Nominative Case

Here you can discuss all things Latin. Use this board to ask questions about grammar, discuss learning strategies, get help with a difficult passage of Latin, and more.
Post Reply
MDS
Textkit Fan
Posts: 209
Joined: Sat Aug 16, 2003 4:04 am
Location: Pickering, Ontario, Canada

Nominative Case

Post by MDS »

(and the barrage of questions begins...)<br /><br />Is a noun in the nominative case always the subject of the verb in any given sentence? Surely there must be exceptions....Wheelocks says: "The Romans used the nominative case most commonly to indicate the subject of a finite verb." <br /><br />So when were there exceptions and in those examples, which case was used as the subject?

User avatar
klewlis
Global Moderator
Posts: 1668
Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2003 1:48 pm
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Contact:

Re:Nominative Case

Post by klewlis »

the nominative can also be used for complement in a subject/complement pair, ie: "Billy is a boy", both nouns will be nominative. <br /><br />I assume it's also possible for an infinitive verb to act as subject (but I haven't gotten that far in wheelock yet so maybe I should shut up about subjects which I know not of ;)<br /><br />
First say to yourself what you would be; then do what you need to do. ~Epictetus

MDS
Textkit Fan
Posts: 209
Joined: Sat Aug 16, 2003 4:04 am
Location: Pickering, Ontario, Canada

Re:Nominative Case

Post by MDS »

Thanks, should have thought of the "subject/complement" pair myself but strange things happen when you think too much...<br /><br />What chaper in Wheelocks are you on?

phil
Textkit Fan
Posts: 254
Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2003 2:01 am
Location: Wellington, New Zealand

Re:Nominative Case

Post by phil »

When an infinitive is used as a noun e.g. 'to err is human' (errare humanum est) then the infinitive in a neuter noun - I cheated and looked ahead tee hee hee.<br />Phil

User avatar
klewlis
Global Moderator
Posts: 1668
Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2003 1:48 pm
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Contact:

Re:Nominative Case

Post by klewlis »

lol<br />i was about to say, "hey phil, when did you get ahead of me??"<br /><br />i'm doing the self-study for 17 as we speak. :)
First say to yourself what you would be; then do what you need to do. ~Epictetus

User avatar
benissimus
Global Moderator
Posts: 2733
Joined: Mon May 12, 2003 4:32 am
Location: Berkeley, California
Contact:

Re:Nominative Case

Post by benissimus »

There are also some strange things that occur with nominative in the passive.<br /><br />"Marcus is called a friend"<br />Marcus appellatur amicus<br /><br />Where "Marcus" seems to be the subject and "amicus" seems to be direct object. Just as in the active some verbs take double accusatives, the passive can take double nominatives.
flebile nescio quid queritur lyra, flebile lingua murmurat exanimis, respondent flebile ripae

Emma_85
Global Moderator
Posts: 1564
Joined: Thu Jul 03, 2003 8:01 pm
Location: London

Re:Nominative Case

Post by Emma_85 »

Especially with dicitur this can happen.<br /><br />Otherwise there's also the NcI, which is like the AcI only with a nominative.

Alundis
Textkit Neophyte
Posts: 65
Joined: Wed May 07, 2003 1:56 am
Location: new jersey
Contact:

Re:Nominative Case

Post by Alundis »

What is an AcI?

Keesa
Textkit Zealot
Posts: 1108
Joined: Mon Jul 28, 2003 10:59 pm

Re:Nominative Case

Post by Keesa »

For that matter, what is an NcI?

Emma_85
Global Moderator
Posts: 1564
Joined: Thu Jul 03, 2003 8:01 pm
Location: London

Re:Nominative Case

Post by Emma_85 »

AcI = Accusativum cum Infinitivo<br />NcI = Nominativum cum Infinitivo<br /><br />Surly you must have heard of the AcI?!? It's one of the most important constructions in Latin, you'll find it everywhere!

User avatar
klewlis
Global Moderator
Posts: 1668
Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2003 1:48 pm
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Contact:

Re:Nominative Case

Post by klewlis »

sure we've heard of the construction, just not your system of abbreviation ;)
First say to yourself what you would be; then do what you need to do. ~Epictetus

Keesa
Textkit Zealot
Posts: 1108
Joined: Mon Jul 28, 2003 10:59 pm

Re:Nominative Case

Post by Keesa »

Not I. :-[ But then, I'm only a beginner.

Episcopus
Textkit Zealot
Posts: 2563
Joined: Sat Jun 14, 2003 8:57 pm

Re:Nominative Case

Post by Episcopus »

Nor I. <br /><br />Is the AcI (qué?!) either:<br /><br />Imperator pedites equitatumque castra occupare iussit; <br /><br />or<br /><br />Equites castra occupare erit imperatori gratum<br /><br />?<br /><br />All these freaky AcI PhD

Emma_85
Global Moderator
Posts: 1564
Joined: Thu Jul 03, 2003 8:01 pm
Location: London

Re:Nominative Case

Post by Emma_85 »

Uhh... dunno... both look like AcIs to me... :-\

Episcopus
Textkit Zealot
Posts: 2563
Joined: Sat Jun 14, 2003 8:57 pm

Re:Nominative Case

Post by Episcopus »

Well "Imperator pedites equitatumque castra occupare iussit" <br />is a straight up wishing/ordering/forbidding Acc.<br /><br />Whereas the 2nd is "For the horsemen to take possession of the camp will be pleasing to the general". <br /><br /><br />

Emma_85
Global Moderator
Posts: 1564
Joined: Thu Jul 03, 2003 8:01 pm
Location: London

Re:Nominative Case

Post by Emma_85 »

Those are both AcIs. Hmm... I always translate Latin - German, and you actually have less ways of translating a sentence than you do in English. In German you alway tranlate an AcI: ..., dass....<br />because there is no other way to translate that construction, although there are in English, so maybe that's why you don't learn about it as much, because you can translate it more easily...<br />AcIs are every common after word to do with the senses, like see or say.

Post Reply