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Unt 2 Sentences

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Unt 2 Sentences

Postby classicalclarinet » Tue Aug 31, 2004 8:50 am

Excercises

8. Incolae si feminas invidiae damnaverint, nautae sententiam de fama incolarum mutare non dubitabunt.

If the inhabitnats condemned the women of jealousy, the sailors will not hesistate to change their opinion about the beauty of the inhabitnats.

12. Si nautae noxas a puellis pepulissent, et gloriam et famam cepissent.

If the sailors had driven off the harm from the girls, they would have had both glory and fame.

22. Nisi pecuniam in cella celavisses, regina nautas nec damnavisset nec e provincia expelleret.

Unless you had hidden the money in the storeroom, the queen would have neither condamned the sailors nor be expelling them from the province.

27. Vita reginae nihil dedit nisi gloriam famamque.

The life of the Queen gave nothing except to glory and fame.

Eng-Lat.

5. You [pl] have filled the altar with your tears.

Aram cum lacrimis implevistis.

Final Question- i was taught (by a teacher) that the Plu-and Futureperfect tenses were used in sense of time, i.e.

They had eaten the dinner when the moon rose.
They will have eaten dinner when the moon rises.

But these excercises don't illustrate that point, and now I'm confused. :P
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Re: Unt 2 Sentences

Postby benissimus » Wed Sep 01, 2004 12:01 am

classicalclarinet wrote:8. Incolae si feminas invidiae damnaverint, nautae sententiam de fama incolarum mutare non dubitabunt.

If the inhabitnats condemned the women of jealousy, the sailors will not hesistate to change their opinion about the beauty of the inhabitnats.

damnaverint is future perfect, not perfect (which would be damnaverunt). It could also be a perfect subjunctive, but that would not fit well with the future subjunctive of the second verb.
invidiae is a genitive, but here it means "for their jealousy", e.g. "they condemed the women for their jealousy". The genitive is used to describe what someone is damned for or punished for. I believe M&F discusses this usage in the chapter.
fama does not mean "beauty" (forma), but "reputation".

12. Si nautae noxas a puellis pepulissent, et gloriam et famam cepissent.

If the sailors had driven off the harm from the girls, they would have had both glory and fame.

correct :)

22. Nisi pecuniam in cella celavisses, regina nautas nec damnavisset nec e provincia expelleret.

Unless you had hidden the money in the storeroom, the queen would have neither condamned the sailors nor be expelling them from the province.

correct. It would be better English to translate nisi as "if (you had) not" in this case.

27. Vita reginae nihil dedit nisi gloriam famamque.

The life of the Queen gave nothing except to glory and fame.

reginae is more likely a dative than a genitive ("life gave nothing to the queen..."). gloriam and famam are both direct objects, there is no preposition "to".
5. You [pl] have filled the altar with your tears.

Aram cum lacrimis implevistis.

Is the subject of the sentence filling the altar accompanying the tears (cum) or by means of the tears (ablative)?

Final Question- i was taught (by a teacher) that the Plu-and Futureperfect tenses were used in sense of time, i.e.

They had eaten the dinner when the moon rose.
They will have eaten dinner when the moon rises.

But these excercises don't illustrate that point, and now I'm confused.

The pluperfect tense simply shows an action occurring before a verb that is in a past tense. The future perfect shows that the action is occurring before a future event.


Thus, in your sentences:
They had eaten the dinner when the moon rose.
The verb "rise" is in a past tense, the action of "eating" happens before the moon will rise. Since "rise" is past tense and "eat" happens before a past tense verb, "eat" is pluperfect "had eaten".

They will have eaten dinner when the moon rises.
English makes this sentence a little bit confusing. It should actually say "They will have eaten dinner when the moon will rise", showing that "rise" is actually in the future. The "eating" occurs before the verb that is in the future tense, so it must be in the future perfect.


Latin follows these rules, but not always strictly. The sequence of tenses is much more flexible than most textbooks will explain to the reader. Most of your sentences seem to be conditionals, which have their own tense rules which are explained in the book and they correspond closely to the English rules for conditionals.
flebile nescio quid queritur lyra, flebile lingua murmurat exanimis, respondent flebile ripae
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Postby classicalclarinet » Wed Sep 01, 2004 12:23 am

Thanks. :)
The next chapter mentions more Ablative uses. :P It is a bit confusing to know which abls take prepositions or not.
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