Translation

[DiscoJesus]

I've been spending a bit of time try to work on trying to translate a phrase that is of personal interest to me.

"Is this living?"

After a few hours of reading I think I've managed ascertain that 'victus' is the appropriate word to use for living, and possibly 'est' as a translation for this.

However I am unable to determine what else is required to give the closest translation. If anyone could offer some help I'd greatly appreciate it.

[mraig]

Well, the English sentence "Is this living?" can have more than one meaning. If you come upon a motionless animal lying on the ground, and want to know if it's alive or not, you could ask:

"Hocne vivit?" or "Hoc est vivum?"

But I assume you mean the question more in the sense "Is this what it means to be alive?" This would probably be translated:

"Hoc est vivere?"

I see from a quick search that Petronius has (Satyricon 44.4) :

"O si haberemus illos leones, quos ego hic inveni, cum primum ex Asia veni. Illud erat vivere."

(If only we had those lions that I found here when I first came from Asia. That was living.)

[amans]

I see from a quick search that Petronius has (Satyricon 44.4) :

"O si haberemus illos leones, quos ego hic inveni, cum primum ex Asia veni. Illud erat vivere."

(If only we had those lions that I found here when I first came from Asia. That was living.)

Interesting. I wonder why Petronius didn't say fuisset instead of erat: that would have been living.

[Kasper]

I see from a quick search that Petronius has (Satyricon 44.4) :

"O si haberemus illos leones, quos ego hic inveni, cum primum ex Asia veni. Illud erat vivere."

(If only we had those lions that I found here when I first came from Asia. That was living.)

Interesting. I wonder why Petronius didn't say fuisset instead of erat: that would have been living.

probably because he actually encountered those lions in Asia, which at that time really was living.

[Drusus]

My best bet would be


First I took <b>Hoc</b>, which is the word for this. Then I added <b>ne</b> to the end to make the sentence a question. Then I used the word <b>victus</b> wich means living as a noun which is what you want. I used the <b>us</b> ending on victus because it was a singluar preticate nominative. At the end I added est, meaning is since verbs usually should go at the end.


<b>Hocne victus est</b>

[Drusus]

"Hoc est vivere?"

that wouldn't work because vivere is a verb? right? and you made it an infitive "to live"

[Deudeditus]

I would think that hoc est vivere would be a better translation..
this is to live?? The infinitive acts more like a noun than a finite form..
To live is good=living is good.
ordinarily (in english anyway) "living" would be a gerund, which I've noticed can sometimes be interchanged with the infinitive.
I love to read=I love reading, etc.
hoc est vivere=hoc est victus (though Cassell's gives victus,-us as way of living, as well, so I would feel most safe using victus in a sense like "I make my living in the legion, victum meum in legio facio" or something like that.. buuut I could be wrong. wait for a more experienced speaker of latin to give their opinion.)
don't quote the latin, I just like to write latin every chance I get. practice you know
valete amici

[benissimus]

<b>Hocne victus est</b>

victus is masculine, so hoc should be hic. victus also does not mean "living" per se but rather "a way of life". So if someone were to translate your Latin back into English it would say "is this thing a way of life?" The best ways to translate "living" in this translation would be vivere or vita, unless the person requesting the translation did indeed mean "is this a way of life?".

"Hoc est vivere?"

that wouldn't work because vivere is a verb? right? and you made it an infitive "to live"

It seems pretty silly to dispute the construction when an actual Latin author, Petronius, used it in mraig's example above (illud erat vivere = that was to live = that was living).

To elaborate on what Deudeditus has said in explaining the construction, the infinitive (e.g. "to live") is often interchangeable with the gerund (e.g. "living") and in these cases the infinitive is considered an indeclinable neuter singular nom (sts. acc) noun in Latin. In fact, Latin has no nominative gerund, so the infinitive is almost always used in these situations, and for this reason the infinitive is often referred to as the gerund nominative.

victum meum in legio facio

phrases don't cross languages well - "make a living" is an English phrase but victum facere is not a Latin phrase. nevertheless, your example does express some of the meanings of victus, e.g. "necessities of life, that upon which one lives".

[DiscoJesus]

Thank you so much for the responses. I did mean the phrase as in "is this what is it means to be alive" as most of you assumed.

Am I right in believing "Hoc est vivere?" is the best translation to use? What does this phrase translate back to english as?

Thanks everyone for the help, i really appreciate it.

[Drusus]

<b>Hocne victus est</b>

victus is masculine, so hoc should be hic. victus also does not mean "living" per se but rather "a way of life". So if someone were to translate your Latin back into English it would say "is this thing a way of life?" The best ways to translate "living" in this translation would be vivere or vita, unless the person requesting the translation did indeed mean "is this a way of life?".

Ok I understand now

[mraig]

Am I right in believing "Hoc est vivere?" is the best translation to use? What does this phrase translate back to english as?

A literal, word for word translation would be: "This is to live?" I chose this translation because (1) it sounded right to my Latin sensibilities and (2) When I looked it up, I found attestation (more than one, actually: see OLD under "vivo," meaning 7).

The reason that I used the infinitive "vivere" is that it is the best way to represent the English gerund "living" (Latin has a gerund, but it can't be used in the nominative case). The reason that I didn't use "victus" is, as many people have suggested, because I don't think it would carry exactly the meaning you were looking for. If you wanted to say "hic est victus?", I think it would call into question the creature comforts in life, especially the food; while if you say "hoc est vivere?", it calls into question the act of living in and of itself (living qua living).