Textkit Logo

Inspecting Romans 9:5

Are you learning New Testament Greek with Mounce's Basics of Biblical Greek? Here's where you can meet other learners using this textbook. Use this board to ask questions and post your work for feedback. Use this forum too to discuss all things Koine, LXX & New Testament Greek including grammar, syntax, textbook talk and more.

Inspecting Romans 9:5

Postby Markos » Sat Apr 26, 2014 10:25 pm

Romans 9:5:
ὧν οἱ πατέρες, καὶ ἐξ ὧν ὁ Χριστὸς τὸ κατὰ σάρκα, ὁ ὢν ἐπὶ πάντων θεὸς, εὐλογητὸς εἰς τοὺς αἰῶνας. ἀμήν.

How would a Uniterian read this one? I certainly may be wrong, but it appears to me clear that Christ is called θεός here.
Markos
Textkit Zealot
 
Posts: 1305
Joined: Sun Jun 21, 2009 8:07 pm
Location: Colorado

Re: Inspecting Romans 9:5

Postby jeidsath » Sun Apr 27, 2014 4:25 am

Are you using 1904 Nestle-Aland? It had the comma after "θεὸς." Newer editions have no comma, and UBS has it before "θεὸς." If the newer editions are correct, Paul was perhaps quoting Psalm 67:19 (Septuagint) with his language of "θεὸς εὐλογητός."

The NASB and KJV have "who is over all, God blessed forever" for this verse, perhaps enough for a Unitarian.

But to go further, maybe it's not impossible that "ὁ" from "ὁ ὢν ἐπὶ πάντων" is in apposition to "θεὸς?" This would also allow the reader to see Paul's "ὁ ἐπὶ πάντων" in Romans 9:5 as the same as "ὁ ἐπὶ πάντων" in Ephesians 4:6, which does refer to the Father. To know whether perceived disunity between the verses is very strange, it might be useful to compile a list of phrases that Paul uses to refer to the Father and in another place refer to the Son?

Now all that said, Christ's precise relationship to the Godhead seems to be a topic of less interest to first century Christians than it was to the Christians of later centuries. John touches on the topic, but he seems to be telling us that it's not something that we can understand anything very precise about. The one who thought equality with God "οὐχ ἁρπαγμὸν" had more important things to tell us, perhaps. The primary Greek that modern Christians need to be figuring out is Paul's "οὐ γὰρ ἔκρινά τι εἰδέναι ἐν ὑμῖν εἰ μὴ Ἰησοῦν Χριστὸν καὶ τοῦτον ἐσταυρωμένον" and his "καὶ μὴ ᾖ ἐν ὑμῖν σχίσματα."
User avatar
jeidsath
Textkit Neophyte
 
Posts: 83
Joined: Mon Dec 30, 2013 2:42 pm

Re: Inspecting Romans 9:5

Postby Markos » Wed Apr 30, 2014 10:28 pm

You are right, Joel. There are several ways to punctuate the text. I would construe it thus:
ὁ Χριστὸς, ὁ θεὸς ὅς ἐστιν ἐπὶ πάντων, ὁ θεὸς ὅς ἐστιν εὐλογητὸς εἰς τοὺς αἰῶνας. ἀμήν.

But I can see the rational for other options.
ὁ Χριστὸς ὅς ἐστιν ἐπὶ πάντων. θεὸς εἴη εὐλογητὸς εἰς τοὺς αἰῶνας. ἀμήν.

jeidsath wrote:The primary Greek that modern Christians need to be figuring out is Paul's "οὐ γὰρ ἔκρινά τι εἰδέναι ἐν ὑμῖν εἰ μὴ Ἰησοῦν Χριστὸν καὶ τοῦτον ἐσταυρωμένον" and his "καὶ μὴ ᾖ ἐν ὑμῖν σχίσματα."

σύμφημι δή!
Markos
Textkit Zealot
 
Posts: 1305
Joined: Sun Jun 21, 2009 8:07 pm
Location: Colorado

Re: Inspecting Romans 9:5

Postby mwh » Sat May 24, 2014 1:56 am

Theology is not my thing, but it seems to me that anyone who wishes to deny Christ's divinity in Pauline theology is going to have a tough time with this, however punctuated - as to which, qeos euloghtos should surely not be separated.
mwh
Textkit Enthusiast
 
Posts: 400
Joined: Fri Oct 18, 2013 2:34 am

Re: Inspecting Romans 9:5

Postby Isaac Newton » Sat May 24, 2014 5:16 am

mwh wrote:Theology is not my thing, but it seems to me that anyone who wishes to deny Christ's divinity in Pauline theology is going to have a tough time with this, however punctuated - as to which, qeos euloghtos should surely not be separated.


Could I ask you to elaborate, what exactly that means ?
Isaac Newton
Textkit Member
 
Posts: 119
Joined: Thu May 30, 2013 3:15 am

Re: Inspecting Romans 9:5

Postby mwh » Sun Jun 01, 2014 10:29 pm

Certainly you could. I even expected you to.
mwh
Textkit Enthusiast
 
Posts: 400
Joined: Fri Oct 18, 2013 2:34 am


Return to Koine Greek And Mounce's Basics of Biblical Greek

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 21 guests