Textkit Logo

Twinkle in Greek

Here you can discuss all things Ancient Greek. Use this board to ask questions about grammar, discuss learning strategies, get help with a difficult passage of Greek, and more.

Twinkle in Greek

Postby mingshey » Mon Jan 03, 2005 10:49 am

I just had to try this.
My wife's picked up "mica, mica, parva stella..." and it's one of her favourite lullabies for my daughter. But I wanted in Greek. So, with by far the most rusty Greek of mine:

[face=SPIonic]glau/sse, glau/sse, w)= 'ste\r mikro/j,
qauma/zw ox' kala/ ei).
kataugasmo\j e)ntau=qa,
w(\s liqei/a leuko/j ei).[/face]


Please help it sound like real Greek, but please keep it sing-able.
Image
----

Well, nodoby's responding. :?
Am I abusing Ancient Greek to such a barbarism? :oops:
Anyway my second attempt, actually a little modification:

[face=SPIonic]glau/sse, glau/sse, a)ste\r mikro/j,
qauma/zw ox' kala/ ei).
kataugasmo\j ou)ranw=|
w(\s liqei/a leuko/j ei).[/face]
[/img]
Last edited by mingshey on Tue Jan 11, 2005 11:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
mingshey
Textkit Zealot
 
Posts: 1336
Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2003 6:38 am
Location: Seoul

Re: Twinkle in Greek

Postby annis » Sat Jan 08, 2005 8:43 pm

mingshey wrote:Well, nodoby's responding. :?
Am I abusing Ancient Greek to such a barbarism? :oops:


You set before us a difficult task! But I only recalled this post just now.

The first thing I need to know is if you wish to retain the repetition of "twinkle." I also want to make the "little star" a simple diminutive, [face=spionic]a)ste/rion[/face]. The word has other meanings (a town name; a kind of spider) but also works for "star." Also, I make a bunch of them, giving:

[face=spionic]ai)qo/men' a)ste/ria[/face]... which syllable count matches the song.

The rest will take more thinking.
William S. Annis — http://www.aoidoi.org/http://www.scholiastae.org/
τίς πατέρ' αἰνήσει εἰ μὴ κακοδαίμονες υἱοί;
annis
Textkit Zealot
 
Posts: 3399
Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2003 4:55 pm
Location: Madison, WI, USA

Postby Skylax » Sun Jan 09, 2005 7:04 pm

Here is a modest proposition, but I could not translate the text literally :

[face=SPIonic]a)steri/ske la/mpe la/mpe
sou= qauma/zw to\ ei)=doj
u(you= ga\r e)n ou)ranw=|
a)dama/ntinoj fai/nh|
[/face]


(I guess one has to sing twice the last two lines?)

[face=SPIonic]o(rw= th\n pai=da/ sou kaq' h(me/ran kalli/w gignome/nhn. eu)daimo/nizw tou\j gone/aj au)th=j.[/face]
User avatar
Skylax
Textkit Enthusiast
 
Posts: 672
Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2003 8:18 am
Location: Belgium

Postby annis » Sun Jan 09, 2005 7:17 pm

Skylax wrote:Here is a modest proposition, but I could not translate the text literally :


That's very nice!

(I guess one has to sing twice the last two lines?)


The first two are repeated.
William S. Annis — http://www.aoidoi.org/http://www.scholiastae.org/
τίς πατέρ' αἰνήσει εἰ μὴ κακοδαίμονες υἱοί;
annis
Textkit Zealot
 
Posts: 3399
Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2003 4:55 pm
Location: Madison, WI, USA

Postby mingshey » Mon Jan 10, 2005 10:29 am

I also made a simple grammatical error in writing what must be written [face=SPIonic]kalo/j[/face] as [face=SPIonic]kala/[/face]. :oops:
Skylax wrote:Here is a modest proposition, but I could not translate the text literally :

[face=SPIonic]a)steri/ske la/mpe la/mpe
sou= qauma/zw to\ ei)=doj
u(you= ga\r e)n ou)ranw=|
a)dama/ntinoj fai/nh|
[/face]


(I guess one has to sing twice the last two lines?)

[face=SPIonic]o(rw= th\n pai=da/ sou kaq' h(me/ran kalli/w gignome/nhn. eu)daimo/nizw tou\j gone/aj au)th=j.[/face]


I've got to study some of the words, but, wonderful! And thanks!

In the first line would [face=SPIonic] la/mpe la/mpe a)steri/ske [/face] also work, to make the structure same as in "twinkle twinkle little star"? Or it cannot, to match the acctents with the tone of the melody?

In "Prometheus Bound" [face=SPIonic]a)dama/ntinoj[/face] is rendered as "(made) of steel". Though it is the etymology of 'diamond', does it also work for reminding of a little gem?
User avatar
mingshey
Textkit Zealot
 
Posts: 1336
Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2003 6:38 am
Location: Seoul

Re: Twinkle in Greek

Postby mingshey » Mon Jan 10, 2005 10:44 am

annis wrote:
mingshey wrote:Well, nodoby's responding. :?
Am I abusing Ancient Greek to such a barbarism? :oops:


You set before us a difficult task! But I only recalled this post just now.

The first thing I need to know is if you wish to retain the repetition of "twinkle." I also want to make the "little star" a simple diminutive, [face=spionic]a)ste/rion[/face]. The word has other meanings (a town name; a kind of spider) but also works for "star." Also, I make a bunch of them, giving:

[face=spionic]ai)qo/men' a)ste/ria[/face]... which syllable count matches the song.

The rest will take more thinking.


Yes I wished to repeat the 'twinkle', and to use a diminutive of a star for "little star", and the [face=SPIonic]a)ste/rios[/face] and [face=SPIonic]a)ste/rios[/face] were the candidates but I found them have other specific meanings already. Asterion even implied 'cannabis' and that was very far from what I wanted to remind people of. :? But thanks for telling me it is also good for the diminutive of '[face=SPIonic]a)sth/r[/face]'
User avatar
mingshey
Textkit Zealot
 
Posts: 1336
Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2003 6:38 am
Location: Seoul

Postby Skylax » Mon Jan 10, 2005 11:52 am

mingshey wrote:In the first line would [face=SPIonic] la/mpe la/mpe a)steri/ske [/face] also work, to make the structure same as in "twinkle twinkle little star"? Or it cannot, to match the acctents with the tone of the melody?

I think it could work also. I wrote it so to avoid an elision, but we can make some kind of caesura before [face=SPIonic]a)steri/ske [/face]

In "Prometheus Bound" [face=SPIonic]a)dama/ntinoj[/face] is rendered as "(made) of steel". Though it is the etymology of 'diamond', does it also work for reminding of a little gem?

the noun [face=SPIonic]a)da/maj[/face] was used for both "steel" and "diamond", so maybe also the adjective.
User avatar
Skylax
Textkit Enthusiast
 
Posts: 672
Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2003 8:18 am
Location: Belgium

Postby PeterD » Thu Jan 13, 2005 12:44 am

Happy New Year to all!

If I may, Mingshey, I would like to share a lullaby that my parents sang to me and now I, too, sing to my little girl (she will be 2 months old next week :D ). It's in Modern Greek, so bare with me philhellenes.

[face=SPIonic]Feggara/ki mou lampro/
fe/gge mou na perpatw/
na phgai/nw sto sxoleio/
na maqai/nw gra/mmata
gra/mmata spouda/gmata
tou qeou/ ta pra/gmata[/face]


Take care,

~PeterD (aka "superdad")

p.s. Life is beautiful. If you can, help someone in need. :)
Fanatical ranting is not just fine because it's eloquent. What if I ranted for the extermination of a people in an eloquent manner, would that make it fine? Rather, ranting, be it fanatical or otherwise, is fine if what is said is true and just. ---PeterD, in reply to IreneY and Annis
PeterD
Textkit Enthusiast
 
Posts: 591
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2003 6:54 pm
Location: Montreal, Canada

Postby mingshey » Thu Jan 13, 2005 6:03 am

Hi PeterD,
[face=SPIonic]Euxa/risto[/face] for the lullaby! :D
I'm always eager to pick up Modern Greek expressions occasionally, and used to listening to Nana Mouskouri in Greek. I was collecting the lyrics I heard from her CD's. [face=SPIonic]Brexh stin ftoxo gitonia, Pame mia bolta sto feggari, Ena to xelidoni, ktl.[/face](I'm not sure about the spelling, because as you know the pronunciations are ambiguous in MG. :wink: )

By the way, I wish I could also learn the melody, or a link to its sheet music. Or does it have any title? [face=SPIonic]Feggara/ki mou lampro/[/face]?

edit:
all I have found is this instrumental midi, and it sounds not so easy :D
User avatar
mingshey
Textkit Zealot
 
Posts: 1336
Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2003 6:38 am
Location: Seoul

Postby PeterD » Thu Jan 13, 2005 10:46 pm

mingshey wrote:By the way, I wish I could also learn the melody, or a link to its sheet music. Or does it have any title? [face=SPIonic]Feggara/ki mou lampro/[/face]?


Its melody is very similar to the "twinkle, twinkle, little star" (Mozart) melody. Don't forget the stress falls on the accented syllable.

edit:
all I have found is this instrumental midi, and it sounds not so easy :D

No, it's not it.
Last edited by PeterD on Fri Jan 14, 2005 6:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Fanatical ranting is not just fine because it's eloquent. What if I ranted for the extermination of a people in an eloquent manner, would that make it fine? Rather, ranting, be it fanatical or otherwise, is fine if what is said is true and just. ---PeterD, in reply to IreneY and Annis
PeterD
Textkit Enthusiast
 
Posts: 591
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2003 6:54 pm
Location: Montreal, Canada

Postby annis » Thu Jan 13, 2005 10:52 pm

mingshey wrote: and used to listening to Nana Mouskouri in Greek.


I am partial to Haris Alexiou.
William S. Annis — http://www.aoidoi.org/http://www.scholiastae.org/
τίς πατέρ' αἰνήσει εἰ μὴ κακοδαίμονες υἱοί;
annis
Textkit Zealot
 
Posts: 3399
Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2003 4:55 pm
Location: Madison, WI, USA


Return to Learning Greek

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Alexa [Bot], Paul Derouda, polemistes, seneca2008 and 36 guests