Textkit Logo

re: cases combining

Here's where you can discuss all things Latin. Use this board to ask questions about grammar, discuss learning strategies, get translation help and more!

Moderator: thesaurus

re: cases combining

Postby caeruleus » Wed Apr 07, 2004 6:06 pm

Forum:
[face=Verdana]
I imagine that students new to Classical Latin (such as myself) begin to appreciate the subtleness of how cases combine within a sentence. An example, and please confirm:

Dea Minerva formam feminae simulat et in terra ambulat.

In this sentence, "formam feminae" seems to mean "form (or shape) of a woman" hence, it being in the genitive case led by an accusative singular.

Question: Are there other cases in the singular and plural that precede the genitive singular and plural? For I would think, it is just nominatives that lead into the genitives.[/face]

Caeruleus
caeruleus
Textkit Neophyte
 
Posts: 24
Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2003 1:08 am
Location: U.S.A.

Postby whiteoctave » Wed Apr 07, 2004 7:46 pm

Any case, I'm afraid, can be combined with any other in Latin, according to the demands of the sense. For instance, if you keep the genitive feminae - "of the woman" it can be preceded by forma in any of its case forms singular and plural. To give examples of the singular:

Nom:
forma feminae mirabilis est.

Voc:
quam te, forma feminae, amo!

Acc:
your example

Gen:
visus formae feminae mihi mentem manusque semper excitat.

or with a verb:

memento formae feminae!

Dat:
palmam formae feminae dedi

or with a verb:

nolite, nautae, formae feminae nocere.

Abl:

mille vero astra fulgenta in forma feminae vidi.

or with a verb:

omnesne homines forma feminae vescentur?


needless (and puzzlingly bizarre) examples to come up with, I know, but as I said above - all combinations of cases are possible.
Hope this helps

~dave
User avatar
whiteoctave
Textkit Enthusiast
 
Posts: 603
Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2003 11:42 pm
Location: Cambridge

Postby Ulpianus » Wed Apr 07, 2004 7:50 pm

Why should it only be nominatives that precede genitives?

So far as I know, there is no (grammatical) limit on the case or number of the noun to which a genitive may, as it were, attach. Consider the position in English:

1. Harold's cat scared me. (cat = subj = nom)
2. I scared harold's cat. (cat = obj = acc)
3. I put the food down on the ground for harold's cat. (cat = ind obj = dat)
4. I saw harold's cat's basket. (cat = possessive = gen)
5. I terrified my children with harold's cat. (cat = instrument = abl)

The things the genitive does to a noun may need to be done to any noun, in any case, of any number.

(PS: posted more-or-less simultaneously with Whiteoctave's answer, which makes the same point but properly in Latin)
Ulpianus
Textkit Member
 
Posts: 197
Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2004 3:14 pm
Location: London, UK

Postby Barrius » Thu Apr 08, 2004 1:02 am

Ulpianus wrote:1. Harold's cat scared me. (cat = subj = nom)
2. I scared harold's cat. (cat = obj = acc)
3. I put the food down on the ground for harold's cat. (cat = ind obj = dat)
4. I saw harold's cat's basket. (cat = possessive = gen)
5. I terrified my children with harold's cat. (cat = instrument = abl)

I'd avoid Harold, you and his cat!
Barrius
Textkit Member
 
Posts: 191
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2004 8:45 pm
Location: above ground, thank God!


Return to Learning Latin

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 61 guests