I am worried for you people!

by **Episcopus** » Sat Aug 16, 2003 11:50 am

Benissimus, God blesses

him, lives in California and has not heard of "Nuthin' But a G Thang" by Snoop Doggy Dogg and Dr. Dre. Others have also questioned the existence of this classic track. I could not believe this! Personally I really be digging neither D.R.E nor Snoop D-O-double-gizzle; however this song from seemingly ages ago captures an era ubi I n'was que six years old ;D and I remembers it. So please, you will find it on Dr. Dre's "The Chronic"; "check it out!"

by **klewlis** » Sat Aug 16, 2003 2:19 pm

never heard of it... though i make a point of avoiding that type of music in general :P

Website · by **benissimus** » Sat Aug 16, 2003 8:14 pm

I have heard of it, but I don't know the words. Weren't you talking about a different song? I hate rap anyways, so

(and yes I am insane but it is only an overtaxed genius mind ;o )

by **Keesa** » Sat Aug 16, 2003 11:22 pm

[quote author=benissimus link=board=6;threadid=487;start=0#4114 date=1061064876] I have heard of it, but I don't know the words. Weren't you talking about a different song? I hate rap anyways, so

(and yes I am insane but it is only an overtaxed genius mind ;o ) [/quote] I second the motion! (All except for the first two sentences, since I've never heard of it in my life, and don't really want to.) Rap and Latin...very strange. You are obviously a person of eclectic tastes, Episcopus! Keesa

by **Episcopus** » Sun Aug 17, 2003 12:06 am

Why hate rap? Your general tone seems to be "I hate those thugs" and "They swear too much" and "Their music is not artistic." Well some of it isn't but some also is class and however much O Fortuna one listen to one never experiences a great mostly undiscovered side of music (at least for latin lorrydrivers greek geeks).

by **Keesa** » Sun Aug 17, 2003 12:17 am

[quote author=Episcopus link=board=6;threadid=487;start=0#4143 date=1061078816] Why hate rap? Your general tone seems to be "I hate those thugs" and "They swear too much" and "Their music is not artistic." Well some of it isn't but some also is class and however much O Fortuna one listen to one never experiences a great mostly undiscovered side of music (at least for latin lorrydrivers greek geeks). [/quote] I didn't mean to imply any of that, I assure you. I just don't like rap, and I don't think very much of rappers. The music just seems...rude. I'm very old fashioned, and I don't like rude music. That's all. Believe me, I wasn't trying to insult you or the music you like to listen to, and I'm so sorry if it came across that way! Keesa

Website · by **benissimus** » Sun Aug 17, 2003 12:24 am

I dislike it for many reasons, but never did I say that I refused to recognize it as a form of music or devoid of any value (although just because I didn't say it doesn't mean I don't think so

).

by **klewlis** » Sun Aug 17, 2003 1:42 am

I have a great deal of respect for those rappers who are able to improvise raps on the spot... that's just cool and they are very creative. However, I find that the genre of rap just isn't appealing to me as a music form... and so much of that branch of the industry is full of sex, violence, swearing, etc... it's really hard to find anything quality. So, I hope you'll forgive that my tastes are different from yours ;)

by **Episcopus** » Sun Aug 17, 2003 11:01 am

Rude music aren't you 18 Keesa? Have you applied for parental discretion yet from your mother? Speaking of mothers, you should try Dear Mama by 2pac - not one nasty word

by **Keesa** » Sun Aug 17, 2003 11:38 am

[quote author=Episcopus link=board=6;threadid=487;start=0#4183 date=1061118089] Rude music aren't you 18 Keesa? Have you applied for parental discretion yet from your mother? Speaking of mothers, you should try Dear Mama by 2pac - not one nasty word

[/quote] Hehe. Yes, I'm eighteen, almost nineteen, and Mamma trusts me completely. She knows she can trust me, because I have my own discretion. I don't read books (or posts) or use words or listen to music that I feel to be inappropriate for a young lady. (I told you I was old-fashioned.) Keesa

by **Episcopus** » Sun Aug 17, 2003 12:29 pm

Where are you people from?

It's strange around me I see not female who is remotely pure, pleasant or nice...yet here one at almost will not even bring herself to listen to a man praising his mother in a loving manner? Really Keesa where do you live?

by **Puella Parva** » Sun Aug 17, 2003 1:28 pm

[quote author=Keesa link=board=6;threadid=487;start=0#4146 date=1061079444] I didn't mean to imply any of that, I assure you. I just don't like rap, and I don't think very much of rappers. The music just seems...rude. I'm very old fashioned, and I don't like rude music. That's all. Believe me, I wasn't trying to insult you or the music you like to listen to, and I'm so sorry if it came across that way! Keesa [/quote] Believe me, she is old fashioned! She won't even listen to any of my music, which is comtemorary Christian and Christian rock, so rap is definately out of the question. I personally don't care for rap either, but could see how some people could like it, alot of rappers can ryhme better than I can!

by **Keesa** » Sun Aug 17, 2003 2:09 pm

[quote author=Episcopus link=board=6;threadid=487;start=0#4199 date=1061123340] Where are you people from?

It's strange around me I see not female who is remotely pure, pleasant or nice...yet here one at almost will not even bring herself to listen to a man praising his mother in a loving manner? Really Keesa where do you live? [/quote] I'm a human anachronism. I think I belong somewhere in the nineteen hundreds...maybe around the Victorian era. ;D Keesa

by **Milito** » Sun Aug 17, 2003 5:30 pm

[quote author=benissimus link=board=6;threadid=487;start=0#4150 date=1061079844] I dislike it for many reasons, but never did I say that I refused to recognize it as a form of music or devoid of any value (although just because I didn't say it doesn't mean I don't think so

). [/quote] I'm not particularly fond of rap either, but heard a very interesting discussion comparing rap and opera - by finding points of positive comparison! That was a bit of an eye-opener! (I do like opera......) Kilmeny

by **Milito** » Sun Aug 17, 2003 5:32 pm

[quote author=Keesa link=board=6;threadid=487;start=0#4210 date=1061129341] I'm a human anachronism. I think I belong somewhere in the nineteen hundreds...maybe around the Victorian era. ;D Keesa [/quote] I'm with you, Keesa! (Except that you'll NEVER catch me in those clothes! Especially the corsets!) Kilmeny

by **Episcopus** » Sun Aug 17, 2003 8:13 pm

[quote author=Puella Parva link=board=6;threadid=487;start=0#4204 date=1061126931] She won't even listen to any of my music, which is comtemorary Christian and Christian rock[/quote]

In what, where do you live?! Then you should have extreme amounts of zeal for the Latin language. I'm about as non-christian as one can become without killing anyone or being nasty.

by **Keesa** » Sun Aug 17, 2003 10:06 pm

[quote author=Episcopus link=board=6;threadid=487;start=15#4234 date=1061151203] I'm about as non-christian as one can become without killing anyone or being nasty. [/quote] I'm sorry to hear that, although I suppose the Academy is a better place to debate matters of religion than the Open Forum. Why do you dislike Christianity? (or do you dislike it?) I think it's wonderful. Keesa

by **Episcopus** » Mon Aug 18, 2003 3:10 pm

[quote author=Keesa link=board=6;threadid=487;start=15#4253 date=1061157964] Why do you dislike Christianity? I think it's wonderful. [/quote] I don't think here to be the right place in which to discuss religion, especially due to the fact that the original post was about a classic rap song. (People here like classics, do they not?) I'm just going to say that I stróngly (with a long "o") disagree. May one agree to disagree.

by **Keesa** » Mon Aug 18, 2003 10:44 pm

[quote author=Episcopus link=board=6;threadid=487;start=15#4328 date=1061219411] May one agree to disagree. [/quote] I'll agree with that! Keesa

by **Episcopus** » Mon Aug 18, 2003 11:17 pm

To agree to disagree is always peacefullest

by **Keesa** » Mon Aug 18, 2003 11:38 pm

And pleasantest!

by **Puella Parva** » Tue Aug 19, 2003 11:51 pm

[quote author=Milito link=board=6;threadid=487;start=0#4228 date=1061141535] [quote author=Keesa link=board=6;threadid=487;start=0#4210 date=1061129341] I'm a human anachronism. I think I belong somewhere in the nineteen hundreds...maybe around the Victorian era. ;D Keesa [/quote] I'm with you, Keesa! (Except that you'll NEVER catch me in those clothes! Especially the corsets!) Kilmeny [/quote] I agree with the clothes thing, but I'm ananachronism from the 50''s and 60's,

(Gotta love the music!)

by **Milito** » Wed Aug 20, 2003 1:42 pm

[quote author=Puella Parva link=board=6;threadid=487;start=15#4468 date=1061337082] I agree with the clothes thing, but I'm ananachronism from the 50''s and 60's,

(Gotta love the music!) [/quote] .... so since I was born in the '60's, what does that make me? Or should I be afraid to ask? Kilmeny

by **Carola** » Wed Aug 20, 2003 11:04 pm

Speaking here as a musician (and a very middle aged jazz & classical one at that) I have to say I find rap much more interesting than most of the pop music dished up on the radio. Most of the lyrics in this stuff are banal and the musical ideas consist of a few cliches played over and over. At least rap rocks and is inventive - if the language offends that is a pity but I am much more offended by the hype than turns a 15 year old pretty face with no musical talent whatsoever into an "overnight sensation" and leaves most musicians working in orchestras etc on a subsistence wage (despite about 10 years of training). Maybe the rappers have something to swear about if they have to deal with the music industry!

by **Keesa** » Thu Aug 21, 2003 11:24 am

[quote author=Carola link=board=6;threadid=487;start=15#4540 date=1061420644] Speaking here as a musician (and a very middle aged jazz & classical one at that) I have to say I find rap much more interesting than most of the pop music dished up on the radio. Most of the lyrics in this stuff are banal and the musical ideas consist of a few cliches played over and over. At least rap rocks and is inventive - if the language offends that is a pity but I am much more offended by the hype than turns a 15 year old pretty face with no musical talent whatsoever into an "overnight sensation" and leaves most musicians working in orchestras etc on a subsistence wage (despite about 10 years of training). Maybe the rappers have something to swear about if they have to deal with the music industry! [/quote] Hehe. I don't listen to modern pop any more than I listen to rap. I like classical music, and Celtic, and a great deal of Christian Celtic, and a few older singers. (early Joni Mitchell, early Neil Diamond, early Judy Collins, early...you get the idea.) ;D Keesa (And, Episcopus, you don't have to worry about us; we're just strange people.

)

by **Episcopus** » Thu Aug 21, 2003 3:33 pm

[quote author=Carola link=board=6;threadid=487;start=15#4540 date=1061420644] I am much more offended by the hype than turns a 15 year old pretty face with no musical talent whatsoever into an "overnight sensation" and leaves most musicians working in orchestras etc on a subsistence wage (despite about 10 years of training). Maybe the rappers have something to swear about if they have to deal with the music industry! [/quote] Agreed verily. That is offensive and does make me very angry for every talented person in music.

Website · by **benissimus** » Fri Aug 22, 2003 1:17 am

Excellent point, Carolla, though personally I would not blame one person's success for another person's hardship. However, I do find pop to be very bland and mediocre, whereas I see rap as sometimes creative but rarely passionate or honest.

by **mariek** » Fri Aug 22, 2003 1:44 am

Whatever happened to the musician who wrote his/her own lyrics and/or played an instrument?? I think that takes much more talent than someone selling an "image" who lacks any real skill.

by **klewlis** » Fri Aug 22, 2003 3:56 am

[quote author=mariek link=board=6;threadid=487;start=15#4632 date=1061516694] Whatever happened to the musician who wrote his/her own lyrics and/or played an instrument?? I think that takes much more talent than someone selling an "image" who lacks any real skill. [/quote] The so-called "pop idols" of which you guys speak are really a tiny minority... there are only a handful of them compared to the thousands of honest, talented musicians who are still able to make a living in the industry... unfortunately it's that handful that gets most of the money and attention, but there is still a heck of a lot of good music on the radio.

by **Carola** » Fri Aug 22, 2003 5:03 am

Thanks for all the kind and supportive comments from you people about hard-working musicians! It is good to know we don't just do all that practice in vain. Just a question. I saw the term "Christian Music" mentioned earlier in the thread - what are you referring to here? Bach's chorals, Salavation Army bands ? And what did Neil Diamond have to do with this? Obviously a term I have missed or I misunderstood what was being said (and does "Celtic Chriistian" mean Irish church music from pre 1100 AD or thereabouts - before they had to follow Roman church rules? Do we have much music from then, it wasn't written down usually?) Just curious.

by **klewlis** » Fri Aug 22, 2003 5:13 am

Christian music is a huge industry in north america, growing like crazy. basically it encompasses the christian versions of nearly every possible genre... there are specifically christian labels for every genre as well. For many of us it's a great alternative to the masses of morally corrupt modern music

by **bingley** » Fri Aug 22, 2003 5:17 am

As I understand it, Christian music is basically the same genres as modern popular music but with lyrics geared to the more conservative Christian denominations in the US.

Website · by **benissimus** » Fri Aug 22, 2003 5:35 am

My mom listens to it, and uh... :-X

by **Keesa** » Fri Aug 22, 2003 11:34 am

[quote author=Carola link=board=6;threadid=487;start=15#4649 date=1061528585] Just a question. I saw the term "Christian Music" mentioned earlier in the thread - what are you referring to here? Bach's chorals, Salavation Army bands ? As was said before, Christian music can be almost any genre...I've never heard of Christian rap, but I'll bet there probably is some. And what did Neil Diamond have to do with this? Not much, actually. Neil Diamond and the others were examples I gave to explain the kind of non-Christian pop music that I like listening to. (Very little of it actually dates from the 1980s or later, so you can't accuse me of fueling the pop-idol frenzy!

) Obviously a term I have missed or I misunderstood what was being said (and does "Celtic Chriistian" mean Irish church music from pre 1100 AD or thereabouts - before they had to follow Roman church rules? Do we have much music from then, it wasn't written down usually?) Just curious. [/quote] By Celtic Christian, I meant songs with Celtic instruments and rhythms, but with Christian lyrics; Eden's Bridge has some beautiful songs, as does Iona. I love the Celtic/Irish sound, but I love it even more when it's combined with lyrics that encourage and uplift me. Many of the hymns sung in churches near us are actually of Gaelic origin...Be Thou my Vision, Morning has Broken, etc. I think one of the things I like about Celtic music (and one of the reasons I dislike rap, even the "nice" songs) is the gentle, almost delicate sound. I don't care as much for music that doesn't have that almost ethereal quality, but that doesn't make it bad music. Does that make you feel better, Episcopus? I very much doubt that you would like my choice of music any more than I like yours...

I hope this cleared up my musical tastes. ;D The kind of music you listen to reflects, I think, the deepest part of yourself, and there really isn't a "right" or "wrong" choice of music (one of the few instances where I would say that there is no right or wrong!); some forms require more skill, some more creativity; some more energy, some more dedication. In the end, I suppose we like what we like. And that's my stand on music, at least. Keesa

by **Episcopus** » Fri Aug 22, 2003 12:36 pm

[quote author=benissimus link=board=6;threadid=487;start=15#4624 date=1061515036] I see rap as sometimes creative but rarely passionate or honest. [/quote] You must be blind mate

And you live practically in the home of west coast rap. ---> Christian music...ugh making money, exploiting the religion...they should really give them away; but hey! these are american businesses of which we talk about now. I think Christian music cd advertisements (buy the ultimate 60-cd collection of the greatest hymns of praise etc. Teach them to your kids!) to be morally corrupt. It's a matter of opinion; but I think that rap is the most honest and explicit of all (but I'm not saying that rappers don't exaggerate). Really, what is the difference between "truck" and "truck" with an f minus the tr? They are selling christian "praise the lord" drivel but they're not really doing anything. People listen to a modern rock version of "When I needed a neighbour" but do they give clothes and shelter to homeless guys? They are happy to "praise the lord" provided that it cost them nothing. I don't mean to be offensive but everybody else here is allowed to be honest.

by **klewlis** » Fri Aug 22, 2003 2:50 pm

[quote author=Episcopus link=board=6;threadid=487;start=30#4665 date=1061555783] [quote author=benissimus link=board=6;threadid=487;start=15#4624 date=1061515036] I see rap as sometimes creative but rarely passionate or honest. [/quote] ---> Christian music...ugh making money, exploiting the religion...they should really give them away; but hey! these are american businesses of which we talk about now. I think Christian music cd advertisements (buy the ultimate 60-cd collection of the greatest hymns of praise etc. Teach them to your kids!) to be morally corrupt. It's a matter of opinion; but I think that rap is the most honest and explicit of all (but I'm not saying that rappers don't exaggerate). Really, what is the difference between "truck" and "truck" with an f minus the tr? They are selling christian "praise the lord" drivel but they're not really doing anything. People listen to a modern rock version of "When I needed a neighbour" but do they give clothes and shelter to homeless guys? They are happy to "praise the lord" provided that it cost them nothing. [/quote] hey, just remember not to paint us all with the same brush. it's really not nearly as bad as you make it out to be. as far as selling music goes, our musicians have to make a living just as much as anyone else (I have friends in the industry and know exactly how difficult it is). you're right that there is a point where it turns into plain commercialism and i don't like that either but the vast majority of it is honest and real. and *who* is not really doing anything? I personally do give money to poor people and spend at least one night per week at a local youth emergency shelter hanging out with street kids. I also support foster kids in third world countries. I also have a ton of volunteer experience in other areas. I don't say this toot my own horn but to point out that there are a lot of christians everywhere who really do their best to live out their faith and to help people wherever possible.

by **Episcopus** » Fri Aug 22, 2003 5:05 pm

Good for you, but here you would be in the minority. I know personally many many christians here and I detest them all because of how shallow hypocriticalque they are. conversely you are obviously intelligent interested in classics.

by **klewlis** » Fri Aug 22, 2003 6:48 pm

a person can be intelligent and even a very good person without being interested in classics, just as there are many classics people who aren't so intelligent or pleasant people... i'm sorry to hear about your bad experiences with christians... it is very unfortunate. but i have a hard time believing that they are *all* shallow and hypocritical in any given geographic area. you must have found a bad sampling...

by **Episcopus** » Fri Aug 22, 2003 7:14 pm

[quote author=klewlis link=board=6;threadid=487;start=30#4675 date=1061578132] a person can be intelligent and even a very good person without being interested in classics, just as there are many classics people who aren't so intelligent or pleasant people... [/quote] I feel that generally classics people are very intelligent. One needs intelligence to stand any chance!

Website · by **benissimus** » Fri Aug 22, 2003 9:17 pm

Episcopus, you need to practice what you preach as well. Remember that discussion about hating/stereotyping entire groups of people???

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