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English To Latin Help please

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English To Latin Help please

Postby lachlan » Mon Oct 27, 2008 2:33 am

hi, i was just wondering if someone could let me know if Im right with my translations.
thnx in advance!

-while we speak, the hours are fleeing and old age calls our names!
* on a side note... the exclamation point does that mean there should be a imperative? im not too sure what it would be going on.. it would be on a verb would it be calls?

anyways
dum dicimus, horae fugiunt et senectutem nostra nomines ducite!
????

-the desire for true friendship will always live in the hearts of many men and women.

** i dont know the word for hearts, & we've only covered up to chapter 11 in wheelock and usually we dont get words that we havent covered.. and either im completely retarded or I dont think Ive learnt the word for heart...

verae amicitae semper vivet in ...... (hearts in the ablative plural) ... multae virorum et feminarum cupiditas

i really would appreciate any feedback.
thanks,
Lachie!
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Re: English To Latin Help please

Postby Alatius » Mon Oct 27, 2008 7:57 am

lachlan wrote:-while we speak, the hours are fleeing and old age calls our names!
* on a side note... the exclamation point does that mean there should be a imperative? im not too sure what it would be going on.. it would be on a verb would it be calls?

Well, the exclamation mark is often used after imperative sentences, but it is also used after declaratory sentences that are seen ase sensational or astonishing. And many imperative sentences may lack the exclamation mark. (If I write "Shut up." it would be read differently from "Shut up!", but both are imperatives.) Therefore, you can't imply from the existence or non-existence of the exclamation mark whether the sentence is imperative or not. Instead, read the sentence, and ask yourself if it contains any direct command or request. If so, that's an imperative. But, N.B., you must analyse on a grammatical level, not on a broader, semantical level. For, while "Don't worry; be happy." contains two imperatives, "I want you to be happy!" contains none. On a semantical level, it may be taken as a command/request, but grammatically it is a simple declaratory statement ("I want [something]").

Mkay? Now, in your sentence, are there any imperatives? No, there are only declaratory statements ("the hours are fleeing" and "old age calls our names"). Translate accordingly.

dum dicimus, horae fugiunt et senectutem nostra nomines ducite!
????

No need for all those question marks; it's pretty good. But, what case is "senectutem" in? What should it be? Why? What gender does "nomen" have? How is it declined? "Ducite" I have addressed above. (Wait a minute, what does "duco" mean?)

-the desire for true friendship will always live in the hearts of many men and women.

** i dont know the word for hearts, & we've only covered up to chapter 11 in wheelock and usually we dont get words that we havent covered.. and either im completely retarded or I dont think Ive learnt the word for heart...

Hm, you may be right. The copy of Wheelock's I have (6th edition) does indeed not list the word for "heart" in its vocabulary. It is "cor, cordis, n". But, in the English-Latin vocabulary section, there is an entry for "heart (in one's)": "use personal pron. in dat. case (dat. of reference, e.g. mihi, tibi)"

verae amicitae semper vivet in ...... (hearts in the ablative plural) ... multae virorum et feminarum cupiditas

Not bad at all! However, the separation of "verae amicitiae" and "cupiditas" is very daring. It would be much clearer if you moved them together. Also, "multae" is incorrect. What part of speech is it? How should it be inflected? Why?

If you follow the advice above, and use the dative instead of "in cordibus aliquorum", how would the sentence look then?

i really would appreciate any feedback.

As a starter, learn to use capital letters in the correct places. Trust me, it would give a much better impression.
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Postby Kasper » Mon Oct 27, 2008 10:20 pm

Really great and thorough reply, Alatius.

Except for your last comment, which i thought that was unnecessary and uncalled for. we are not writing doctoral theses here, and some looseness in spelling and grammar, and punctuation for that matter, should be freely tolerated, mea in sententia.

Cheers,
K
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Postby Alatius » Mon Oct 27, 2008 11:42 pm

Yes, I realize it is a somewhat snide remark, and for that I am sorry. :oops: I did in no way mean to imply that some looseness in spelling and grammar should not be allowed here. Rather, I meant it as sincere advice: if all your communication is done through text, the way you write will unquestionably have a large influence on what impression you give of yourself. And, regrettably and unfortunately, not everyone is as tolerating as Kasper.

Personally, I believe that there is no question that it be better to write in a somewhat relaxed manner, than to not write at all! And I look forward to helping you, lachlan, with any problems with Latin that you may have in the future. Don't you think otherwise! :)
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Postby Lex » Tue Oct 28, 2008 2:54 am

Alatius wrote:Yes, I realize it is a somewhat snide remark, and for that I am sorry...


Don't be sorry; you were right the first time. The e e cummings / bell hooks / netd00dz approach to writing is atrocious. My opinion is that the spelling, capitalization, punctuation, and spacing conventions in English must have come about for a reason. I'm guessing it had something to do with readability. the new net n texting wayz r 2 die 4 if u r a lazy typist but omg their readability sux. It's more considerate to the reader to make your writing as clear and readable as you can. It's also good practice, for those times when you have to write correctly, to ... write correctly. And how can you expect to master a foreign language, if you're not willing to master your own? ttfn
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Postby Kasper » Tue Oct 28, 2008 3:21 am

Lex wrote:the new net n texting wayz r 2 die 4 if u r a lazy typist but omg their readability sux.


On this (having decyphered it) i wholeheartedly agree, lex. Beyond this, you are wrong. :wink:

Mastery of language does not only mean having the capability to write in a formalistic manner, but to be be equally, if not more, adept at more casual or colloquial mannerisms.
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Postby calvinist » Tue Oct 28, 2008 3:23 am

Lex wrote:
Alatius wrote:Yes, I realize it is a somewhat snide remark, and for that I am sorry...


Don't be sorry; you were right the first time. The e e cummings / bell hooks / netd00dz approach to writing is atrocious. My opinion is that the spelling, capitalization, punctuation, and spacing conventions in English must have come about for a reason. I'm guessing it had something to do with readability. the new net n texting wayz r 2 die 4 if u r a lazy typist but omg their readability sux. It's more considerate to the reader to make your writing as clear and readable as you can. It's also good practice, for those times when you have to write correctly, to ... write correctly. And how can you expect to master a foreign language, if you're not willing to master your own? ttfn

i have to admit... i'm guilty of that!.... :lol: Seriously though, I agree with you guys. I've noticed that I go back and forth in my posts. It must have something to do with my mood!
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Postby Lex » Tue Oct 28, 2008 3:53 am

Kasper wrote:.Mastery of language does not only mean having the capability to write in a formalistic manner, but to be be equally, if not more, adept at more casual or colloquial mannerisms.


Hmmm.... I sort of agree. I myself am not above using slang, phonetic spelling, or what have you, to add "flavor" to my posts. And extreme pedanticism in grammar is "nonsense up with which I shall not put" (I have to give credit to Churchill for that one). But I think that it's better to have some grasp of the formal "rules" first, then learn when to break them for stylistic reasons, than the other way around.
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Postby Lex » Tue Oct 28, 2008 3:58 am

calvinist wrote:I've noticed that I go back and forth in my posts. It must have something to do with my mood!


My moods affect my posts too, but in a different way. Sometimes I'm semi-civil, sometimes I'm a sarcastic curmudgeonly SOB. :wink:
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