Textkit Logo

Help with translation

Here you can discuss all things Ancient Greek. Use this board to ask questions about grammar, discuss learning strategies, get help with a difficult passage of Greek, and more.

Help with translation

Postby godingly » Sun Feb 21, 2016 7:11 am

Hey, I've been trying to translate the following sentences:
1) ἅ δεῖ παρὼν φρόνιζε, μὴ παρὼν ἀπῃς
I've looked the words up, but nothing makes sense. What is the meaning of ἀπῃς in this sentence? is it aorist or active? of παρὼν ? and what is the overall translation?

2) I've translated "When we won't be present, they will look for us" as "ὅταν μή παρῶμεν, ζητήσουσιν ἡμᾶς."
Is this translation correct?
3) I want to translate the last sentence with a participle instead of preposition for 'when'. How do I do that? is "ἡμεῖς, παρόντες, ζητήσουσιν ἡμᾶς" even remotely correct?
godingly
Textkit Neophyte
 
Posts: 22
Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2015 8:12 am

Re: Help with translation

Postby Paul Derouda » Sun Feb 21, 2016 8:33 am

ἅ δεῖ παρὼν φρόνιζε, μὴ παρὼν ἀπῃς
"What must [be thought about], think about it while you're present; don't be absent if you're [actually] present"
"Absent" must mean "absent-minded".

παρών comes from πάρειμι "to be present" – I hadn't noticed it's accented like that.

ἀπῃς must be 2nd person subjunctive present of ἄπειμι "be absent" . This must be a case of the subjunctive used in a prohibition. The other possibility for μὴ παρὼν ἀπῃς is something like "lest you should be absent while being present", but that doesn't make any sense to me.

I can't see anything wrong with your translations, but I'm not accustomed to Greek composition, so don't trust me.

EDIT: the "other possibility" makes perfect sense, I just replied too hastily.

"What must [be thought about], think about it while you're present, lest you be absent while you're [actually] present."

Feel free to change "lest" to a more contemporary English expression... :)

I now think this is actually better than what I first posted, which would probably need some sort of conjunction, μηδὲ παρὼν ἀπῃς or something.
User avatar
Paul Derouda
Global Moderator
 
Posts: 1841
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2010 9:39 pm

Re: Help with translation

Postby Paul Derouda » Sun Feb 21, 2016 12:09 pm

My post is very unclear. It's difficult to translate it exactly into English, but a less literal translation would go like this:

"Take heed of matters at hand, or otherwise you're absent even if you're present."

And like I said, my first interpretation is likely not correct; this is not a subjunctive of prohibition. μη means "lest".
User avatar
Paul Derouda
Global Moderator
 
Posts: 1841
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2010 9:39 pm

Re: Help with translation

Postby jeidsath » Sun Feb 21, 2016 5:17 pm

There's something wrong with this, I think. φρόνιζε should be φρόντιζε. But I don't really understand the construction. godingly, I believe that these examples generally come from the textbook that you're working through (with your class?). Can you post an image of the text?
Joel Eidsath -- jeidsath@gmail.com

μὴ δ’ οὕτως ἀγαθός περ ἐὼν θεοείκελ’ Ἀχιλλεῦ
κλέπτε νόῳ, ἐπεὶ οὐ παρελεύσεαι οὐδέ με πείσεις.
User avatar
jeidsath
Administrator
 
Posts: 1984
Joined: Mon Dec 30, 2013 2:42 pm
Location: Γαλεήπολις, Οὐισκόνσιν

Re: Help with translation

Postby mwh » Sun Feb 21, 2016 6:04 pm

1) ἅ δεῖ παρὼν φρόνιζε, μὴ παρὼν ἀπῃς
(φρόνιζε typo for φρόντιζε.)
This is an iambic trimeter. The second part reads like gibberish to me, however it’s construed. Paul's done all that can be done with it as it stands.
2) I've translated "When we won't be present, they will look for us" as "ὅταν μή παρῶμεν, ζητήσουσιν ἡμᾶς."
Is this translation correct?
3) I want to translate the last sentence with a participle instead of preposition for 'when'. How do I do that? is "ἡμεῖς, παρόντες, ζητήσουσιν ἡμᾶς" even remotely correct?

Try ζητήσουσιν ἡμᾶς οὐ παρόντας. The participle has to agree with ημας.
mwh
Textkit Zealot
 
Posts: 2367
Joined: Fri Oct 18, 2013 2:34 am


Return to Learning Greek

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google Adsense [Bot], truks, Yahoo [Bot] and 82 guests