Memorization of sentences

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daivid
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Memorization of sentences

Post by daivid »

Memorization of sentences seems to in practice to work like the audio lingual method. To actually memorize a sentence you have repeat it lots of times. If the audio lingual works so should sentence memorization. The audio lingual historically followed on from the grammar-translation method and while for modern languages it has in turn been eclipsed by communicative methods. http://www.pnglanguages.org/LinguaLinks ... uccess.pdf
I am not convinced memorization is the best method but the thing is it is something I can do while doing the housework or exercising when reading a text is impossible. My first choice would be communicative Ancient Greek but I lack an Ancient Greek speaking flatmate.

It does seem to me, however, that having a sentence in my head makes reading Greek easier even when those sentences differ markedly from what I am actually reading.
Also prepositions and particles that a not very common are often very difficult to learn. Leaning a sentence with those words seems to do the trick even after I allow that sentence to fade from my brain.

Hence even though I am not sure it is the best method memorization seems to be useful supplement especially as it uses up time that I could not otherwise use for Greek study.
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Markos
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Re: Memorization of sentences

Post by Markos »

daivid wrote:I am not convinced memorization is the best method...
I know that there are people who swear by this method. I believe Ancient Greek school kids learned Homer this way. Given that different people learn differently, I have no doubt it will work well for some. And, like chicken soup for a cold, whether it helps or not, it can't hurt.

But for what it is worth, at some point while learning New Testament Greek, I memorized the Lord's Prayer and the Apostles' Creed in Greek. In retrospect I don't think it helped my Greek much. Logically, it should have helped internalize the forms, but for me, anyway, it was not one of the more effective methods I used.

Maybe if one is to memorize sentences, they should be difficult ones.
daivid wrote:... but the thing is it is something I can do while doing the housework or exercising when reading a text is impossible.
I call this τὸν καιρὸν ἐξαγοραζόμενος.

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Re: Memorization of sentences

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daivid
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Re: Memorization of sentences

Post by daivid »

MarkAntony198337 wrote:Excellent candidates for memorization are maxims, whether expressly written as such or when taken out of the longer texts of classical authors as quotations. Not only are they easier to remember than any other form of writing, being short and concise, but they give you something precious and substantial to take about with you in life.
Curiously I find short sentences harder to remember than longer sentences. I think it is because my brain doesn't bother to put something so brief into long term memory. When learning a long and convoluted sentence my brain gets it that long term memory has to be used or I forget the beginning while memorizing the end.

But I fully agree with your point that it helps a great deal if the sentences being memorized have value in themselves that is to say because of what they mean, rather than the grammar etc which they illustrate, it helps a lot.
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MarkAntony198337
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Re: Memorization of sentences

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swtwentyman
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Re: Memorization of sentences

Post by swtwentyman »

Re: short stuff being harder than long

I've actually found much the same thing with memorizing vocabulary. Right now I have only three cards from yesterday's reading and when I have few I have a harder time in learning them. Maybe it's just because I spend less effort with light work than when I know it'll be a struggle; I've been going over the three words in my head rather than drilling them with the actual cards. Even when the vocabulary has several verbs with irregular forms I find them easier to memorize when there's a lot of it.

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Re: Memorization of sentences

Post by mwh »

Demosthenes chose to transcribe the whole of Thucydides eight times as part of his training as an orator

If you believe that I have a bridge to sell you. Thucydides would be worse than useless to an orator. But I could almost credit the pebbles story: that’s about delivery (ὑπόκρισις).

I have nothing against memorization of passages short or long, but bear in mind (a) it’s useless unless you properly understand exactly how the Greek works, and (b) it takes time away from reading and learning new stuff. I prefer close observation to actual memorization. Verse can be very memorable, however.

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Re: Memorization of sentences

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daivid
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Re: Memorization of sentences

Post by daivid »

mwh wrote: I have nothing against memorization of passages short or long, but bear in mind (a) it’s useless unless you properly understand exactly how the Greek works, and (b) it takes time away from reading and learning new stuff. I prefer close observation to actual memorization. Verse can be very memorable, however.
a) For me at least, memorization forces me to pay intense attention to how the sentence works. This is especially true when I am re-memorizing a sentence as I am recreating it in my mind. (If I were Xenophon would I use a participle or a verb here).
To memorize a sentence as if they were random sounds would be very hard.

b) As I mentioned I tend to do memorization in situations that make it impossible to read new text. Even if that were not true, you underestimate how hard it is for me to read new text. When I read a new bit of Greek for some time all I see is a confusing fog which only after much effort begins to clear. Hence I am far from convinced that reading new text is especially useful. When memorizing text, I am at least spending my time on Greek that I understand rather than on Greek that for most of the time I don't. I mean in the sense of the time time devoted on a sentence the first 90% it is a confusing mess and only 10% of my time at the end does it finally make sense.
I suspect that for me to read actual Greek at this stage is premature and there are more effective ways I could use my time but as this is only a hunch I still do it but make sure it doesn't crowd out other things.

Yesterday going to the shop I memorized a sentence from Farnell mainly because it contained ἔφησθα. I was convinced that it was was the first time I had ever encountered that form of φημί. It turns out I was wrong but as I read very slowly it was some months ago that I encountered it in Xenophon and if had completely slipped from my memory. If I rely on reading new text I will never learn that form so unless I do something like memorization I am stuck in a catch 22 where I don't learn because I read slowly and I read slowly because I don't learn.
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mwh
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Re: Memorization of sentences

Post by mwh »

Please forgive me if I don’t engage with these good posts. There’s some Greek I want to study!

daivid
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Re: Memorization of sentences

Post by daivid »

mwh wrote:Please forgive me if I don’t engage with these good posts. There’s some Greek I want to study!
Point taken. And I would add that on reflection I overstated my case. As a warning to not go overboard with memorization as a technique to the extent it crowds out other things your post was a welcome corrective.
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MarkAntony198337
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Re: Memorization of sentences

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