"Det sades honom..." ) In other words, "Agamemnon" is the subject of "ferebatur".

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benissimus
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Re: The case of Agamemnon

Post by benissimus »

I tend to view it this way: where English prefers "It was said that Agamemnon desired...", Latin prefers the construction "Agamemnon was said to desire..."
flebile nescio quid queritur lyra, flebile lingua murmurat exanimis, respondent flebile ripae

Superavi
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Re: The case of Agamemnon

Post by Superavi »

I could easily be wrong on this, but if that was the case , benissimus, wouldn't the sentence then be reported speech and need the second verb in the subjunctive?

timeodanaos
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Re: The case of Agamemnon

Post by timeodanaos »

Verbs that demand accusative with infinitive in the active voice, demand nominative with infinitive in the passive.

Sjöstrand §218:Sjöstrand §218: Infinitiv står som fyllnadsbestämning till passiva former av vissa verba dicendi, sentiendi och voluntatis, som i aktivum styra ack. m. inf. Satsen Romulus Romam condidisse dicitur "Romulus säges ha grundlagt Rom" motsvaras av Dicunt Romulum Romam condidisse "Man sägar att Romulus grundlade Rom". Då subjektsackusativen i den senare satsen blir subjekt i den förra och infinitiven bibehålles, kallas konstruktionen nominativ med infinitiv. Subjektiv predikatsfyllnad och den böjliga delen av sammansatt infinitiv stå i nominativ. - Fri översättning är ofte önskvärd.

I would have quoted Madvig, but I take it Swedes prefer Swedish :p

Interaxus
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Re: The case of Agamemnon

Post by Interaxus »

Here’s a late thankyou for the prompt resolution of my problem.

Yes, Alatius, my Latin-Swedish dictionary has this example under ’feri’: ’is regem interemisse fertur’ – ’han lär ha dödat’ (for non-Swedish speakers: ’he is said/supposed/believed to have killed’ (the king)). Much like your example, Benissimus ("Agamemnon was said to desire...").

As a matter of interest, Lewis & Short has:

c. (See Zumpt, Gram. § 607.) Dicor, diceris, dicitur, with nom. and inf., it is said that I, thou, he, etc.; or, they say that I, thou, etc.

and it quotes Horace (Ode 3.30): ‘dicar.../ princeps Aeolium carmen ad Italos / deduxisse modos’ (I’ll be declared the first to have imported Aeolian song to Italic verse’). That gives me an extra handle on an old favourite. :)

Timeodaneos: thanks for the Sjöstrand tip. My only Swedish grammar up to now has been Tidner (it too takes up the Nom. & Infin. so I have no excuse). I’ve now acquired a Sjöstrand (seemingly the last copy available on the Net). It’s a beaut! More comprehensive than Tidner. Is Madvig even better? And who’s that Zumpt fellow? Speaking of nationalities, I confess I’m an expat. English, actually.

Cheers,
Int

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