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Athenaze Study Group - Lesson 2

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Athenaze Study Group - Lesson 2

Postby brunapogliano » Sat Aug 16, 2014 10:30 pm

Hello,
this is my exercise 2a from Chapter 2

1. I call the slave.
2. The slave works in the house.
3. Why don't you hurry?
4. I'm not lazy.
5. You are strong.
6. He carries the plow.
7. I hurry to the field.
8. Why are you calling the slave?
9. The slave is not lazy.
10.The slave comes out of the house.

that's all for today.
:)
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Re: Athenaze Study Group - Lesson 2

Postby daivid » Sun Aug 17, 2014 2:04 pm

I didn't say I was going to participate so I hope it is okay to join in late. I have done all the English to Greek translations for the second lesson.

Also this is from the 2nd Edition - that's what we're working from isn't it?






1) οὐ σπεύδει.
2) διὰ τί οὐ πονεῖς;
3) φέρω τὸν ἄροτρον.
4) σπεύδεις πρὸς τὸν ἀγρόν.
5) ῥᾴθυμος ἐστίν.
6) οὐκ εἰμὶ ἰσχυρός.
7) οὐκ εἶ δοῦλος.
8 ) ὁ δοῦλος οὐ πονεῖ.
9) ὁ δοῦλος φέρει τὸν ἄροτρον πρὸς τὸν ἀγρόν.
10) ῥάθυμος εἰμί.

2F
1) The slave is not an Athenian.
Ξανθίας οὐ ἐστὶ ἰσχυρὸς.
2) Dikaeopolis goes out of his house and calls the slave.
ὁ δοῦλος σπεύδει πρὸς τὸν ἀγρὸν καὶ φέρει τὸν ἄροτρον.
(or if we are allowed to use participles: ὁ δοῦλος σπεύδει πρὸς τὸν ἀγρὸν φέρων τὸν ἄροτρον.)
3) The slave does not help but sits under the tree.
ὁ ἄνθρωπος οὑ πονεῖ ἀλλὰ βαδίζει πρὸς τὴν οἰκίαν.
4) Go into the home, Xanthas, and carry the grain.
σπεῦδε, ὦ δοῦλε, ἐξέλαυνε τοὺς βοῦς.
5) Don't sit, Xanthas but help.
μὴ δεῦρο ἐλθὲ, ὦ ἄνθρωπε, ἀλλὰ πόνε ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ.

2g
1) Δικαεόπολις οὐκέτι πόνει ἀλλὰ λύει τοὺς βοῦς.
2) ἔπειτα δε καλεῖ τὸν δοῦλον καὶ λέγει «μὴ πονε μηκέτι ἀλλὰ δεῦρο ἐλθὲ καὶ λάμβανε τὸν ἀροτόν. ἐλαύνω μὲν γὰρ ἐγὼ τοὺς βοῦς, σὺ δὲ φέρει τὸν ἀροτόν».
3) οὕτως Δικαεόπολις ἐλαύνει τοὺς βοῦς καὶ Ξανθίας λαμβάνει τὸν ἄροτρον καὶ φέρει αὐτὸν πρὸς τὴν οἰκίαν.
Last edited by daivid on Sat Aug 23, 2014 4:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Athenaze Study Group - Lesson 2

Postby brunapogliano » Sun Aug 17, 2014 5:11 pm

Hello, I'm going to paste my translation only if different from yours, which is nearly perfect to my knowledge. just:
Ex. 2B
10) ῥάθυμος εἰμί.

unless I have a wrong edition, mine says "he is not lazy" = οὐκ ἔστιν αργός.

Ex. 2F
1) Ξανθίας οὐ ἐστὶ ἰσχυρὸς.

ὁ Ξανθίας οὐκ ἔστιν ἰσχυρός.

2) ...τὸν ἄροτρον

τὸ ἄροτρον
3) ...sits

sleeps
οὑ πονεῖ

οὐ πονεῖ

4) ok, I wrote ἐλθὲ δεῦρο, ὦ δοῦλε, καὶ εἰσέλαυνε τοὺς βοῦς. Do you agree? my edition says: lead in the oxen.


5) I seem to have a different version, mine says: don't work, Xanthias, come here instead!
and:
don't sleep, man, but work in the field = Μὴ καθεῦδε, ὦ ἄνθρωπε, ἀλλὰ πόνει ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ

so far for now.
bye
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Re: Athenaze Study Group - Week 1 - Lesson 1

Postby brunapogliano » Sun Aug 17, 2014 5:16 pm

Athenaze I - CH 2
Ex. 2C

1. Go out of the house, Xanthias, and come here.
2. Don't sleep, slave, work instead!
3. Don't be so hard, master.
4. Lift the plow and hurry to the field.
5. Call the slave, master.
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Re: Athenaze Study Group - Week 1 - Lesson 1

Postby brunapogliano » Wed Aug 20, 2014 8:41 am

hello,
Athenaze I - CH 2 - ex. 2D
Give the correct form of the article to complete the following sentences

1. Τὸν δοῦλον
2. Ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ
3. Ὁ ἄνθρωπος
4. Ἐκ τοῦ οἴκου
5. Τὸ ἄροτρον
6. Ὑπὸ τῷ δένδρῳ
7. Ἐν τῷ οἴκῳ

:)
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Re: Athenaze Study Group - Week 1 - Lesson 1

Postby mwh » Thu Aug 21, 2014 11:22 pm

daivid wrote:

1) οὐ σπεύδει.
2) διὰ τί οὐ πονεῖς;
3) φέρω τὸν ἄροτρον.
4) σπεύδεις πρὸς τὸν ἀγρόν.
5) ῥᾴθυμος ἐστίν.
6) οὐκ εἰμὶ ἰσχυρός.
7) οὐκ εἶ δοῦλος.
8 ) ὁ δοῦλος οὐ πονεῖ.
9) ὁ δοῦλος φέρει τὸν ἄροτρον πρὸς τὸν ἀγρόν.
10) ῥάθυμος εἰμί.

2F
1) The slave is not an Athenian.
Ξανθίας οὐ ἐστὶ ἰσχυρὸς.
2) Dikaeopolis goes out of his house and calls the slave.
ὁ δοῦλος σπεύδει πρὸς τὸν ἀγρὸν καὶ φέρει τὸν ἄροτρον.
(or if we are allowed to use participles: ὁ δοῦλος σπεύδει πρὸς τὸν ἀγρὸν φέρων τὸν ἄροτρον.)
3) The slave does not help but sits under the tree.
ὁ ἄνθρωπος οὑ πονεῖ ἀλλὰ βαδίζει πρὸς τὴν οἰκίαν.
4) Go into the home, Xanthas, and carry the grain.
σπεῦδε, ὦ δοῦλε, ἐξέλαυνε τοὺς βοῦς.
5) Don't sit, Xanthas but help.
μὴ δεῦρο ἐλθὲ, ὦ ἄνθρωπε, ἀλλὰ πόνε ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ.

2g
1) Δικαεόπολις οὐκέτι πόνει ἀλλὰ λύει τοὺς βοῦς.
2) ἔπειτα δε καλεῖ τὸν δοῦλον καὶ λέγει «μὴ πονε μηκέτι ἀλλὰ δεῦρο ἐλθὲ καὶ λάμβανε τὸν ἀροτόν. ἐλαύνω μὲν γὰρ ἐγὼ τοὺς βοῦς, σὺ δὲ φέρει τὸν ἀροτόν».
3) οὕτως Δικαεόπολις ἐλαύνει τοὺς βοῦς καὶ Ξανθίας λαμβάνει τὸν ἄροτρον καὶ φέρει αὐτὸν πρὸς τὴν οἰκίαν.

I haven’t checked against Athenaze, but taking these as they stand, I spot the following in the Greek:

2B ειμί etc. (but not 2 sing. εῖ or infin. εῖναι) are normally enclitic, so the approved accentuation would be
(5) ῥᾴθυμός εστιν, similarly in 10. Perhaps this hasn’t been covered, and there are complications.

2F 1 ουκ έστιν (break the hiatus; ουκ έστιν is the prescribed accentuation, please don’t ask why)
5 πόνει (impera. of –έω verb)
2g 1 Δικαιόπολις, πονεῖ (circumflex because contracted from –έει; you have it right in F3)
2 πόνει
εγὼ μὲν γὰρ ελαύνω—the contrast is between εγώ and σύ.
φέρε (if imperative; φέρεις if indicative)

There may be other slips that don’t show up without the English, but I don’t see any sign of it. Proper names could have articles.
Hope this helps. I don’t add smooth breathings but that’s just me. Hope it’s all right for me to poke my head in here, or am I spoiling it for others?

Michael
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Re: Athenaze Study Group - Lesson 2

Postby klewlis » Sat Aug 23, 2014 2:30 pm

(I've split off the Lesson 2 answers into a new thread)
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Re: Athenaze Study Group - Lesson 2

Postby klewlis » Sat Aug 23, 2014 2:47 pm

brunapogliano wrote:Hello,
this is my exercise 2a from Chapter 2

1. I call the slave.
2. The slave works in the house.
3. Why don't you hurry?
4. I'm not lazy.
5. You are strong.
6. He carries the plow.
7. I hurry to the field.
8. Why are you calling the slave?
9. The slave is not lazy.
10.The slave comes out of the house.

that's all for today.
:)


mine is nearly word for word with yours!
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Re: Athenaze Study Group - Week 1 - Lesson 1

Postby klewlis » Sat Aug 23, 2014 3:07 pm

daivid wrote:
1) οὐ σπεύδει.
2) διὰ τί οὐ πονεῖς;


Why the διὰ?

3) φέρω τὸν ἄροτρον.
4) σπεύδεις πρὸς τὸν ἀγρόν.
5) ῥᾴθυμος ἐστίν.


here I had ἀργος εἰ - that's my careless mistake on the verb!

6) οὐκ εἰμὶ ἰσχυρός.
7) οὐκ εἶ δοῦλος.
8 ) ὁ δοῦλος οὐ πονεῖ.
9) ὁ δοῦλος φέρει τὸν ἄροτρον πρὸς τὸν ἀγρόν.
10) ῥάθυμος εἰμί.


What does your English version say for #10? Mine says "He is not lazy." So I translated οὐκ ἐστιν ἀργος but yours seems to be completely different.

2F
1) The slave is not an Athenian.
Ξανθίας οὐ ἐστὶ ἰσχυρὸς.


οὐκ ἐστιν :)

2) Dikaeopolis goes out of his house and calls the slave.
ὁ δοῦλος σπεύδει πρὸς τὸν ἀγρὸν καὶ φέρει τὸν ἄροτρον.
(or if we are allowed to use participles: ὁ δοῦλος σπεύδει πρὸς τὸν ἀγρὸν φέρων τὸν ἄροτρον.)
3) The slave does not help but sits under the tree.
ὁ ἄνθρωπος οὑ πονεῖ ἀλλὰ βαδίζει πρὸς τὴν οἰκίαν.
4) Go into the home, Xanthas, and carry the grain.
σπεῦδε, ὦ δοῦλε, ἐξέλαυνε τοὺς βοῦς.


I have ἐλθε, Ο δουλε, και εἰσαγει τους βους
because it says "lead in" and yours would indicate going out?

5) Don't sit, Xanthas but help.


?? The book says μη πονει, ὡ Ξανθια, ἀλλα ἐλθε δευρο
so I have "Don't work, Xanthia, but come here."

μὴ δεῦρο ἐλθὲ, ὦ ἄνθρωπε, ἀλλὰ πόνε ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ.


Again yours seems to be completely different (I am using the 2nd edition so ours should be the same).
Book says "Don't sleep, man, but work in the field." So my translation is μη καθευδε, Ο ἀνθρωπε, ἀλλα πονε ἐν τῳ ἀγρῳ
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Re: Athenaze Study Group - Lesson 2

Postby daivid » Sat Aug 23, 2014 4:16 pm

mwh wrote:
daivid wrote:
5) ῥᾴθυμος ἐστίν.


2B ειμί etc. (but not 2 sing. εῖ or infin. εῖναι) are normally enclitic, so the approved accentuation would be
(5) ῥᾴθυμός εστιν, similarly in 10. Perhaps this hasn’t been covered, and there are complications.

I don't think in Athenaze it has been covered at this point but I should know that by now. Thanks
mwh wrote:
daivid wrote:2F
1) The slave is not an Athenian.
Ξανθίας οὐ ἐστὶ ἰσχυρὸς.

2F 1 ουκ έστιν (break the hiatus; ουκ έστιν is the prescribed accentuation, please don’t ask why)

Not adding the κ was carlessness on my part - I should know that. As to why the acute is on έστιν, from what I have just been reading as we have a proclitic followed by an enclitic the prolitic (being ουκ) should gain the accent - so I have at least lernt why you find it odd. :)
mwh wrote:
daivid wrote:5) Don't sit, Xanthas but help.
μὴ δεῦρο ἐλθὲ, ὦ ἄνθρωπε, ἀλλὰ πόνε ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ.

5 πόνει (impera. of –έω verb)

So the ε of uncontracted imperitives becomes ει with epsilon contract imperitives - I should have expected that.
mwh wrote:
daivid wrote:2g
1) Δικαεόπολις οὐκέτι πόνει ἀλλὰ λύει τοὺς βοῦς.

2g 1 Δικαιόπολις, πονεῖ (circumflex because contracted from –έει; you have it right in F3)

The rule being that contracted verbs want to have circumflex in the place the uncontrated for would have had an accent - I didn't know that before I just looked it up but I do now - Thanks.
mwh wrote:
daivid wrote:2) ἔπειτα δε καλεῖ τὸν δοῦλον καὶ λέγει «μὴ πονε μηκέτι ἀλλὰ δεῦρο ἐλθὲ καὶ λάμβανε τὸν ἀροτόν. ἐλαύνω μὲν γὰρ ἐγὼ τοὺς βοῦς, σὺ δὲ φέρει τὸν ἀροτόν».]


2 πόνει
εγὼ μὲν γὰρ ελαύνω—the contrast is between εγώ and σύ.
φέρε (if imperative; φέρεις if indicative)

I see that now - and watch out in future.
mwh wrote:There may be other slips that don’t show up without the English, but I don’t see any sign of it. Proper names could have articles.
Hope this helps. I don’t add smooth breathings but that’s just me. Hope it’s all right for me to poke my head in here, or am I spoiling it for others?
Michael


I feel sure that everyone will appreciate it as much as me. (And dropping smooth breathings seems to a good idea and one I will like as not adopt once I am sure I know the rule that I will be ignoring)
Last edited by daivid on Sat Aug 23, 2014 4:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Athenaze Study Group - Lesson 2

Postby daivid » Sat Aug 23, 2014 4:41 pm

klewlis wrote:
daivid wrote:
1) οὐ σπεύδει.
2) διὰ τί οὐ πονεῖς;


Why the διὰ?


Again yours seems to be completely different (I am using the 2nd edition so ours should be the same).
Book says "Don't sleep, man, but work in the field." So my translation is μη καθευδε, Ο ἀνθρωπε, ἀλλα πονε ἐν τῳ ἀγρῳ


I have the UK edition which seemed to say it was the 2nd edition. Whatever, I have now downloaded the pdf of the 2nd edition and, after checking, can see that that explains almost all the differences.

The exception is διὰ τί which as far as I know a simple synonym for plain τί. Curious that in the US edition the English-Greek vocab lists τί and the UK διὰ τί.

Apologies for using the wrong edition. I will stick to the pdf from now on.
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Re: Athenaze Study Group - Lesson 2

Postby klewlis » Sat Aug 23, 2014 5:14 pm

no need to apologize; I was just confused! :)
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Re: Athenaze Study Group - Lesson 2

Postby brunapogliano » Sun Aug 24, 2014 1:10 pm

klewlis wrote:
brunapogliano wrote:Hello,
this is my exercise 2a from Chapter 2
:)


mine is nearly word for word with yours!

that's good. Remember English is not my mother tongue, I'm likely to make mistakes later on.
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Re: Athenaze Study Group - Lesson 2

Postby brunapogliano » Sun Aug 24, 2014 1:38 pm

about οὐκ ἔστιν

mwh wrote:

daivid wrote:
2F
1) The slave is not an Athenian.
Ξανθίας οὐ ἐστὶ ἰσχυρὸς.

2F 1 ουκ έστιν (break the hiatus; ουκ έστιν is the prescribed accentuation, please don’t ask why)

Not adding the κ was carlessness on my part - I should know that. As to why the acute is on έστιν, from what I have just been reading as we have a proclitic followed by an enclitic the prolitic (being ουκ) should gain the accent - so I have at least lernt why you find it odd.


for οὐκ ἔστιν see Athenaze I - CH 2 - Para 2 last three lines
my grammar book says ἔστιν can also be found after καί, μέν, μή, εἰ, ὡς, ὅτε
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Re: Athenaze Study Group - Lesson 2

Postby brunapogliano » Sun Aug 24, 2014 1:53 pm

Athenaze I - CH 2 - ex 2E

1. ὁ δοῦλος σπεύδει πρὸς τὸν ἀγρόν
2. ὁ Δικαιόπολις τὸν ἀργὸν δοῦλον καλεῖ
3. ἐλθ δεῦρο καὶ συλλάμβανε
4. ἐγὼ ἐλαύνω τοὺς βοῦς ἐκ τοῦ ἀγροῦ
5. μὴ χαλεπὸς ἴσθι, ὦ δοῦλε, ἀλλὰ πόνει

:D
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Re: Athenaze Study Group - Lesson 2

Postby jaihare » Fri Sep 05, 2014 6:50 pm

Exercise 2α
1. I am calling the slave.
2. The slave is working in the house.
3. Why are you not hurrying?
4. I am not lazy.
5. You (s.) are strong.
6. He is carrying the plough.
7. I am hurrying to the field.
8. Why are you calling the slave?
9. The slave is not lazy.
10. The slave is coming out of the house.

Exercise 2β
1. οὐ σπεύδει.
2. τί οὐ πονεῖς;
3. τὸ ἄροτρον φέρω.
4. σπεύδεις πρὸς τὸν ἀγρόν.
5. ἀργός ἐστιν.
6. οὐκ εἰμὶ ἰσχυρός.
7. δοῦλος οὐκ εἶ.
8. ὁ δοῦλος οὐ πονεῖ.
9. ὁ δοῦλος τὸ ἄροτρον φέρει πρὸς τὸν ἀγρόν.
10. οὐκ ἔστιν ἀργός.

Exercise 2γ
1. Walk out of the house, Xanthias, and come here.
2. Do not sleep, slave, but work!
3. Do not be so difficult, master!
4. Take the plough and hurry to the field.
5. Call [your] slave, master.

Exercise 2δ
1. τὸν δοῦλον
2. ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ
3. ὁ ἄνθρωπος
4. ἐν τοῦ οἶκου
5. τὸν ἄροτρον
6. ὑπὸ τῷ δένδρῳ
7. ἐν τῷ οἶκῳ

Exercise 2ε
1. ὁ δοῦλος σπεύδει πρὸς τὸν ἀγρόν. The slave hurries to the field.
2. ὁ Δικαιόπολις τὸν ἀργὸν δοῦλον καλεῖ. Dicaeopolis calls the lazy slave.
3. ἐλθὲ δεῦρο καὶ συλλάμβανε. Come here and help [me].
4. ἐγὼ ἐλαύνω τοὺς βοῦς ἐκ τοὺ ἀγροῦ. As for me, I am driving the oxen from the field.
5. μὴ χαλεπὸς ἴσθι, ὦ δοῦλε, ἀλλὰ πόνε. Do not be difficult, slave, but work.

Exercise 2ζ
1. The slave is not Athenian.
ὁ Ξανθίας οὐκ ἔστιν ἰσχυρός.
2. Dicaeopolis walks out of the house and calls [his] slave.
ὁ δοῦλος σπεύδει πρὸς τὸν ἀγρὸν καὶ φέρει τὸ ἄροτρον.
3. The slave does not help but sleeps under the tree.
ὁ ἄνθρωπος οὐ πονεῖ ἀλλὰ βαδίζει πρὸς τὸν οἶκον.
4. Go in the house, Xanthias, and bring the food.
ἐλθέ, ὦ δοῦλε, καὶ ἔλαυνε τοὺς βοῦς.
5. Do not work, Xanthias, but come here.
μὴ κάθευδε, ὦ ἄνθρωπε, ἀλλὰ πόνει ἐν τῷ ἀγρῷ.

Exercise 2η
1. ὁ Δικαιόπολις οὐκέτι πονεῖ ἀλλὰ τοὺς βοῦς λύει.
2. ἔπειτα δὲ τὸν δοῦλον καλεῖ καὶ λέγει· «μηκέτι πόνει, ἀλλ᾿ ἐλθὲ δεῦρο καὶ αἶρε τὸ ἄροτρον.»
3. ἐγὼ μὲν γὰρ ἐλαύνω τοὺς βοῦς πρὸς τὸν οἶκον, σὺ δὲ φέρε τὸ ἄροτρον.
4. ὁ μὲν οὖν Δικαιόπολις ἐξελαύνει τοὺς βοῦς ἐκ τοῦ ἀγροῦ, ὁ δὲ δοῦλος αἴρει τὸ ἄροτρον καὶ φέρε (αὐτὸ) πρὸς τὸν οἶκον.
Jason Hare
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ὁ μὲν Παῦλος τοὺς ἐν ταῖς ἐκκλησίαις μαθητὰς τὴν χωρὶς νόμου δικαιοσύνην τὴν ἐν Χριστῷ ἐδίδασκεν, οἱ δ᾿ ἄλλοι ἀπόστολοι τοὺς ἀνθρώπους ἐδίδασκον τηρεῖν τὸν θεῖον νόμον τὸν χειρὶ Μωϋσέως δοθέντα.
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Re: Athenaze Study Group - Lesson 2

Postby Isaac Newton » Fri Sep 05, 2014 7:54 pm

jaihare,

Quick question. Are you still using Erasmian?
καὶ ὑμεῖς τὸ χρῖσμα ὃ ἐλάβετε ἀπ’ αὐτοῦ μένει ἐν ὑμῖν, καὶ οὐ χρείαν ἔχετε ἵνα τις διδάσκῃ ὑμᾶς·
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Re: Athenaze Study Group - Lesson 2

Postby jaihare » Fri Sep 05, 2014 8:34 pm

Isaac Newton wrote:jaihare,

Quick question. Are you still using Erasmian?

If you're ever interested in learning Greek, this group will still be open - and you can freely contribute. Personal questions are off-topic. Thanks.
Jason Hare
jaihare@gmail.com

ὁ μὲν Παῦλος τοὺς ἐν ταῖς ἐκκλησίαις μαθητὰς τὴν χωρὶς νόμου δικαιοσύνην τὴν ἐν Χριστῷ ἐδίδασκεν, οἱ δ᾿ ἄλλοι ἀπόστολοι τοὺς ἀνθρώπους ἐδίδασκον τηρεῖν τὸν θεῖον νόμον τὸν χειρὶ Μωϋσέως δοθέντα.
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jaihare
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Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2007 2:47 am
Location: Israel


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