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Atehnaze Group?

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Atehnaze Group?

Postby CanadianGirl » Mon Jun 30, 2014 10:09 pm

Not long ago, there was a group working through Athenaze. I assume it has finished the book by now-or is it still around? If not, is there any hope of a new group doing Athenaze?
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby akhnaten » Tue Jul 01, 2014 10:41 pm

what speed are you considering working on this textbook? and just working through the textbook, or the workbook as well.

I had planned on using Athenaze along with Croy's Primer of Biblical Greek and Mastronarde's Intro to Attic Greek. I dropped Athenaze as I found other strategies to give me the balance I desire. I found it much more productive to spend a few hours a day on Croy and Mastronarde (and related materials) than to also continue with Athenaze.

However, would gladly work through it if there are others involved. I am reluctant to purchase the workbook, so may sit out those exercises.
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby CanadianGirl » Wed Jul 02, 2014 8:49 pm

That's a good question-I joined the first group but had to drop out early. I have a schedule somewhere, but don't remember what the pace was. If anybody (not me) is interested in moderating the group, I would love to take part. My impression is, Athenaze is probably the best text to work with, just for practice. Any potential moderators out there?
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby akhnaten » Thu Jul 03, 2014 7:01 am

are there links on the forum for the last group? i have never done such a thing online. i have seen links to the pharr group that went through that book--i'll take a look and see how the online learning worked...i don't want to cause a bunch of homework assignments for a moderator to correct--especially when any moderator could be reading real greek and not beginner's assignments!

i have found three syllabi for a series of courses that covers the majority of books 1 and 2 of athenaze over the course of three quarters; obviously the speed can be slowed down, but the breakdown of each unit may be useful for forming a reading group (see the "daily schedule" links on the left): http://www.cornellcollege.edu/classical_studies/greek/gre101syl.shtml
site also has a lot of support (on and off site): audio, additional exercises, etc.

are you thinking of your high school friend joining up? i may be able to find one or two people, but they would be people i know online, so don't know the level of motivation.
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby CanadianGirl » Thu Jul 03, 2014 6:07 pm

I would like to work on Athenaze in a group setting for my own practice-I need it! And as I noted, I think Athenaze is the most 'usable' text for practicing, etc. My student is just at the elementary stage, this would be for my own benefit. I can't remember who was the previous moderator-pretty sure it was a Textkit member. Anybody else interested?
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby mwh » Thu Jul 03, 2014 8:40 pm

If this gets off the ground I could offer corrections here if it would be helpful, but perhaps only on an irregular basis. I've never used Athenaze but think I have a copy somewhere (but not of the workbook); my credentials are decent enough, I think (prof at major US university). You may have noticed that there's someone on these boards who never tires of answering Questions and correcting errors, very excellently and very patiently—but he hasn't responded here yet.
Last edited by mwh on Fri Jul 04, 2014 1:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby akhnaten » Fri Jul 04, 2014 9:50 am

please note, i am completely new to greek. i have been working on other textbooks throughout june, so Athenaze wouldn't be really be review, but another aid in my beginning study.

--

i found the teacher's handbook online through the OpenLibrary project (legal). it has answers to the exercises (and more). i would not mind typing the answers chapter by chapter for those without access to the entire teacher's handbook. athenaze does not seem to market their teacher's handbook outside of academic institutions; used copies of teacher's handbook start near $100. i do not have teacher's manual for second volume of Athenaze.

value of an answer key to the reading group would lessen burden on anyone providing assistance--readers can check their own work instead of submitting a large number of exercises.
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby Paco » Sat Jul 05, 2014 6:40 am

I would like to note that the Teacher's Handbook (and Textbook) available at Open Library is their revised 1st edition. I am not sure how different it is from the 2nd edition (as I have not yet officially started studying Ancient Greek and compared them) but there seems to have been significant revisions. Therefore, if you believe doing exercises is an essential component to success, assistance from mwh and others seems to be vital, or you will have to pay (quite an unreasonable) $200 in used book market.

By the way, I also would like to use Athenaze (both English and Italian editions) as my main course a few months later, however, the unavailability of the Teacher's Handbook(s), which means, besides the lack of answers, the loss of a considerable part of learning for the autodidacts, stops me from trying. Instead, I will use them as complementary readers, alongside Reading Greek from JACT, which provides answers, translations, teacher's materials and recordings.

So, see you people in Attica!
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby CanadianGirl » Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:47 pm

Well, if a moderator wants to volunteer, I am very interested in taking part. I am up to my ears this summer, so don't have time to do it myself. BTW-Excuse my "Atehnaze" spelling!
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby aristoteles » Sun Jul 13, 2014 12:47 am

Hi everyone,

akhnaten had mentioned to me that a group was forming here, so here I am. :) For a little while, I had considered moderating though at the time, despite my interest and even need to learn Ancient Greek, I'm not sure how regularly I will be participating; I have a few distractions at the moment, I'm not sure how long they will last, that keep me from even taking a regular look at my books.

I had begun studies perhaps a few months ago, but my total study time might not have exceeded a few hours since.

Paco wrote:By the way, I also would like to use Athenaze (both English and Italian editions) as my main course a few months later, however, the unavailability of the Teacher's Handbook(s), which means, besides the lack of answers, the loss of a considerable part of learning for the autodidacts, stops me from trying. Instead, I will use them as complementary readers, alongside Reading Greek from JACT, which provides answers, translations, teacher's materials and recordings.


We have not yet really begun, and Paco expresses pretty much the same sentiments I found after taking a (brief) look at all the available courses. An added plus of Reading Greek, is all the books are also available as PDF, to easily carry around on a tablet, or notebook, when the books aren't with you. Looking at previous threads here, as well as a few web pages I found, some also prefer Reading Greek for similar and supplementary reasons. Perhaps a chance?

I have only the PDFs, not quite convenient and easy to flip thru pages, and when looking to get the books locally, I found a "prestigious" college nearby, and they use the Luschnig book. When I have an opportunity to look at it more, I may use that as a supplement.

Whoever moderates, or if we find some way to be self-moderating, perhaps corrections wouldn't be necessary as we go thru the lessons, but merely discussion about finer points, ones that may increase our passion and desire to experience the Greek spirit, like the various ways we might translate a phrase or word, what most captures Greek in a language where many words remain untranslatable.
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby klewlis » Sun Jul 20, 2014 5:39 pm

I'm game to coordinate a group, but as a beginner myself I wouldn't be able to offer any extra insight. :lol:

What pace would we want to work at? Should we set a weekly target and then discuss each lesson together?
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby klewlis » Sun Jul 20, 2014 6:31 pm

Volume 1 has 16 chapters in it. I think it would be reasonable to do 2 per week, though as the difficulty increases that may become a lot...? Depends on how much time people have to commit. We could start with 2 per week and then see how it goes.

What I am thinking is starting a new thread each week that states which chapters we're doing that week, so that it will be easy to follow. Everyone can post their answers to the exercises and ask questions and hopefully we'll be able to sort it all out.

I don't have the teacher's guide or the workbooks... just Volume 1, second edition. Beyond that I'd have to check into getting Volume 2.
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby CanadianGirl » Wed Jul 23, 2014 9:19 pm

Hey-So sorry I'm slow replying. That sounds good to me, if nothing else we couldn at least provide moral support to each other. If you want to take it on, we can discuss pace etc. Have you heard from other potential participants? Thanks for stepping up!
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby klewlis » Wed Jul 23, 2014 9:30 pm

I'm going to go ahead and start it then. We'll start Sunday as week 1.

I'll post a thread each week. We can start with 2 lessons per week but if it gets to be too much (I hear that it gets intense later on) we can slow it to one lesson at a time.
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby akhnaten » Thu Jul 24, 2014 4:40 am

Thanks for taking this initiative.
I will follow along for at least 4 weeks. I have worked through the first 4 chapters of Athenaze in early June, but found it hard going. I found the JACT/Athenaze textbooks were nice for presenting reading material (absent at early stages of Mastronarde and Hanson&Quinn), but it was hard for me to get a comprehensive perspective of the materials it presented in comparison to the other texts. So, I may drop out, but it will be a reflection of the textbook not the group.
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby klewlis » Thu Jul 24, 2014 4:42 am

akhnaten wrote:Thanks for taking this initiative.
I will follow along for at least 4 weeks. I have worked through the first 4 chapters of Athenaze in early June, but found it hard going. I found the JACT/Athenaze textbooks were nice for presenting reading material (absent at early stages of Mastronarde and Hanson&Quinn), but it was hard for me to get a comprehensive perspective of the materials it presented in comparison to the other texts. So, I may drop out, but it will be a reflection of the textbook not the group.


Maybe this is an opportunity to flesh out your Athenaze studies with some supplementary info... maybe follow along with us while at the same time studying a more structured grammar?
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby akhnaten » Fri Jul 25, 2014 5:41 am

I'm little over 100 pages into Mastronarde now. As long as the grammar and morphology is introduced first in Mastronarde, I think I should be fine--sadly, that won't always be the case. I cannot make sense at all of the presentation in Athenaze on some topics. When I didn't know the alphabet, Athenaze was impossible. I came back after a week, and had other problems. Like introducing only singular forms of pres.act.ind. 'to be' (chapter 2 section 1), and postponing the plural (chapter 3 section 1). The introduction of the imperative (chapter 2 section 3) is a travesty. It does not give me the picture of the language that I like to see, if this makes sense. I rely heavily on the use of flashcards in learning a language. With Athenaze, it was a struggle for me to make flashcards based upon presentation in the text.
And these last comments hold true for any textbook...I worry about authorial choices when I see vocabulary like "water jar" early in a text (chapter 3 or 4), or when a foreign prepositions receive single word English definitions (if only it was that simple!).
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby klewlis » Fri Jul 25, 2014 5:46 am

I definitely think your concerns about the text are valid. I've noticed that it's rather piecemeal so far as well.

I think it's easier for me because I have a background in Koine, so I'm not starting from scratch.

Would everyone prefer to do one lesson per week instead of 2?
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby CanadianGirl » Sat Jul 26, 2014 7:09 pm

This Sunday? July 27-? If so, I might be 24 hours late-just had unexpected company. Also I would prefer to do one lesson per week, but I'm not going to complain if everybody wants to do two. Thanks again.
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby klewlis » Sat Jul 26, 2014 7:19 pm

Ok we can start with one per week. I started a weekly thread, so we can all post our questions and answers there.
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Re: Athenaze Group-posting lessons?

Postby CanadianGirl » Fri Aug 01, 2014 6:00 pm

O.K. I am completely disorganized , as usual. I have lesson I ready, where & how do we post it? Thanks!
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Re: Athenaze Group-posting lessons?

Postby klewlis » Fri Aug 01, 2014 6:03 pm

CanadianGirl wrote:O.K. I am completely disorganized , as usual. I have lesson I ready, where & how do we post it? Thanks!


Post it in the other thread (the one with "Week 1, Lesson 1").

I'll be posting mine tonight... have just had a crazy busy week!
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby CanadianGirl » Fri Aug 01, 2014 6:09 pm

O.K. -Thanks-I thought I was behind everybody else (it happens).
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby jaihare » Thu Sep 11, 2014 8:34 am

klewlis wrote:I'm going to go ahead and start it then. We'll start Sunday as week 1.

I'll post a thread each week. We can start with 2 lessons per week but if it gets to be too much (I hear that it gets intense later on) we can slow it to one lesson at a time.

Now I see... This is well-stated.

I didn't find this group before because the title of the thread is Atehnaze instead of Athenaze. I searched the forum for Athenaze and got specific threads, but I didn't find this one until now, when I searched the pages of this specific forum (Learning Greek) for "Group". Could you change the title of the thread to reflect the title of the book? It will help with search engine results.

I'll read through the thread now.

Thanks,
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby jaihare » Thu Sep 11, 2014 8:37 am

CanadianGirl wrote:This Sunday? July 27-? If so, I might be 24 hours late-just had unexpected company. Also I would prefer to do one lesson per week, but I'm not going to complain if everybody wants to do two. Thanks again.

I think one lesson per week is more reasonable for several reasons. (1) Digestion of the material. (2) Chance to read and re-read the stories. (3) Opportunity to drill the forms and review. (4) Time to absorb and reflect.
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ὁ μὲν Παῦλος τοὺς ἐν ταῖς ἐκκλησίαις μαθητὰς τὴν χωρὶς νόμου δικαιοσύνην τὴν ἐν Χριστῷ ἐδίδασκεν, οἱ δ᾿ ἄλλοι ἀπόστολοι τοὺς ἀνθρώπους ἐδίδασκον τηρεῖν τὸν θεῖον νόμον τὸν χειρὶ Μωϋσέως δοθέντα.
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby jaihare » Thu Sep 11, 2014 8:39 am

akhnaten wrote:I'm little over 100 pages into Mastronarde now. As long as the grammar and morphology is introduced first in Mastronarde, I think I should be fine--sadly, that won't always be the case. I cannot make sense at all of the presentation in Athenaze on some topics. When I didn't know the alphabet, Athenaze was impossible. I came back after a week, and had other problems. Like introducing only singular forms of pres.act.ind. 'to be' (chapter 2 section 1), and postponing the plural (chapter 3 section 1). The introduction of the imperative (chapter 2 section 3) is a travesty. It does not give me the picture of the language that I like to see, if this makes sense. I rely heavily on the use of flashcards in learning a language. With Athenaze, it was a struggle for me to make flashcards based upon presentation in the text.
And these last comments hold true for any textbook...I worry about authorial choices when I see vocabulary like "water jar" early in a text (chapter 3 or 4), or when a foreign prepositions receive single word English definitions (if only it was that simple!).

Athenaze is more inductive in its approach. It's built on better principles of language learning. Giving specific forms now and saving others for later is a good practice. First, you introduce students to what language is easy to grasp and feel confident, then you give a more complete picture of the language. If you give the text a chance, you will learn much better than through, say, Mastronarde (if I may be so bold). It's a philosophical difference. We do not really learn through tables. We learn through exposure and repetition, and Athenaze is perfect for this.
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Re: Atehnaze Group?

Postby jaihare » Thu Sep 11, 2014 8:40 am

akhnaten wrote:Thanks for taking this initiative.
I will follow along for at least 4 weeks. I have worked through the first 4 chapters of Athenaze in early June, but found it hard going. I found the JACT/Athenaze textbooks were nice for presenting reading material (absent at early stages of Mastronarde and Hanson&Quinn), but it was hard for me to get a comprehensive perspective of the materials it presented in comparison to the other texts. So, I may drop out, but it will be a reflection of the textbook not the group.

I'm doing Hansen & Quinn now together with Athenaze (as a review). Why not supplement, as Klewlis stated?
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ὁ μὲν Παῦλος τοὺς ἐν ταῖς ἐκκλησίαις μαθητὰς τὴν χωρὶς νόμου δικαιοσύνην τὴν ἐν Χριστῷ ἐδίδασκεν, οἱ δ᾿ ἄλλοι ἀπόστολοι τοὺς ἀνθρώπους ἐδίδασκον τηρεῖν τὸν θεῖον νόμον τὸν χειρὶ Μωϋσέως δοθέντα.
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