Summer Latin lectures

[Gonzalo]

Ηι,

I give birth a new topic because I was wondering what you are going to read or what you have planned to read in Latin during this summer. I am going to finish Lingua Latina per se illustrata II: Roma Æterna and I am now working thorugh chapter XLII (3 -3 and a half- hours per day. In fact, finishing it, I love Livy: I read it twice or three times and then I do the exercises). I am going to read again Sermones Romani too and then I'm going to read also Cæsar's Commentaries on Gallic wars from Perseus edition with commentaries &c., or in Oerberg's edition if possible. Besides, Ι'll continue my Phædrus' fables verse translation and I'll probably translate Juvenal's Satire III. If I have time I'd like to read Pomponius Mela's De situ Orbis from an edition I've prepared. And what about you?

Regards,
Gonzalo

[Deses]

The Aeneid (it is with me at all times). Also, out of curiosity, started reading De incertitudine et vanitate scientiarum atque artium declamatio invectiva by Heinrich Agrippa.

[Twpsyn]

I am currently reading Suetonius's De Vita Caesarum. I am about half-way through Augustus.

[Gonzalo]

Very nice and thanks for your commentaries.

I have always with me Vergil's full works and I read a bit of his Bucolics every day. The Æneid is excessive for me.

[Twpsyn]

The Aeneid and Suetonius happen to be the two most recent Latin works I've read or are reading, and I must say I found Vergil the easier of the two. Part of it, I think, is that I had been reading poetry for so long I got very used to poetic diction, and returning to prose was jarring; another aspect is Suetonius's political and military jargon, which, I not having read anything like Caesar in school, was unfamiliar; and third, Suetonius is post-classical so his Latin is sometimes a bit 'odd'. That's my perspective, anyway. I hope you get to the Aeneid some time, it's lovely. If you're reading other Vergil, it should not be too hard.

[Gonzalo]

Well, I've read a bit of Vergil's Æneid from the second volume of the method I follow (Oerberg's Lingua Latina) and I can understand what I read from my method but when I try to read from the Oxford Vergilii opera omina (the text of his full works which I have) it's sometimes a bit hard. I am getting used to Latin poetry from Oerberg's method because it presents little excerpts (not more than 50 or 60 lines) of poetry (mainly Ovidius and Vergil) and then I can understand but I need more time. I usually read Bucolics because (even though there are parts where I get lost) it's of an incredible beauty.

[thesaurus]

I'm dabbling here and there. I spend most of my allotted Latin time reading Cicero. So far this summer I've read In Verrem I, Pro Milone, and most recently Pro Caelio. Besides that, I've read a number of Seneca's letters, a scattering of Renaissance stuff like Pietro Bembo, and finally finished the first book of the Aeneid.

I had thought to try to get through as much of the Aeneid as possible, but that's probably not going to happen. I'm trying to figure out what to read next, and it'll probably be Cicero's Tusculanae Quaestiones, because I think I've had enough of his speechess for now. Contrary to you, Twpsyn, I have a hard time whenever I try switching to poetry from prose... I need to work on fixing that.

Otherwise, Vicipaedia has been taking up far to much of my time.

[Essorant]

I am currently reading Thebaid by Statius.


Brotherly strife and altern reign,
Fought out with hatefulness profane,
And guilty Thebes thus to unwind
Pierian fire befalls the mind.

(A sample from a bit of translation I began on the side).<pre> </pre>

[Amadeus]

I am going to finish Lingua Latina per se illustrata II: Roma Æterna

Salve, Gundisalve!

If you can finish Roma Æterna this summer, you would have accomplished more with that book than I did! It took me almost a year to finish the book. Granted, sometimes I would go days without touching it, but the lessons do get harder and harder as you progress through it. If you think the first volume had a rich vocabulary, volume II just explodes with new words and phrases. I wasn't able to retain it all, and that's why I think a second reading would do me right. Oh, and wait 'til you get to Cicero!

Hahahae, but don't let me scare you!

[Gonzalo]

Hi, Amadeus!

I said I did a second lecture of the first volume and I think it was truly useful in order to acquire vocabulary and internalize grammatical structures after having worked hard through Familia Romana. So I recommend a mere lecture to review what you probably forgot. I've learnt from the errors I did when working through Familia Romana and now I think I won't need a second lecture of Roma Æterna -so far. I read every chapter section twice or three times and then when I've read every section, I read the chapter once or twice and then I do the exercises. I won't be able to acquire every word in Roma Æterna so that I may use every word when I want but, at least, if I find a word (in a Latin work) which appear'd in Roma Æterna I'll be able to recognize such a word. I wish I finish Roma Æterna this summer. That would be great. I've read a little excerpt of Tusculanæ disputationes by Cicero from Sermones Romani. Simply marvellous. I have a big doubt. When you finished Roma Æterna, were you able to read any (Classical) text without dictionary? And now that you've finished Roma Æterna, what are you going to do with your life?

Regards,
Gonzalo

[thesaurus]

An aside if I may: on the subject of difficult second volumes, who was it here that is also reading the Italian Athenaze? I managed to read the first volume twice over, and I just finished the second, but it was way more difficult. I came to Roma Aeterna late in the game, but I too sense that it is a steep hill to climb compared with Familia Romana. My main gripe with these Orbergian series is the rate at which they introduce new vocabulary. Of course the quantity of vocab we learn is one of their most valuable features, but I'm sure I'm not the only person who had to refer to the word-index with increasing frequency as I approached the end of the series. I'd really love to drag out both these Latine and Graece series to three volumes, but I'd introduce words and grammatical structures more gradually. Ah, dreams...

I really should start re-reading Athenaze vol. II from the beginning, but I haven't the heart for it now, and I'm sure you all feel the same urge to jump out of the Latin and Greek textbooks and into the fray.

Gonzalo, I've said it before, but it's worth trying to stick with one author for a time while transitioning into straight texts. This gives you time to grow accustom to a certain style of writing and a limited set of vocabulary. I know we like to gripe about Cicero, but I like him because (among other reasons) his Latin is very pure in the sense that he uses a moderately sized and frequently reoccurring vocabulary: no constantly referencing hapax legomena. His prose style takes some adjusting to, but again one grows accustom to this through practice.

[Lucus Eques]

I'm also in Athenaze.

Forgive me for not reading this whole thread through, but I'd like to suggest (if you haven't already) that we do a "book club" for LL:Roma Aeterna through Skype. We could take turns reading paragraphs, do a nice round with two or even a dozen people at once. Could be fun. Interested?

[Lucus Eques]

We'd also be able to discuss it in Latin, with English as an assist.

[Gonzalo]

Well, Luke. I wouldn't have any problem if I had microphone. I'm really sorry because it's a great idea. I can record from my mp3 player (I usually record chapters from Lingua Latina) but I haven't PC microphone. Anyway, a LLPS group (for instance, in Yahoo) would be interesting and I would participate without any doubt.

[Essorant]

Why don't you just begin a special thread or even a forum for it here at textkit?

[Gonzalo]

It was suggested some time ago but I think that such an idea wasn't more than a project. I don't know why there are forums for specific methods and there is no one for Lingua Latina when a lot of people here use it.
http://www.textkit.com/greek-latin-foru ... tina+forum

[Amadeus]

now I think I won't need a second lecture of Roma Æterna -so far. I read every chapter section twice or three times and then when I've read every section, I read the chapter once or twice and then I do the exercises.

Ook. But don't say I didn't warn ya. I too read every section several times. That was in fact my method with part I: I almost memorized each section before moving on. But part II is just so big! What I want to do now is record myself reading the sections. The only obstacle is time: I have so many other things to study (Philosophy, rhetoric, Ancient Greek, German...).

I have a big doubt. When you finished Roma Æterna, were you able to read any (Classical) text without dictionary? And now that you've finished Roma Æterna, what are you going to do with your life?

Unfortunately, no. I didn't have the money to buy the Classical texts right after LL. I know there are free versions on-line, but it's such a strain on the eyes. What I'd do is buy some of the other Ørberg series before really jumping to "pure" texts. As to what to do with one's life after LL, that is something which I don't think anyone can tell you. You have to decide for yourself. (Yes, I know you were being facetious lol )

Why don't you just begin a special thread or even a forum for it here at textkit?

These are the two longest threads on the Lingua Latina series: Part I and Part II In my opinion (and I've expressed it before), posters should stick to these threads when asking questions about the books. This way everything is in one place.

[cdm2003]

...but I'd like to suggest (if you haven't already) that we do a "book club" for LL:Roma Aeterna through Skype. We could take turns reading paragraphs, do a nice round with two or even a dozen people at once. Could be fun. Interested?

This would be very fun and also great fun. Also, a good way to help each other through tough sentences, pronunciation, etc.

[The Sloth]

I'm finishing most of Orberg's "Lingua Latina" (on Ch. 24 now), and moving on in Adler's "Practical Grammar," thru the Latinam podcast. In short, I'm re-learning Latin, the "natural" way.

[Gonzalo]

Hi,

How are you? I have not been finally able to finish LLPSI II. I have worked through LLPSI II up to chapter L (included) and it has been much harder than I believed in a first moment. There are chapters which are longer than 30 pages (see chapter XLVIII) and exercises use to be more complicated than usually. So, in my opinion LLPS is good to be used from the first chapter up to chapter XLIX approximately as a method to learn Latin and get a great basis in Latin and the rest could be regarded as a reader or a chrestomathy. I mean, the second part is not worse than the first one but it would be better if Oerberg had divided the longest chapters in LLPSI II into sections and he had made exercises for concrete sections of the chapter which is to be read. I can read Latin prose without much troubles and I am beginning Virgil too. Firstly, I have read and done the exercises up to chapter XLV and then I began to read it another time up to chapter L doing only orally the exercises.

In other order of things, I have translated into Spanish verse a great amount of those fables about which I talked about, I have read Cicero's Academica Priora and his first book of De finibus bonorum et malorum (I am right now reading the second book) and Terence's Phormio too. I have not read finally Cæsar's commentaries because LLPSI II has a lot of history stuff.

Regards,
Gonzalo

[MarcusE]

I'm just on chapter 21 of LL pars I and I'm enjoying it quite a lot but I can see that from the point of view of modern language acquisition theory the series should be three times longer, that is the new grammar and vocab should be spread of the 3 times as much text. You can climb just as high when the slope is long and gradual as you can when it's shorter and steep.

My fantasy is a series of graded latin novels modeled on the Cambridge University Press excellent series of graded English readers. They would start at a level about 3/4th of the way through Familia Romana and take through the grammar and vocab of LLPSI part 2 but spread out over much more text (I'm thinking at least a half million words total if not a full million), all of it entertaining fiction. They would include murder mysteries set in ancient Rome (like the Gordianus the Finder and M. Didius Falco books), stories built around the exploits of a Roman soldiers, etc. All in increasingly more and more advanced latin providing massive amounts of comprehensible input. They wouldn't need to be "per se illustrata" a la Orberg. A glossary in the back would be fine, but you would need enough levels (maybe 6 or 7) to make the transitions from one to the next not to difficult. The goal would be to make the reading experience all the way through as smooth as reading one of the middle chapters in LL pars I right before the slope starts to increase.

The theory is right and it would work but of course will never happen, not enough of a market for it, I suppose.

[Alatius]

The theory is right and it would work but of course will never happen, not enough of a market for it, I suppose.

On the other hand, "never" is an awfully long period of time. I wouldn't be overtly surprised if something similar would emerge within, say, 20 years or so, at least if the current trends in Latin education continues.

[MarcusE]

Good point!