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Help with Athenaze chapter 13

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Help with Athenaze chapter 13

Postby marcofurio » Fri Feb 13, 2009 9:47 pm

Hello everybody, I am new to this forum and hope you can help me with my self-learning of ancient greek. I am using Athenaze´s method (italian version) and have got stuck in a certain paragraph. It refers to an old sailor who fought in Salamina. He speaks of how the athenians left their city empty when persians arrived.

Οἰ δὲ ἅνδρες οὔτε ἐν τοῖς τείχεσιν οὔτε ἐν κατὰ τὰς ὁδοὺς ἀλλ´ ἐν ταῖς τριήρεσιν ἐν τῇ θαλάττῃ περιέμενον τοὺς πολεμίους, (...) ἐπιδεῖξαι γὰρ βουλόμενοι ὄτι ἐν τοῖς ναυτικοῖς κινδύνοις, ὥσπερ ἐν τοῖς πεζοῖς, ἣ ἀρετὴ ἀεὶ τοῦ πλήθους περιγίγνεται, ἐνόμισαν ἅνδρας εἷναι τῷ ὄντι πόλιν, καὶ οὐ τείχη οὐδὲ τριήρεις ἀνδρῶν κενάς.

I translated this as follows: The men waited for the enemies not in the city walls or roadways but in the sea... wanting to show that in sea troubles as on the land courage always prevails on number considered to leave men in the city? and neither city walls nor ships were devoid of men.

I really do not understand the bold text. What is referred to by "τῷ ὄντι", Why the acussative πόλις? Is it a locative?

Thanks in advance,
marcofurio
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Re: Help with Athenaze chapter 13

Postby annis » Fri Feb 13, 2009 9:59 pm

ἐνόμισαν ἅνδρας εἷναι τῷ ὄντι πόλιν,

marcofurio wrote: I translated this as follows: The men waited for the enemies not in the city walls or roadways but in the sea... wanting to show that in sea troubles as on the land courage always prevails on number considered to leave men in the city? and neither city walls nor ships were devoid of men.

I really do not understand the bold text. What is referred to by "τῷ ὄντι", Why the acussative πόλις? Is it a locative?


τῷ ὄντι is an idiom for "in reality, in truth" or the like.

νομίζω Χ Υ, "to consider X (to be) Y" sometimes has εἶναι, sometimes does not.
William S. Annis — http://www.aoidoi.org/http://www.scholiastae.org/
τίς πατέρ' αἰνήσει εἰ μὴ κακοδαίμονες υἱοί;
annis
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Re: Help with Athenaze chapter 13

Postby marcofurio » Sat Feb 14, 2009 3:15 pm

Thank you very much Annis for your incredibly fast and precise answer!

Marco
marcofurio
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