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Translation Exercise

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Translation Exercise

Postby auctor » Wed Feb 25, 2004 11:39 pm

Are we ready for another test of our translating skills? If so maybe you'd like to try this short (and grammatically straightforward) paraphrasing of a latter day politician's refutation...

I did not have sexual relations with that man

Extra Brownie points for those versions that mirror the language of Calonice in Aristophanes' Lysistrata (because we all know she could never have kept her oath to the other Athenian women :wink: )
Hopefully we can get a good few attempts which can be compared. There is a full range of abilities here (all VERY nice people); it would be nice to get a dialogue going where *not-so-confident* translators can be given some hints by the *not not-so-confident* ones.

Woodhouse's Dictionary at http://tinyurl.com/2b7fp may be handy, if you need it :D

Have fun,

Paul McK
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Postby auctor » Thu Mar 04, 2004 11:43 am

No takers for this in the past week or so, so I'll offer two translations for discussion before we put this exercise into its metaphorical bed.

[face=SPIonic]
e(/wj e)/kei=noj h)geiren e)gwg' e)ka/qeudon

bdalle/sqai o( bouj o( tou a)ndro/j e)kei/nou e)/ti e)pime/lei
[/face]


The former is fairly mild statement
"While that man was awake/aroused, I myself slept"
which was a play on the meaning of the first verb.

The latter is a rather more fruity piece of imagery that I'll leave in the Greek to save the blushes of any passers-by :wink:

Paul McK
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Postby chad » Fri Mar 12, 2004 6:42 am

hi paul, i've had a chance to look at this now...

[face=SPIonic]ou)depw&pote su\n e0kei/nw| w(mi/lhsa[/face]

with a strong negation to start. it's not as colourful as your 2nd example though, which i'm guessing is based on one of aristophanes' metaphors :) i haven't read any of him in greek yet unfortunately.

i was wondering whether i should put the verb in the aorist or imperfect: i chose the aorist, to bring out more the "event" which "never happened": which do you think would be better?

thanks, chad. :)
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Postby auctor » Mon Mar 15, 2004 5:41 pm

Yes Chad, I'm sure you're right to have used the aorist.
My second offering isn't based on any particular anti-euphemism (if that coinage could be the opposite of "putting something in a mild form for what may considered too blunt") of A's - just the fruit of my imagination! However the imagery of men being bulls (and by extension, that appendage which defines men) is quite common throughout the classical canon.
A disappointing response overall; was the subject a sensitive one? Surely not for 21C classicists. Perhaps, Chad, you'd like to offer up a shortish sentence for us to fiddle about with.
Thanks for trying though,
Paul McK
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Postby annis » Mon Mar 15, 2004 6:02 pm

Following Aristophanes:

[face=spionic]ou) mh\n bebi/nhka e)kei=non[/face]

Now, I believe [face=spionic]bine/w[/face] is vulgar by reference, rather than by phrasing, since even normally prudent Solon uses the word.
William S. Annis — http://www.aoidoi.org/http://www.scholiastae.org/
τίς πατέρ' αἰνήσει εἰ μὴ κακοδαίμονες υἱοί;
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Postby auctor » Mon Mar 15, 2004 6:34 pm

Ha ha short and sweet William - difficult to argue with :lol:
LSJ mumbles around the def in Latin and guarded English - it does give a citation for the desiderative form of your verb though, in Lysistrata.
The pocket Oxford uses the instantly recognisable 4-letter word as a def.

I like your use of the perfect tense...

I didn't **** that man and remain not having ****ed him

exactly the line that one's silk would recommend be toed and stuck to. :wink:
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Postby annis » Mon Mar 15, 2004 6:53 pm

auctor wrote:The pocket Oxford uses the instantly recognisable 4-letter word as a def.


Wm runs off to fetch his pocket Oxford... Gosh. So they do. I'm not entirely convinced this is the best translation for this word.

I like your use of the perfect tense...

I didn't **** that man and remain not having ****ed him


Well, in languages with a perfect that aspect often bleeds into an experiential sense. "Have you ever eaten chilled jellyfish?" "I have eaten chilled jellyfish." That's the sense I think it has here. The model I'm working from: [face=spionic]kai\ mh\n bebi/nhkaj su/ ge...[/face] said to someone who is claiming not to know a certain Agathon.

exactly the line that one's silk would recommend be toed and stuck to. :wink:


Silk? I've read enough Rupole of the Bailey to suspect you mean legal counsel, but can you confirm that, please?
William S. Annis — http://www.aoidoi.org/http://www.scholiastae.org/
τίς πατέρ' αἰνήσει εἰ μὴ κακοδαίμονες υἱοί;
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Postby auctor » Mon Mar 15, 2004 10:15 pm

exactly the line that one's silk would recommend be toed and stuck to. :wink:

Silk? I've read enough Rupole of the Bailey to suspect you mean legal counsel, but can you confirm that, please?


Yes, precisely William. a common UK synecdoche for that dear chap/pess that one's solicitor employs on one's behalf. You can take the "dear" in either or both of the usual senses!
"taking silk" is to be elevated from solicitor to barrister, from the silk gown they wear. At present they are more properly called QCs, Queen's Counsel.

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Postby chad » Mon Mar 15, 2004 11:27 pm

from solicitor to barrister, really? here in australia, silks are the senior barristers, queen's counsel: the "inner bar", appointed from the larger group of normal barristers. no solicitors go straight to qc as far as i've heard: i thought it was the same in england... cheers, chad. :)
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Postby bingley » Mon Mar 15, 2004 11:42 pm

I've always understood that to be the case in England as well, chad, though I believe the boundaries between solicitors and barristers are not as rigid as they used to be. Any comments, Ulpianus?
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Postby auctor » Tue Mar 16, 2004 12:32 am

[face=SPIonic]
oi)/moi[/face]
, o me miserum!

I defer to our learned colleagues' better accuracy. The normal route is indeed solicitor - barrister - QC [and possibly ending, after a few or more stops, as Lord Chief Justice!!].
BTW *the LCJ is trying to change the constitution in order to sack himself.* An uncommonly selfless task.
But we are wandering away from the to-be-beaten path :D In order to get back on track, is the phrase within the asterisks a suitable candidate for Hellenization?

ha ha
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Postby chad » Tue Mar 16, 2004 12:41 am

i'll give that a go this afternoon... should we use [face=SPIonic]o9 krith/j[/face] or is there a better word or adjective to make it "chief justice"?

thanks, chad. :)
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