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JWW exercises, paragraphs 562, 563, 564

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JWW exercises, paragraphs 562, 563, 564

Postby Koala » Thu Sep 02, 2004 11:39 am

some further suggested answers . . . thank you for the last corrections!

562
1. Cyrus, being both at a loss and vexed by these things, summoned Clearchus
2. it seems best to me (that) we ask Cyrus what use he wishes to make of us
3. for we say that they are more cowardly about us, than we are about them / their behaviour towards us is worse than ours towards them
4. and moreover, this army is gathered and nourished by him in this way
5. and they said that never yet had this river been fordable by/on foot until now
6. supply a market place for the army, and allow the Greeks to enter (lit: admit the Gks)
7. let us consider, fellow soldiers, whether it is necessary to proceed by land
8. Xenophon however wishes to traverse the journey with them, thinking it to be safer so
9. but we must discuss (the question of how) we might both proceed safely and, if it should be necessary to fight, we might honourably give battle

563
[face=SPIonic]a. o9 Ku=roj parekeleu/eto toi=j73Ellhsi mh\ feu/gein
b. tou\j stratiw/taj sugkalei= w(j peri\ th=j porei/aj sumbouleu/shtai
g. keleu/ei tou\j fuga/daj sustrateu/esqai su\n Klea/rxw|
d. tou=ton to\n a1nqrwpon e0kpodw~n poiei=sqe . . . poiou=
e. le/gei o3ti ei]j e0k tw~n stratiwtw~n tou= Me/nwnoj e1sxize cu/la
[/face]

564
Cyrus, calling together the generals and the captains of the Greeks, deliberated how he might execute the battle, and he himself exhorted and encouraged them as follows: “Fellow Greeks, I am not leading you (as) allies because we are short of barbarian troops (lit: men), but because I consider you to be braver than many barbarians (foreign troops) – on account of this I took you to help me. Therefore, be men worthy of the freedom that you possess and on account of which I count you happy
Last edited by Koala on Thu Sep 16, 2004 10:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Skylax » Sun Sep 05, 2004 5:39 pm

Une ou deux remarques à propos d'un travail de grande qualité :

562

3. Correct translation, but in the context (Anabasis, I, 4, 8 ), it is rather « worse » than « more cowardly ». Here the translation from Perseus : « their behaviour toward us is worse than ours toward them ».
4. It could be « this army is gathered and nourished by him in this way » but I am not sure and I was unable to find the passage on Perseus.

5. In French, the aorist [face=SPIonic]e)ge/neto[/face] would be translated by a (French) pluperfect : « ce fleuve n’avait jamais encore été guéable »

9. « But we must say this, how we might proceed… [indirect question]», so « we have to discuss the question of how we might proceed… » (or the correspondent English idiom)

563

e. « one of Menon’s soldiers » : Xenophone used [face=SPIonic]tw=n Me/nwnos stratiwtw=n tis - - - ei(=j tw=n[/face] … would not surprise me but I am not familiar with [face=SPIonic]ei(=j e)k… --- cu/la[/face] : no article needed.

564

about « the freedom »… I understand better the second solution.

[face=SPIonic]xai=re[/face]
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Postby Koala » Mon Sep 06, 2004 2:26 pm

Merci beaucoup encore, M. Skylax, pour vos remarques, vos conseils et surtout pour votre gentillesse

With respect to the ‘one of the soldiers’ construction, I borrowed it from Koine and the LXX, with which I’m a little more familiar – vel:

[face=SPIonic]le/gei au0tw~| ei[j e0k tw~n maqhtw~n au0tou=,7 0Andre/aj o9 a0delfo\j Si/mwnoj Pe/trou,

kai\ ei[j e0k tw~n presbute/rwn le/gei moi, Mh\ klai=e, i0dou\ e0ni/khsen o9 le/wn

kai\ a1nqrwpoj ei[j e0k tw~n ui9w~n tw~n profhtw~n ei]pen pro\j plhsi/on au0tou=

kai\ e0nisxu/sei basilei/an Ai0gu/ptou kai\ ei[j e0k tw~n dunastw~n katisxu/sei au0to/n

XAIRE
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Postby Skylax » Tue Sep 07, 2004 7:07 pm

I had never noticed it before although I have (sowewhat hastily) read Luke in Greek. But the e)k give the Greek a strange sound to my ears : as always, Koine seems both harsh and, would I say, over-expressive to me.
(Thank you for having allowed me to clarify this feeling.)

XAIPE :)
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