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BLD Ex95 Pg40 #2 & #5

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BLD Ex95 Pg40 #2 & #5

Postby mariek » Fri Jul 25, 2003 7:26 am

<br />OK, I made it past Drill 89, Ex 90 Pts I & II, and Drill 94. Ex 95 wasn't so bad, but I'm unsure about 2 of the questions (out of 8 which isn't too bad).<br /><br />--==<>==--<br /><br />#2 Tiberim, fluvium Römänum, quis nön laudat et pulchrös fluviö finitimös agrös?<br /> Who doesn't praise the Tiber, the Roman River, and the beautiful neighboring fields by the river.<br />or<br /> Who doesn't praise the Tiber, the Roman River, and the beautiful neighbors and fields by the river.<br /><br />This one took me a long time because I couldn't work out the second part of the sentence, so I came up with two possible answers. I wasn't sure about which sentence to go with.<br />I figure fluviö must either be DAT or ABL, and DAT didn't seem to make much sense so it must be ABL.<br />I figured that pulchrös was the adjective agreeing with finitimös & agrös, yet the adj was separated by fluviö! This really threw me off for a while.<br />Then there's finitimös and agrös which are both ACC.<br />I'm not really happy about the 1st translation because I don't think the plural finitimös is supposed to translate to "neighboring".<br />And the 2nd translation doesn't seem right because there seems to be lacking an extra word for "and" in the original Latin. ???<br /><br />--==<>==--<br /><br />#5 Agrï bonï agricolïs praemia dant magna, et equï agricolärum cöpiam frümentï ad oppida et vïcös portant.<br /> Good fields give great rewards to the farmers and horses care plenty of farmers and wheat to towns and villages.<br /><br />Oh my, look at how long this sentence is! They're getting longer and longer! I struggled with the 2nd part of the sentence. What threw me off was the GEN frümentï separated by the GEN agricolärum, and I couldn't figure out where the ACC cöpiam fit into the scheme of things.<br />
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Re:BLD Ex95 Pg40 #2 & #5

Postby bingley » Fri Jul 25, 2003 8:49 am

According to my pocket dictionary finitimus can be used with a dative to mean bordering on (whatever's in the dative).<br /><br />So pulchros fluvio finitimos agros would be the (acc) beautiful, bordering-on-the-river fields.<br /><br />et equï agricolärum cöpiam frümentï ad oppida et vïcös portant.<br /><br />equi nom pl.<br />agricolarum gen. pl.<br />copiam acc sing.<br />frumenti gen. sing.<br />oppida et vicos acc pl.<br />portant present simple 3rd person pl.<br /><br />We end up with:<br />Horses of farmers abundance of corn to towns and villages carry.<br /><br />Or in English: The farmers' horses carry an abundance of corn to the towns and villages.<br /><br />Note: UK corn = US wheat
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Re:BLD Ex95 Pg40 #2 & #5

Postby benissimus » Fri Jul 25, 2003 8:50 am

#2 I would be inclined to agree with your first sentence. While the second sentence is sound, rivers don't really have "neighbors." That is an unusual use of the ablative... the way you translated it would make it locative, but I don't think you have even learned that yet. I'm not sure what the exact expected choice of words would be.<br /><br />#5 While your answer is accurate, it would make much more sense as "Good fields give great rewards to the farmers, and the farmers' horses carry plenty of wheat to towns and villages." (as opposed to an abundance of farmers!)
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Re:BLD Ex95 Pg40 #2 & #5

Postby Episcopus » Fri Jul 25, 2003 2:10 pm

What I was uncomfortable with when doing that was the flipped word order in places...it really tests out apposition skills...
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Re:BLD Ex95 Pg40 #2 & #5

Postby Skylax » Fri Jul 25, 2003 7:34 pm

[quote author=bingley link=board=3;threadid=301;start=0#1957 date=1059122978]<br />According to my pocket dictionary finitimus can be used with a dative to mean bordering on (whatever's in the dative).<br />[/quote]<br /><br />That's right. See Bennett § 192. Dative occurs with adjectives signifying "friendly... near, related to, similar..."<br /><br />Belgae sunt proximi Germanis "The Belgians are next to the Germans (Dative)".<br /><br /> But what is a Partial Differential Equation?<br />
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Re:BLD Ex95 Pg40 #2 & #5

Postby mariek » Fri Jul 25, 2003 9:33 pm

[quote author=bingley link=board=3;threadid=301;start=0#1957 date=1059122978]<br />According to my pocket dictionary finitimus can be used with a dative to mean bordering on (whatever's in the dative).[/quote]<br /><br />You are correct! I saw the noun part of the word, but the adjective part didn't register so I didn't add that to my vocabulary list. (Since I'm only carrying the few pages of BLD which I'm working on, I've enumerated all the vocab we've learned so far into a text document which I print out to carry with me.) Well, that clears up a lot of things for me.<br />
<br />et equï agricolärum cöpiam frümentï ad oppida et vïcös portant.<br />Horses of farmers abundance of corn to towns and villages carry.<br />Or in English: The farmers' horses carry an abundance of corn to the towns and villages.
<br /><br />I think your sentence is correct, it sounds more elegant. I guess I made the mistake of tacking copiam to agricolarum which is why I spiraled down the wrong path.<br /><br />I didn't know that UK corn = US wheat. Then what is US corn called in the UK?<br /><br />
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Re:BLD Ex95 Pg40 #2 & #5

Postby mariek » Fri Jul 25, 2003 10:48 pm

[quote author=benissimus link=board=3;threadid=301;start=0#1958 date=1059123007]<br />That is an unusual use of the ablative... the way you translated it would make it locative, but I don't think you have even learned that yet.[/quote]<br /><br />I missed the usage of finitimus + dat which Bingley pointed out. Fluvio turned out to be DAT; I got really screwed up when I eliminated DAT as an option.<br /><br />Nope, we haven't touched on the Locative yet. I already have my hands full with NOM, GEN, DAT, ACC, and ABL. What is the Locative? <br />
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Re:BLD Ex95 Pg40 #2 & #5

Postby mariek » Fri Jul 25, 2003 10:51 pm

[quote author=Skylax link=board=3;threadid=301;start=0#1982 date=1059161694]<br />But what is a Partial Differential Equation? [/quote]<br /><br />It's a math thing. Some people have the pleasure of taking PDE as an upper-division math course in college.<br />
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Re:BLD Ex95 Pg40 #2 & #5

Postby bingley » Sat Jul 26, 2003 1:39 am

Don't worry about the Locative yet. It's used to express location (what a surprise) but only for proper names of places and a couple of other words like domus (home) and rus (countryside).<br /><br />US corn = UK sweet corn or maize
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Re:BLD Ex95 Pg40 #2 & #5

Postby Episcopus » Sat Jul 26, 2003 9:46 am

[quote author=mariek link=board=3;threadid=301;start=0#1990 date=1059173472]<br />[quote author=Skylax link=board=3;threadid=301;start=0#1982 date=1059161694]<br />But what is a Partial Differential Equation? [/quote]<br /><br />It's a math thing. Some people have the pleasure of taking PDE as an upper-division math course in college.<br /><br />[/quote]<br /><br />cool...theta/360
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Postby Meowth » Sun Sep 12, 2004 7:48 pm

- Magna est Italiae fāma, patriae Rōmānōrum

great is the fame of Italy, of fatherland of Romans
great is the fame of Italy, the fatherland of the Romans


- Pulchra est terra Italia

beautiful is the land of Italy
Italy is beautiful land


- In agrīs populī Rōmānī labōrant multī servī


In the fields many slaves of Roman people work
In the fields of Roman people work many slaves



which ones r the right ones ? for every sentence, one is from answer key, the other one is my translation

thanks in advance any replies ! :)
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Postby ingrid70 » Sun Sep 12, 2004 8:34 pm

Meowth wrote:- Magna est Italiae fāma, patriae Rōmānōrum

great is the fame of Italy, of fatherland of Romans
great is the fame of Italy, the fatherland of the Romans


you are right that patriae is a genitive; but it is a genitive, because it is in apposition to Italy (apposition: word describing another word, it is in the same case as the word it describes). Ergo: Italiae = patriae Romanorum. You don't repeat the 'of' part in your translation.

- Pulchra est terra Italia

beautiful is the land of Italy
Italy is beautiful land


Word order is flexible, certainly in Latin, sometimes even in English :). Both sentences are right (ah, well, I'd write: Italy is a beautiful land).

- In agrīs populī Rōmānī labōrant multī servī

In the fields many slaves of Roman people work
In the fields of Roman people work many slaves


populi Romani is closer to agris then to multi servi, so I would put the Roman people with the fields, not the slaves. I suppose the slaves working on the fields belong to the Romans too, but who knows :)?

which ones r the right ones ? for every sentence, one is from answer key, the other one is my translation

thanks in advance any replies ! :)


Hope this helps
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Postby Meowth » Mon Sep 13, 2004 2:39 am

In agrīs populī Rōmānī labōrant multī servī


then multī servī must be in acc plur ? or it isn't direct object but another subject of the sentence ?
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Postby ingrid70 » Mon Sep 13, 2004 5:55 am

populi Romani is gen. sing;

multi servi is nom.plu, and the subject of the sentence: the slaves are the people who do the working.

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Postby benissimus » Mon Sep 13, 2004 7:31 am

sorry, my reply came out all wrong. I'll just delete it :roll:
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Postby Meowth » Mon Sep 13, 2004 2:24 pm

lol

i'm just feeling so dumb doing these questions but i have no any teacher learning to me

a little difficult to get used to another order in latin sentences... yeah THAT'S THE SUBJECT OF THE SENTENCE !!! lol


THANKS for replying :)
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Postby ingrid70 » Mon Sep 13, 2004 7:43 pm

Never dumb! You're learning a new language, using a book that is not in your native language, and without a teacher. That's not dumb, that's great!

Don't be afraid to ask questions, that's how you learn.

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Postby Timothy » Tue Sep 14, 2004 1:01 am

errare est Romanum. ;)

If you look in the forum you'll come across some winers by yours truly.

I use the phrase "D'oh!" to good effect.

- Tim
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