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M&F Unit2 Pg46 Reading

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M&F Unit2 Pg46 Reading

Postby mariek » Sat Sep 27, 2003 8:29 pm

<br />I'm working through the Reading on Page 46. I'm unsure of 3 out of 19 sentenses in the passage.<br /><br /><br />Tum, subito, deus venit et nautam monuit: "Naviga nunc," narravit, "antequam reginae sit ira.<br /><br />Translated:<br /> Then suddenly, God came and warned the sailor: "Set sail now," he told (him), "before anger is to the queen.<br /><br />I'm unsure about reginae sit ira ... anger is to the queen, or anger was to the queen. I think "before the queen becomes angry" is the intention. But it seems that ira is the subject, sit is the verb, and thus reginae is in the Dative?<br /><br /><br />Nautam terruit et sub luna Aeneas turbam monuit, "Sententiam mutavi.<br /><br />Translated:<br /> Aeneas frightened the sailor, and warned the crowd under the moon, "I changed my opinion/mind.<br /><br />I thought that Aeneas was the sailor, so I don't understand why this translates to "Aeneas frightened the sailor". Which other sailor? So I must have mis-translated this.<br /><br /><br />Nisi manere optaverit, nil habebo," Annae narravit.<br /><br />Translated:<br /> "Unless he wished to remain, I had nothing," Anne told (her).<br /><br />My translation makes no sense to me, particularly the "I had nothing" part. But isn't that what "nil habebo" means?<br /><br /><br /><br />If it helps, here is the entire passage:<br />Aeneas, id enim nomen nautae fuit, dum incoluit Africam com regina incolas rexit. Patriam aedificaverunt. Tum, subito, deus venit et nautam monuit: "Naviga nunc," narravit, "antequam reginae sit ira. Si nunc manebis, te semper manere optet." Nautam terruit et sub luna Aeneas turbam monuit, "Sententiam mutavi. Parabimus et ab Africa navigabimus." Non fuit mora. Aeneae paruerunt et navigaverunt. Regina mane lacrimavit quod Aeneas cum turba incolarum patriam relquerat. Reginam ira implevit. "Nisi manere optaverit, nil habebo," Annae narrat. "Vitam non opto sine Aenea. Nisi me amat, esse non opto." Sic narravit et se necavit. Anima reginae discessit. Incolae Africae de culpa naetae cogitaverunt et lacrimaverunt. Nautam noxae reginae damnaverunt. De insidiis cogitabant. Ad aras venerunt et deos poenas Aeneae turbaeque oraverunt.<br /><br /><br />
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Re:M&F Unit2 Pg46 Reading

Postby bingley » Sun Sep 28, 2003 12:45 am

mariek wrote:<br /><br />I'm working through the Reading on Page 46. I'm unsure of 3 out of 19 sentenses in the passage.<br /><br /><br />Tum, subito, deus venit et nautam monuit: "Naviga nunc," narravit, "antequam reginae sit ira.<br /><br />Translated:<br /> Then suddenly, God came and warned the sailor: "Set sail now," he told (him), "before anger is to the queen.<br /><br />I'm unsure about reginae sit ira ... anger is to the queen, or anger was to the queen. I think "before the queen becomes angry" is the intention. But it seems that ira is the subject, sit is the verb, and thus reginae is in the Dative?<br /><br />Dative of possession with esse, perhaps? There is anger to the queen, i.e., the queen gets angry. Or genitive, there is the queen's anger. Comes to the same thing.
<br /><br />
mariek wrote:Nautam terruit et sub luna Aeneas turbam monuit, "Sententiam mutavi.<br /><br />Translated:<br /> Aeneas frightened the sailor, and warned the crowd under the moon, "I changed my opinion/mind.<br /><br />I thought that Aeneas was the sailor, so I don't understand why this translates to "Aeneas frightened the sailor". Which other sailor? So I must have mis-translated this.<br /><br />The subject of terruit is not Aeneas, it's the god referred to earlier. He terrified the sailor and under the moon Aeneas warned the crowd.
<br /><br />
mariek wrote:Nisi manere optaverit, nil habebo," Annae narravit.<br /><br />Translated:<br /> "Unless he wished to remain, I had nothing," Anne told (her).<br /><br />My translation makes no sense to me, particularly the "I had nothing" part. But isn't that what "nil habebo" means?<br /><br />habebo is future. If he does not wish to stay, I will have nothing. Optaverit = future perfect. See the note in section E2a on page 38. Annae is dative, so Annae narravit = she (the queen) said to Anna<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />
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Re:M&F Unit2 Pg46 Reading

Postby mariek » Sun Sep 28, 2003 2:36 am

Tum, subito, deus venit et nautam monuit: "Naviga nunc," narravit, "antequam reginae sit ira.<br /><br />
<br />Dative of possession with esse, perhaps? There is anger to the queen, i.e., the queen gets angry. Or genitive, there is the queen's anger. Comes to the same thing.
<br /><br />Ah... Dative of the Possessor, section E on Page 88. I haven't gotten there yet. That's pretty sneaky of them to throw this at me on Page 46. <br /><br /><br />Nisi manere optaverit, nil habebo," Annae narrat.<br />(Narrat, not narravit; I mistyped this earier)<br /><br />
habebo is future. If he does not wish to stay, I will have nothing. Optaverit = future perfect. See the note in section E2a on page 38. Annae is dative, so Annae narravit = she (the queen) said to Anna
<br /><br />Oops! You're right, habebo is future. And I totally missed Annae being dative. It makes sense now that I know it's the Queen who said this.<br /><br />
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Postby classicalclarinet » Tue Aug 31, 2004 8:24 am

hmm.. I'm having problems in this reading too, but in the first sentence here.

"Aeneas, id enim nimen nautae fuit, dum incoluit Africam cum reginaa incolas rexit. "

Aeneas, this name, indeed, of the sailor, while he lived in Africa with the Queen, ruled the inhabitants.- is my translation.

About the use of 'sit', the word is glossed in the notes as saying 'the verb is subjuctive because it indicates the anticipation of the Queen's Anger'
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Postby benissimus » Tue Aug 31, 2004 8:28 am

classicalclarinet wrote:hmm.. I'm having problems in this reading too, but in the first sentence here.

"Aeneas, id enim nimen nautae fuit, dum incoluit Africam cum reginaa incolas rexit. "

Aeneas, this name, indeed, of the sailor, while he lived in Africa with the Queen, ruled the inhabitants.- is my translation.

You forgot to translate fuit and cum - it should make more sense with them ;)
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Postby classicalclarinet » Tue Aug 31, 2004 8:56 am

You forgot to translate fuit and cum - it should make more sense with them


Aeneas, which was indeed the sailor's name, ruled the inhabitants with the queen while living in Africa.. The best I can do. :P
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Postby benissimus » Tue Aug 31, 2004 11:34 pm

That is good. The most literal translation would be
"Aeneas, that was indeed the sailor's name, ruled the inhabitants with the queen while he lived in Africa."

The commas here seem to have the force of parentheses. It doesn't really matter if you use commas or apostrophes in this case, since the Romans themselves did not bother with punctuation.
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