Pharr section 128 line 4

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Bert
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Pharr section 128 line 4

Post by Bert »

This line reads as follows: [size=150]εἴ ποτε κραιαίνει ἄναξ ἐέλδωρ ἱερῆι, δαναοὶ τίσουσι δάκρυα γέροντος βέλεσσιν θεοῦ. I think I know what this means but I would like to make sure that I am on the right path. I'll give my translation with the words in bold print being the ones that I am unsure of. Any comment will be appreciated.<br /><br />If at any time the Protector performs his will for the priest, the Greeks will pay for the tears of the old man by means of the arrows of god.

annis
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Re:Pharr section 128 line 4

Post by annis »

It looks right to me.<br /><br />I normally translate [size=150]ποτέ as "ever" when it follows [size=150]εἰ, but that's just a stylistic matter.<br /><br />
William S. Annis — http://www.aoidoi.org/http://www.scholiastae.org/
τίς πατέρ' αἰνήσει εἰ μὴ κακοδαίμονες υἱοί;

Paul
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Re:Pharr section 128 line 4

Post by Paul »

I quite agree with 'if ever' for [size=150]εἴ ποτε.<br /><br />Less sure about whose [size=150]ἐέλδωρ we're talking about. I read it as the desire not<br />of [size=150]ἄναξ, but of [size=150]ἱερῆι.<br /><br />Book A is rife with examples of neuter nouns with a dative showing almost a kind of posssion; cf. instances of [size=150]γέρας. See also A.41.<br /><br />I would translate (the meaning, not the words) as "If ever<br />the protector fulfills the priest's wish..."<br /><br />Cordially,<br /><br />Paul<br />

Bert
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Re:Pharr section 128 line 4

Post by Bert »

Thanks to both of you.<br />In trying to translate the dative [size=150]ἱερῆι I didn't even consider that it was the desire of the priest and not of Apollo. It does make more sence that way though. <br />In New Testament Greek I would have expected a word in the genitive to indicate whose desire it was.<br />Several times in Homer I have noticed that I have to supply the word 'his'. Is this a characteristic of Homer or Classical Greek in general?

annis
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Re:Pharr section 128 line 4

Post by annis »

Bert de Haan wrote:<br />In trying to translate the dative [size=150]ἱερῆι I didn't even consider that it was the desire of the priest and not of Apollo. It does make more sence that way though. <br />
<br /> <br />Yep. Grammarian types call it the "dative of interest." He accomplishes the will for the priest.<br /><br />
<br />In New Testament Greek I would have expected a word in the genitive to indicate whose desire it was.<br />Several times in Homer I have noticed that I have to supply the word 'his'. Is this a characteristic of Homer or Classical Greek in general?<br />
<br /><br />Yep. Often classical will use the definite article where an English speaker would use a possesive. [size=150]ἀεὶ ἀκούω τοῦ πατρός "I always listen to the (i.e. my) father."<br /><br />Homer will omit such things if the context is clear and it suits him to do so.
William S. Annis — http://www.aoidoi.org/http://www.scholiastae.org/
τίς πατέρ' αἰνήσει εἰ μὴ κακοδαίμονες υἱοί;

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