5th-century Coan inscription
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5th-century Coan inscription
Retrieved from Abhandlungen der Preussischen Akademie der Wissenschaften, 1928, issue 6:
Αἴ τίς κα τάμνῃ τὰς κυπαρίσσος τὰς ἐν τῷ τεμένει ἢ τὰς ἔξω τοῦ τεμένεος ἢ φέρῃ τὰ ξύλεα ἐκ τοῦ τεμένεος τὰ κυπαρίσσινα, χιλίας δραχμὰς ἀποτεισάτω καὶ τὸ ἱαρὸν ἀσεβείτω, αἴ κα μὴ ἐκκλησίᾳ δόξει ἐς δαμόσιον ἔργον. φαινόντω δὲ τοὶ ἐπιμεληταὶ τοῦ τεμένεος καὶ τῶν ἄλλων ὁ χρῄζων ἐς τὰν ἐκκλησίαν κατὰ τὸν ἱαρὸν νόμον καὶ τὸν μαστρικόν.
(Normalised Attic, if it's easier: Εἰ ἄν τις τέμνῃ τὰς κυπαρίττους τὰς ἐν τῷ τεμένει ἢ τὰς ἔξω τοῦ τεμένεος ἢ φέρῃ τὰ ξύλα ἐκ τοῦ τεμένεος τὰ κυπαρίττινα, χιλίας δραχμὰς ἀποτεισάτω καὶ τὸ ἱερὸν ἀσεβείτω, εἰ ἂν μὴ ἐκκλησίᾳ δόξει εἰς δημόσιον ἔργον. φαινόντων δὲ οἱ ἐπιμεληταὶ τοῦ τεμένεος καὶ τῶν ἄλλων ὁ χρῄζων εἰς τὴν ἐκκλησίαν κατὰ τὸν ἱερὸν νόμον καὶ τὸν μαστρικόν.)
My translation: If anyone cuts the cypress trees in the τέμενος or outside of the τέμενος or carries the wood of the cypress out of the τέμενος, he shall pay a thousand drachmas and commit sacrilege against the temple, if it does not seem to the assembly a public matter; and the curators of the land and of the ἄλλος shall (if necessary) appear before the assembly according to the holy law and the μαστρικός.
Is there a good English translation for τέμενος? What does τῶν ἄλλων refer to? What is μαστρικός ("the official" was my best guess, but the official of what?) and does it belong to κατά or φαινόντω? Are there any errors in my translation?
Αἴ τίς κα τάμνῃ τὰς κυπαρίσσος τὰς ἐν τῷ τεμένει ἢ τὰς ἔξω τοῦ τεμένεος ἢ φέρῃ τὰ ξύλεα ἐκ τοῦ τεμένεος τὰ κυπαρίσσινα, χιλίας δραχμὰς ἀποτεισάτω καὶ τὸ ἱαρὸν ἀσεβείτω, αἴ κα μὴ ἐκκλησίᾳ δόξει ἐς δαμόσιον ἔργον. φαινόντω δὲ τοὶ ἐπιμεληταὶ τοῦ τεμένεος καὶ τῶν ἄλλων ὁ χρῄζων ἐς τὰν ἐκκλησίαν κατὰ τὸν ἱαρὸν νόμον καὶ τὸν μαστρικόν.
(Normalised Attic, if it's easier: Εἰ ἄν τις τέμνῃ τὰς κυπαρίττους τὰς ἐν τῷ τεμένει ἢ τὰς ἔξω τοῦ τεμένεος ἢ φέρῃ τὰ ξύλα ἐκ τοῦ τεμένεος τὰ κυπαρίττινα, χιλίας δραχμὰς ἀποτεισάτω καὶ τὸ ἱερὸν ἀσεβείτω, εἰ ἂν μὴ ἐκκλησίᾳ δόξει εἰς δημόσιον ἔργον. φαινόντων δὲ οἱ ἐπιμεληταὶ τοῦ τεμένεος καὶ τῶν ἄλλων ὁ χρῄζων εἰς τὴν ἐκκλησίαν κατὰ τὸν ἱερὸν νόμον καὶ τὸν μαστρικόν.)
My translation: If anyone cuts the cypress trees in the τέμενος or outside of the τέμενος or carries the wood of the cypress out of the τέμενος, he shall pay a thousand drachmas and commit sacrilege against the temple, if it does not seem to the assembly a public matter; and the curators of the land and of the ἄλλος shall (if necessary) appear before the assembly according to the holy law and the μαστρικός.
Is there a good English translation for τέμενος? What does τῶν ἄλλων refer to? What is μαστρικός ("the official" was my best guess, but the official of what?) and does it belong to κατά or φαινόντω? Are there any errors in my translation?
εἰς ἄκρον περ ὄρος βραδέως τε μόγις τ' ἀναβαίνων
γῆν ἀποπίπτουσαν ἔκ μεο θηέομαι
γῆν ἀποπίπτουσαν ἔκ μεο θηέομαι
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Re: 5th-century Coan inscription
RE: translation for τέμενος?
Herod.
Book 9, section 25, line 16
ἀπικόμενοι δὲ ἐτάσσοντο κατὰ ἔθνεα πλησίον τῆς τε κρήνης
τῆς Γαργαφίης καὶ τοῦ τεμένεος τοῦ Ἀνδροκράτεος τοῦ
ἥρωος διὰ ὄχθων τε οὐκ ὑψηλῶν καὶ ἀπέδου χώρου.
and when they were there they arrayed themselves nation by nation near the Gargaphian spring and the precinct of the hero Androcrates, among low hills and in a level country. LCL 1920
LSJEuripides Medea Line 1379
οὐ δῆτ᾿, ἐπεί σφας τῇδ᾿ ἐγὼ θάψω χερί,
φέρουσ᾿ ἐς Ἥρας τέμενος Ἀκραίας θεοῦ,
ὡς μή τις αὐτοὺς πολεμίων καθυβρίσῃ
τύμβους ἀνασπῶν·
Certainly not. I shall bury them with my own hand, taking them to the sanctuary of Hera Akraia, 22 so that none of my enemies may outrage them by tearing up their graves. LCL Kovacs 1994
τέμεν-ος, εος, τό, Arc. nom. and acc. sg.
τέμενες IG5(2).432.31,42 (Megalop., ii B.C.); Aeol. gen. sg. τεμένηος Alc.152: (τέμνω):—a piece of land cut off and assigned as an official domain, esp. to kings and chiefs, καὶ μέν οἱ [Βελλεροφόντῃ] Αύκιοι τ. τάμον ἔξοχον ἄλλων καλὸν φυταλιῆς καὶ ἀρούρης, ὄφρα νέμοιτο Il.6.194, cf. 20.184,391; τ. περικαλλὲς . . πεντηκοντόγυον 9.578, cf. 12.313; τ. βασιλήϊον 18.550; δμῶες Ὀδυσσῆος τ. μέγα κοπρίσσοντες Od.17.299, cf. 6.293: in pl., τεμένεα 11.185; τεμένη, μέρος τιμῆς Arist.Rh.1361a35.
a piece of land marked off from common uses and dedicated to a god, precinct, ἔνθα τέ οἱ τ. βωμός τε θυήεις Il.8.48, cf. 2.696, al., Pi.N.10.19, IG12.94.29, etc.; τὸ τ. τῶν ἡρῴων Test.Epict.2.13; in it stood the temple or shrine, Hdt.2.112, 155, 3.142; Πρωτεσίλεω τάφος τε καὶ τ. περὶ αὐτόν Id.9.116: hence the Pythian race-course is called a τέμενος, Pi.P.5.33; Syracuse is the τ. Ἄρεος ib.2.2; the sacred valley of the Nile is the Νείλοιο πῖον τ. Κρονίδα ib. 4.56; the lake formed by the Cephisus is the τ. Καφισίδος ib.12.27; the Acropolis is the ἱερὸν τ. (of Pallas), Ar.Lys.483 (lyr.): poet. also, τέμενος αἰθέρος A.Pers.365; ἀνέμων Philet.13; Μαραθὼν σῆς ἀρετῆς τ. IG14.1185 (Rome); τρόπαια στησάμενοι Διὸς . . τέμενος to be a grove of Zeus, Tim.Pers.211; of sacred grones, h.Ven.267.
temple, ἄγαμαι τοῦ τ. τῆς ὀροφῆς Chor.p.88 B., cf. p.116 B.
C. Stirling Bartholomew
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Re: 5th-century Coan inscription
“sacred precinct” or just “precinct” usually works well enough for τέμενος.
τῶν ἄλλων refers to those besides the επιμεληται. τῶν ἄλλων ὁ χρῄζων basically amounts to “anyone else who wants.” In Attic ὁ χρηζων would be ὁ βουλομενος, a common legal formula, and των αλλων is partitive genitive. So anyone who chooses, not just the epimeletai, is to appear before the ekklesia. It’s a blanket provision.
τον μαστρικον sc. νομον I presume. This should be a law regarding pimping—which would also be a violation of the official sacredness of the precinct. Temple grounds were a favored locale for prositution, as they still are. I don't know how these laws would apply to cypress-cutting; I imagine they were laws governing any form of sacrilege or indecent behavior. — Cypresses suggest death, cemeteries. Was this a heroon, perhaps, rather than a major god temple precinct? Is there a site connected with the inscription?
κατα “in accordance with,” just as you have it.
“he is to pay a penalty of 10K dr. and (be deemed) to be guilty of asebeia (impiety) unless the Assembly determine it to be a public [as distinct from sacred] deed”? But I don’t properly understand ἐς δαμόσιον ἔργον. What is the ες doing?
αἴ κα μὴ ἐκκλησίᾳ δόξει = not εἰ ἂν μὴ ἐκκλησίᾳ δόξει but εαν μη ,,, δοξῃ? τεμενεος > τεμενους.
Don't take these off-the-cuff answers as in any way definitive. I rarely read laws, in any language.
EDIT. This is a VERY bad post. Please ignore it.
τῶν ἄλλων refers to those besides the επιμεληται. τῶν ἄλλων ὁ χρῄζων basically amounts to “anyone else who wants.” In Attic ὁ χρηζων would be ὁ βουλομενος, a common legal formula, and των αλλων is partitive genitive. So anyone who chooses, not just the epimeletai, is to appear before the ekklesia. It’s a blanket provision.
τον μαστρικον sc. νομον I presume. This should be a law regarding pimping—which would also be a violation of the official sacredness of the precinct. Temple grounds were a favored locale for prositution, as they still are. I don't know how these laws would apply to cypress-cutting; I imagine they were laws governing any form of sacrilege or indecent behavior. — Cypresses suggest death, cemeteries. Was this a heroon, perhaps, rather than a major god temple precinct? Is there a site connected with the inscription?
κατα “in accordance with,” just as you have it.
“he is to pay a penalty of 10K dr. and (be deemed) to be guilty of asebeia (impiety) unless the Assembly determine it to be a public [as distinct from sacred] deed”? But I don’t properly understand ἐς δαμόσιον ἔργον. What is the ες doing?
αἴ κα μὴ ἐκκλησίᾳ δόξει = not εἰ ἂν μὴ ἐκκλησίᾳ δόξει but εαν μη ,,, δοξῃ? τεμενεος > τεμενους.
Don't take these off-the-cuff answers as in any way definitive. I rarely read laws, in any language.
EDIT. This is a VERY bad post. Please ignore it.
Last edited by mwh on Fri Oct 16, 2015 4:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 5th-century Coan inscription
Nobody likes the trees on their preserve poached.
εἰ ἂν μὴ ἐκκλησίᾳ δόξει εἰς δημόσιον ἔργον
"If it shall not seem to the assembly that it was for a public work." ?
εἰ ἂν μὴ ἐκκλησίᾳ δόξει εἰς δημόσιον ἔργον
"If it shall not seem to the assembly that it was for a public work." ?
“One might get one’s Greek from the very lips of Homer and Plato." "In which case they would certainly plough you for the Little-go. The German scholars have improved Greek so much.”
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Re: 5th-century Coan inscription
Mwh, how do you know μαστρικον refers to pimping? I couldn't find that sort of meaning in LSJ. Are they just being euphemistic to the point of being obscure?
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Re: 5th-century Coan inscription
μαστρικόν is related to μαστήρ here, right?
Maybe mwh is suggesting that it's some noun form of μαστίζω? Is that where the Latin term that English speakers use to describe self-pleasure comes from?μαστῆρες, οἱ, officers appointed to ascertain and get possession of the assets of public debtors and exiles at Athens, Hyp.Fr.133; at Amorgos, IG 12(7).62.54.
“One might get one’s Greek from the very lips of Homer and Plato." "In which case they would certainly plough you for the Little-go. The German scholars have improved Greek so much.”
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Re: 5th-century Coan inscription
Ah, thanks, that makes more sense.mwh wrote:τῶν ἄλλων refers to those besides the επιμεληται. τῶν ἄλλων ὁ χρῄζων basically amounts to “anyone else who wants.” In Attic ὁ χρηζων would be ὁ βουλομενος, a common legal formula, and των αλλων is partitive genitive. So anyone who chooses, not just the epimeletai, is to appear before the ekklesia. It’s a blanket provision.
That too. So, better translation:jeidsath wrote:εἰ ἂν μὴ ἐκκλησίᾳ δόξει εἰς δημόσιον ἔργον
"If it shall not seem to the assembly that it was for a public work." ?
If anyone cuts the cypress trees in the precinct or outside of the precinct, or carries the wood of the cypress out of the precinct, he shall pay a thousand drachmas and commit sacrilege against the temple, unless it seems to the assembly to be for a public work; and the curators of the land and anyone else who wishes shall appear before the assembly according to the holy law and the μαστρικός.
I was under the impression it was ma(ni)-sturbō?jeidsath wrote:Maybe mwh is suggesting that it's some noun form of μαστίζω? Is that where the Latin term that English speakers use to describe self-pleasure comes from?
Ah, yes, it's the Asclepion at Epidaurus. Sorry for not saying so earlier.mwh wrote:Is there a site connected with the inscription?
εἰς ἄκρον περ ὄρος βραδέως τε μόγις τ' ἀναβαίνων
γῆν ἀποπίπτουσαν ἔκ μεο θηέομαι
γῆν ἀποπίπτουσαν ἔκ μεο θηέομαι
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Re: 5th-century Coan inscription
No,ObsequiousNewt wrote:I was under the impression it was ma(ni)-sturbō?jeidsath wrote:Maybe mwh is suggesting that it's some noun form of μαστίζω? Is that where the Latin term that English speakers use to describe self-pleasure comes from?
mas = ἄρσην
turbo = ταράσσω
Corrections are welcome (especially for projects).
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Re: 5th-century Coan inscription
That will teach me to dash off a post without looking anything up. I was talking through my hat.
I had not μαστρ- but μαστροπ- in mind. Very bad. μαστρικος (νομος) is in LSJ, cf. μαστρός, μαστρεία; derived from μασσασθαι.
“for a public work” Yes, obviously. How could I have missed that, I’ve seen it hundreds of times.
1K not 10, of course.
And yes, cutting down sanctuary trees is serious stuff. Think of poor Erysichthon.
I’ll now go stand in the corner, hanging my head in shame.
PS Really Epidaurus not Cos?
I had not μαστρ- but μαστροπ- in mind. Very bad. μαστρικος (νομος) is in LSJ, cf. μαστρός, μαστρεία; derived from μασσασθαι.
“for a public work” Yes, obviously. How could I have missed that, I’ve seen it hundreds of times.
1K not 10, of course.
And yes, cutting down sanctuary trees is serious stuff. Think of poor Erysichthon.
I’ll now go stand in the corner, hanging my head in shame.
PS Really Epidaurus not Cos?
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Re: 5th-century Coan inscription
...Yes. I derped quite badly.mwh wrote:PS Really Epidaurus not Cos?
εἰς ἄκρον περ ὄρος βραδέως τε μόγις τ' ἀναβαίνων
γῆν ἀποπίπτουσαν ἔκ μεο θηέομαι
γῆν ἀποπίπτουσαν ἔκ μεο θηέομαι