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Sapphic Stanza

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Sapphic Stanza

Postby Kasper » Mon Apr 04, 2005 5:37 am

I've just tried my hand for the first time at writing a Sapphic Stanza:

H(merw~n mnh/nas a)po/tas melainw~n
nu~n gra/fw. Nu~ktes de\ pa/lai skotei/nai
h)~san. W~! Plhrei~s de\ te kai\ kapnou~ kai\
h)~san oneirw~n.


but I am suddenly overcome with the fear that there may be as many rules attached to a Sapphic Stanza as there are to, say, a elegy. Are there? and if yes, what are they, or where can I read about them?

Thanks in advance!!
“Cum ego verbo utar,” Humpty Dumpty dixit voce contempta, “indicat illud quod optem – nec plus nec minus.”
“Est tamen rogatio” dixit Alice, “an efficere verba tot res indicare possis.”
“Rogatio est, “Humpty Dumpty responsit, “quae fiat magister – id cunctum est.”
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Postby annis » Mon Apr 04, 2005 4:25 pm

I believe there is a bridge (no caesura allowed) between the last two positions of the third hendecasyllabic, but I will need to do some digging to verify that.

Apart from a full book Greek meter (Raven, West), I've never seen rules presented for writing new Sapphics in Greek (Latin has its own rules, as usual).
William S. Annis — http://www.aoidoi.org/http://www.scholiastae.org/
τίς πατέρ' αἰνήσει εἰ μὴ κακοδαίμονες υἱοί;
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Postby whiteoctave » Mon Apr 04, 2005 4:44 pm

[W. posted whilst I wrote this. as an addition to what he says about the bridge between the tenth and eleventh syllables of the third line,a quick look at some Sappho in Lobel and Page does not seem to support this.]

very nice! your Sapphic stanza seems fine metrically. in Greek there are no special rules that you seem to have overlooked. the close of lines 1 and 2 can be breuis in longo; the fourth syllable of lines 1-3 can be short, though long is more regular. the third and fourth lines are not really separate at all, however, so hiatus is not allowed between the third and fourth lines.

Your piece in Greek script (with a couple of accentual alterations):
[face=SPIonic]9Hmerw~n mnh/naj a)po/taj melainw~n
nu~n gra&fw. nu/ktej de\ pa&lai skoteinai\
h]san. w}! plhrei~j de/ te kai\ kapnou~ kai\
h]san o0nei/rwn.[/face]


[face=SPIonic]de/ te[/face] seems a bit odd.

very well done overall.
I wrote a 50 line Grk sapphic poem for a competition a couple of months ago.

~D
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Postby Kasper » Mon Apr 04, 2005 10:49 pm

W-s, many thanks!

I thought the de\ te\ kai\ bit was a bit uncomfortable, but well, for a first try it will have to do.

Albe/Leuke, 50 lines? :shock: 12.5 stanzas then? Why not finish the last one? :wink:
“Cum ego verbo utar,” Humpty Dumpty dixit voce contempta, “indicat illud quod optem – nec plus nec minus.”
“Est tamen rogatio” dixit Alice, “an efficere verba tot res indicare possis.”
“Rogatio est, “Humpty Dumpty responsit, “quae fiat magister – id cunctum est.”
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Postby annis » Mon Apr 04, 2005 10:59 pm

whiteoctave wrote:[W. posted whilst I wrote this. as an addition to what he says about the bridge between the tenth and eleventh syllables of the third line,a quick look at some Sappho in Lobel and Page does not seem to support this.]


I noticed this myself, which is why I had to flee to my notes. This has only confused matters, since I have a perfectly clear bridge siglum in my notes from West's book. I'll have to dig into this more.
William S. Annis — http://www.aoidoi.org/http://www.scholiastae.org/
τίς πατέρ' αἰνήσει εἰ μὴ κακοδαίμονες υἱοί;
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Postby annis » Tue Apr 05, 2005 2:01 am

Kasper wrote:I thought the de\ te\ kai\ bit was a bit uncomfortable, but well, for a first try it will have to do.


I've been trying to convince Perseus to tell me if this grouping ever occurs, but the interface has thwarted me again. Perhaps I'll try later.

Albe/Leuke, 50 lines? :shock: 12.5 stanzas then? Why not finish the last one? :wink:


I wonder when we get to see this.
William S. Annis — http://www.aoidoi.org/http://www.scholiastae.org/
τίς πατέρ' αἰνήσει εἰ μὴ κακοδαίμονες υἱοί;
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Postby chad » Tue Apr 05, 2005 4:18 am

when perseus exact text search fails i just google it:

http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=en&s ... arch&meta=

this shows hits for de/ te kai (leave out the accent of kai although unlikely to be acute!) in iliad book 21 (hits page 1), odyssey book 4 and book 1 of the republic as a quote (hits page 2) as a starter.
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Postby whiteoctave » Tue Apr 05, 2005 7:57 am

yes, 50 was my round-about way of saying 48! the topic that had to be followed was Tyro, and accordingly my poem is a mini biography, and lamentably not in Aeolic dialect (i tried that originally, but i soon hit words that just didn't occur in the dialect and i was producing an odd looking creature with psilosis and everything!).

[face=spionic]h0ni/d', w} Turoi=, fili/a nea~nij,
nu~n pe/feukaj, eu0pate/reia mo/sxe
kalli/morfe/ t' Ai0oli/dou tura/nnou,
dw&mata traxh~.

Krh&qeuj ga&r se sxetli/an filo/frwn
e0k xerw~n sw&saj foni/wn Sidhrou~j,
ei0j taxu/rroq' h]xen 0Enipe/wj se
xeu/mata la&qrh,

e1nqa xrusofegge\j u3dwr siwph|~
e0n gu/aisin Qessalikoi=j katarrei=.
kai\ se/qen faenn' e0filei=ton a(gno\n
o1sse r9e/eqron:

kai\ ke/ar so\n e1ptet' a)ph=mon a!xqwn.
e1nq' e1rwtoj, pai=j, e0planw~ zaplhqh_j
polla&kij ptu/ssein potamw~| poqou=sa
xei=raj e0p' w)kei=.

a)lla_ po/ntioj qeo\j e0nqa&d' ei1j se
du/smoron, Turoi= kaqara&, dedorkw_j
r(eu/matoj qu/mw| doli/w| kalh\n h|(-
rh&sato morfh&n.

feu~, ta&laina: faulo/taton Poseidw~
h0spa&sw braxi/oni ka)n no/moisin
sugkaqhu/dhsaj a)maqw~j e0nu/droij
dai/moni deinw~|.

e0kkalu/yaj d' au0to\n e0kei= Poseidw~n
qa~sson o0bri/mhj s' e1lipen que/llhj
pai=de, Salmw~nij, di/dum' e0n talai/nh|
gastri\ fe/rousan.

Nhle/' a!lkimon Peli/an te drimu\n
h0qe/lhsaj ble/mmata pa&nta kru/yai,
th=moj e0n de/ndroij skoti/oisin Ai3dh|
tw~d' e0pe/treyaj.

mhtri\ prospe/ptwke kaki/on' a!xqh;
h2 fronei=j eu0daimoni&sein gunai=ka
te/kn' e0fei=san; nu~n de\ qeoi/ se dakru/-
ousan i1dontej

kai\ ste/nousan tau=ta pa&qh panou=rga
s' w!|ktisan kai\ Krhqe/', a!riston ei1dei,
qei=on eu0file/staton, w!pasa/n soi
dusqerapeu/tw|.

nu=n de\ lei/yomai/ se, Turoi=, ma&kairan
sou~ ga\r a!xqh poiki/la kai\ goedna_
dwrea~| tw~n a)qana&twn kekou/fist-
ai filoghqw~n.

eu] de\ tou=t' i1sq': h(d' e1ti do/ca mi/mnei
soi/ g' a)ri/sth kai/per e1gwg' a)oidh=|
th=|d' a)ko/myw| pa&nta me/lh palaia_
ka&rta miai/nwn.[/face]

~DJB
Coll.Chr.Cant. Jan. MMV
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