Textkit Logo

Aesop Fable: Ursae Catuli et Leaena

Here you can discuss all things Latin. Use this board to ask questions about grammar, discuss learning strategies, get help with a difficult passage of Latin, and more.

Aesop Fable: Ursae Catuli et Leaena

Postby testsuda » Tue Apr 25, 2017 12:45 am

Dear all,

I am facing a short but probably difficult fable as below:

Cum quaedam ursa laboriose et anxie lamberet ut catulos suos figuraret, leaena vidit et “Lambe,” ait, “quantum voles; non fiet ut ursos non educaveris.” Cura elegantem raro reddit hunc librum, quem semel partus infelix informem dedit.

The clause: "non fiet ut ursos non educaveris" seems strange to me. The last sentence is obscure also.

Please kindly help

Sincerely yours
testsuda
Textkit Neophyte
 
Posts: 78
Joined: Sun Apr 05, 2015 2:40 pm

Re: Aesop Fable: Ursae Catuli et Leaena

Postby bedwere » Tue Apr 25, 2017 1:01 am

I guess you took it from Laura Gibbs' site.

Why don't you post your tentative translation first? Also, I'm pretty sure there is a typo:

Cura elegantem raro reddit hunc liberum, quem semel partus infelix informem dedit.
User avatar
bedwere
Global Moderator
 
Posts: 2756
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2008 10:23 pm
Location: Didacopoli in California

Re: Aesop Fable: Ursae Catuli et Leaena

Postby testsuda » Tue Apr 25, 2017 2:53 am

Yes, I took it from that site.

Sorry, cause I think the first sentences are so easy for you. Ok, now is my translation for the first sentences:

Cum quaedam ursa laboriose et anxie lamberet ut catulos suos figuraret, leaena vidit et “Lambe,” ait, “quantum voles; non fiet ut ursos non educaveris

When a certain she-bear was laborously and carefully licking so that she could shape her boys, a lioness saw them and said "Lick as much as you want; THAT WILL NOT HAPPEN SO THAT YOU WILL NOT REAR YOUR CHILD-BEARS....

I still take UT here as a conjunction combined with the Subjunctive to form purpose construction.

Sincerely yours,
testsuda
Textkit Neophyte
 
Posts: 78
Joined: Sun Apr 05, 2015 2:40 pm

Re: Aesop Fable: Ursae Catuli et Leaena

Postby bedwere » Tue Apr 25, 2017 4:50 am

I'd say shape your young, rather than boys.

Remember that "ut" is used not only for final sentences but also for consecutive (the negative for which is ut non, while for the final is ne).

When a certain she-bear was laborously and carefully licking so that she could shape her young, a lioness saw them and said "Lick as much as you want; it will not happen that you won't rear bears.
User avatar
bedwere
Global Moderator
 
Posts: 2756
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2008 10:23 pm
Location: Didacopoli in California

Re: Aesop Fable: Ursae Catuli et Leaena

Postby Hylander » Tue Apr 25, 2017 12:41 pm

"Consecutive clause" = "result clause", if you're not familiar with the alternative terminology.

Now try the last sentence with Bedwere's correction.
Hylander
Textkit Zealot
 
Posts: 1113
Joined: Mon Aug 17, 2015 1:16 pm

Re: Aesop Fable: Ursae Catuli et Leaena

Postby testsuda » Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:37 am

Thanks all,

Yes, it makes more sense with "liberum", not "librum"

Cura elegantem raro reddit hunc liberum, quem semel partus infelix informem dedit.

= The worry rarely grants these young good shape - whom unfortunate birth has made formless.

If i do not confuse, the verb "dare" here takes 2 accusatives (quem and informem) one of which is the predicate adjective for the other noun.

So the tale implies that the she-bear should not hasten to shape her young, that may make her mistaken. Is it right?

Sincerely yours,
testsuda
Textkit Neophyte
 
Posts: 78
Joined: Sun Apr 05, 2015 2:40 pm

Re: Aesop Fable: Ursae Catuli et Leaena

Postby Hylander » Wed Apr 26, 2017 1:16 pm

I think you have the Latin right. Just a little help with your English:

[Parental] care rarely renders handsome the son whom an unfortunate birth has already [semel] given/produced ugly.

A mean-spirited tale.

In classical Latin plural liberi is used to mean "freeborn children" [of a parent], but liber in the singular is usually not used to mean "child" or "son."

I suppose you could say the same thing about books, but it does seem to make better sense with children.

The implication is that the she-bear should not waste her time licking her young into shape because they will never be transformed into anything less ugly than bears.
Hylander
Textkit Zealot
 
Posts: 1113
Joined: Mon Aug 17, 2015 1:16 pm


Return to Learning Latin

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Alexa [Bot], Bing [Bot], Google [Bot], Ronolio and 75 guests