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XXIX, § 176: Possible corrections to key.

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XXIX, § 176: Possible corrections to key.

Postby sisyphus » Fri Apr 22, 2005 12:50 am

Salvete omnes,

FYI, i think i found a couple of minor errors here in the Textkit key.

6. i think this sentence should be in the imperfect, rather than the future.

9. "Verba oraculi ei persuadebunt". i make this "... will persuade him", rather than "... will persuade them".

With thanks to the compilers of, and contributors to the key. How would i manage without it? HTH,

sisyphus.
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Re: XXIX, § 176: Possible corrections to key.

Postby Barrius » Tue May 03, 2005 4:19 pm

sisyphus wrote:Salvete omnes,

FYI, i think i found a couple of minor errors here in the Textkit key.

6. i think this sentence should be in the imperfect, rather than the future.

9. "Verba oraculi ei persuadebunt". i make this "... will persuade him", rather than "... will persuade them".

Salve! I haven't checked #6, but "persuadebunt" is future active indicative plural [see §138], "will persude him" would be persuadebit.

Checking the book, the translation provided by the key is correct, but the Latin answer to the question in the book should be singular.
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Re: XXIX, § 176: Possible corrections to key.

Postby sisyphus » Tue May 03, 2005 8:31 pm

Ah, i see what i've done wrong for 9. My error was with the pronoun; i misinterpreted "ei" as "him", rather than "them". Nothing, after all, to do with the subject, "persuadebunt", which agrees in number with the subject, "verba".

Stupid mistake, it must have been late :oops:

Thanks all.
Last edited by sisyphus on Tue May 03, 2005 10:46 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby sisyphus » Tue May 03, 2005 10:42 pm

No, i was right the first time. :?

Subject = "verba oraculi", "the words of the oracle". Verb = "persuadebunt" (future 3rd pl act indic). The verb is intransitive => it takes an indirect object in the dative. Therefore "ei" is dative singular personal pronoun, the masculine gender being taken from context. The only other interpretation of "ei" would be the 1st per pl nom., which would conflict with the subject "verba".

So i still think it should translate to "the words of the oracle will persuade him".
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Postby benissimus » Wed May 04, 2005 12:24 am

It's easier to participate when you copy the sentences in question (from the book and the key). This is of course on behalf of those who do not have access to these materials, and not because I am lazy... heheheh
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Postby sisyphus » Wed May 04, 2005 12:44 am

Benissime,

Quite right of course. My apologies - i never intended this to be a discussion point, rather a note to key compilers. Nevertheless, the best laid plans of mice et cetera.

For the reference of all:

Q6 was to translate "Multa loca vastabantur et multa oppida delebantur".

Q9 "Verba oraculi ei persuadebunt".

HTH, regards.
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Postby benissimus » Wed May 04, 2005 12:57 am

ei should be "him/her", then, but I think you already figured that out ;)
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Postby ingrid70 » Wed May 04, 2005 12:17 pm

It is 'him' as this sentence has context; it's Cepheus who's going to be persuaded.

I have corrected the errors in my copy of the key. Keep those comments coming, and when you reach the point were the key stops, please send your translations to me...

Ingrid, 'editor' (ahem) of the key.
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Postby Barrius » Wed May 04, 2005 1:16 pm

Doh! I agree (it took me a while of reading this over and over) that it should be corrected in the key. I made the mistake (as did whomever did the key) that the ending 'bunt' was plural, therefore the 'ei' was nominative plural. But obviously that's wrong, as sisyphus notes the subject is "verba oraculi" [plural] needing a plural verb. The words of the oracle will be persuasive to HIM (dative obvious wrote thusly), so 'ei' could never have been nominative plural.

I must admit it's things like this that make one LEARN the language, and apoligize to sisyphus - you're right, I'm wrong, and I learned from my mistake. Thanks for aiding in my education

:lol:

[No offense to anyone contributing to the key!!!!]
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