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Question regarding "neque...neque"

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Question regarding "neque...neque"

Postby Carolus Raeticus » Tue Dec 03, 2013 9:10 pm

Salvete!

I have a small question concerning a sentence in Exercise 15 of Adler's Practical Grammar (with answers from the author's KEY):

  • Has your brother the fine asses of the Spaniards or those of the Italians? - Utrum frater tuus formosos Hispanorum asinos habet an illos Italorum?
  • He has neither those of the Spaniards nor those of the Italians, but he has the fine asses of the French. - Non habet neque Hispanorum neque illos Italorum; habet autem formosos Francogallorum asinos.
Why does Adler use the form Non (verb) neque...neque instead of merely neque...neque? Immediately before this Q&A-pair, there is another a similar sentence using a different construction:

  • Have you the pretty sheep of the Turks or those of the Spaniards? - Utrum pulchras Turcarum habes oves an illas Hispanorum?
  • I have neither those of the Turks nor those of the Spaniards, but those of my brother. - Nec Turcarum nec Hispanorum habeo, verum illos fratris mei.

In the latter example he uses neque...neque without non preceding it.

Am I right in supposing that non...neque...neque is used when the verb is at the beginning, and neque...neque when the verb is at the end?

Perhaps the answer is somewhere in the textbook itself, but I have not been using Adler's grammar for learning the basics, but am interested in his exercises. I have just finished transcribing (and hopefully reasonably proofread) the entire set of exercises including the answers from the author's "Key". So be warned, I am soon going to annoy you with quite a few questions (and requests for confirmations).

Valete,

Carolus Raeticus
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Re: Question regarding "neque...neque"

Postby adrianus » Tue Dec 03, 2013 10:09 pm

What you say about word order sounds reasonable, I would say.
De ordine verborum, Carole, verum dicis, ut opinor.
Adler, p.25, wrote:The disjunctive conjunctions nec and neque..the former more frequently stands before consonants and the latter before vowels
I'm writing in Latin hoping for correction, and not because I'm confident in how I express myself. Latinè scribo ut ab omnibus corrigar, non quod confidenter me exprimam.
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Re: Question regarding "neque...neque"

Postby huilen » Wed Dec 04, 2013 5:35 am

As far as I know, double negation is rare in Classical Latin. In romance languages is very common, so I think may be it comes from Vulgar Latin. I think it emphasizes the main negation.

Check this post: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=8018
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Re: Question regarding "neque...neque"

Postby adrianus » Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:35 pm

huilen wrote:As far as I know, double negation is rare in Classical Latin. In romance languages is very common, so I think may be it comes from Vulgar Latin. I think it emphasizes the main negation.

Classicè dicitur cum negationibus sequentibus quae introducunt.
It's classical enough with following introductory negatives.
Vide http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.04.0001%3Asmythp%3D327
I'm writing in Latin hoping for correction, and not because I'm confident in how I express myself. Latinè scribo ut ab omnibus corrigar, non quod confidenter me exprimam.
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