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Translation

Postby Einhard » Wed Oct 14, 2009 6:09 pm

Salvete omnes,

Just have a a question or two about a few lines from LA no. 9 (Horace) from the back of Wheelock. So, without further ado:

i. optimus Vergilius et post hunc Varius dixerunt quid essem.

I translate this as, the very excellent Virgil and after this, Varius, said who/what I was.

Is this a relative clause of characteristic? If not, why the subj essem?

ii. is neque avaritiam neque sordes quisquam mihi obiciet

Or, as I have it en anglias, if anyone shall throw neither greed nor filth to me

I've placed "quisquam" as the nom with "avaritiam" and "sordes" as the acc obj. I think it makes sense grammatically,
even if something is lost in translation!

iii. tamen noluit me puerum in ludum Flavii mittere sed ausus est me Romam ferre ad artes discendas quas senatores suos filios docent

I've translated this as, he nevertheless did not wish me, his boy, in Flavius' school, but dared to send me to Rome to bear witness (endure?) to the learning arts which the senators teach to their sons

Two things caused me trouble here. There's "ad artes discendas", which I think I'm correct in placing as a gerund in the form of a gerundive. And there's "ferre" which I earlier posted about separately. I have it as "bear witness" because this satisfies "ad" and the context, but I don't know if the verb has such a meaning. It strikes me thought that I might have "ad artes discendas" wrong, and that "to learn the arts/skills" might be more correct. But I can't see how this makes sense with "ferre", unless it's something along the lines of "to bear/endure to learn the arts". Any suggestions?

And finally (woohoo!), there's the very last line:

et audax paupertas me humilem et pauperem coegit versus facere,

which becomes in my rendering, and bold poverty compelled a humble and poor me to make verses. Does anyone disagree with this translation?I've come up with what seem like plausible alternatives to this, but they don't seem to fit as well.

Anyway, that's it (for now!). I have another just translated passage that I was going to pick your collective brains on, but I think I've asked enough for one day! Thanks in advance...
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Re: Translation

Postby adrianus » Wed Oct 14, 2009 7:19 pm

1. It's a reported question, reported in the past: "what am I?",—hence the present indicative becoming imperfect subjunctive in the question.
Est quaestio obliqua, praeteritum per tempus citata: "quid sum?",—quâre, quoàd attinet ad quaestionem, mutatur tempus praesens in praeteritum imperfectum, in subjunctivum modus indicativus.

2. If no one will impute either greed or stinginess to me

3. Nevertheless, he didn't want to send me as a boy [in]to Flavius's school but took it upon himself [/undertook/determined] to bring me to Rome [in order] to learn the arts that senators teach their sons.

4. It's fine, except... Benè versum est, praeterquàm ita... non "bold poverty" sed "desperate poverty"
I'm writing in Latin hoping for correction, and not because I'm confident in how I express myself. Latinè scribo ut ab omnibus corrigar, non quod confidenter me exprimam.
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Re: Translation

Postby Einhard » Thu Oct 15, 2009 6:10 pm

Much appreciated adrianus.
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