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γνῶναι

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γνῶναι

Postby Tim » Mon Apr 04, 2011 11:51 am

How do you pronounce γνῶναι?
Is the initial gamma pronounced or silent?
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Re: γνῶναι

Postby calvinist » Mon Apr 04, 2011 5:00 pm

There are no silent letters in Greek. It's pronounced (g + n). English does not allow this combination of sounds, but other languages do. It will feel awkward at first, but it just takes practice. Don't feel alone though, many people learning English as a second language have difficulty pronouncing initial consonant clusters such as s-c-r-ape (scrape), which is a combination of sounds that very few languages in the world allow. At one time English allowed more clusters, that is why "know" and "knight" are spelled the way they are. The -k- was pronounced at one time. This linguistic phenomenon is called phonotactic constraints if you're interested in looking into more yourself.

πν and πσ are two more very common combinations that are not allowed in English but are in Greek. English allows (p + s) in medial or final position: tipsy, cops. But not in initial position: psalm (the -p- is dropped in English although both Greek and Latin pronounce it).
Speech is my hammer, bang the world into shape, now let it fall! -Mos Def
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Re: γνῶναι

Postby Tim » Tue Apr 05, 2011 11:00 am

Thank, yes it does feel awkward to pronounce the g+n together.
Your post is very helpful.
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Re: γνῶναι

Postby jaihare » Tue Apr 05, 2011 12:24 pm

Tim wrote:Thank, yes it does feel awkward to pronounce the g+n together.
Your post is very helpful.


After a while, it won't feel strange to you anymore. I find no problem gn or kn or ps at the beginning of a word now. When I first started Hebrew, I had such trouble with kn! We have the words knisah (כניסה "entrance"), Knesset (כנסת "Parliament"), knas (כנס "fine, ticket, report") and knesiyah (כנסייה "church") in addition to strange combinations of kv like κvisah (כביסה "laundry"). There are loads of consonant clusters allowed in Hebrew that we disallow in English (even bg and odd things like that).

The more you expose yourself to the language, the easier it will be to handle the oddities and even absorb them into your mind as "possibilities." The first time I saw Knesset spelled in English letters, I had no idea how to say it!

Regards,
Jai
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ὁ μὲν Παῦλος τοὺς ἐν ταῖς ἐκκλησίαις μαθητὰς τὴν χωρὶς νόμου δικαιοσύνην τὴν ἐν Χριστῷ ἐδίδασκεν, οἱ δ᾿ ἄλλοι ἀπόστολοι τοὺς ἀνθρώπους ἐδίδασκον τηρεῖν τὸν θεῖον νόμον τὸν χειρὶ Μωϋσέως δοθέντα.
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Re: γνῶναι

Postby Tim » Tue Apr 05, 2011 7:38 pm

So it is gin o neigh, with gin as in begin?
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Re: γνῶναι

Postby jaihare » Tue Apr 05, 2011 10:16 pm

Tim wrote:So it is gin o neigh, with gin as in begin?


Remove the i, though. ;)

It's GNŌ-nai (the nai can sound like "eye" or "red," depending on who you agree with). It's not gino, but just gno - and you have to pronounce the g.
Jason Hare
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ὁ μὲν Παῦλος τοὺς ἐν ταῖς ἐκκλησίαις μαθητὰς τὴν χωρὶς νόμου δικαιοσύνην τὴν ἐν Χριστῷ ἐδίδασκεν, οἱ δ᾿ ἄλλοι ἀπόστολοι τοὺς ἀνθρώπους ἐδίδασκον τηρεῖν τὸν θεῖον νόμον τὸν χειρὶ Μωϋσέως δοθέντα.
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Re: γνῶναι

Postby jaihare » Tue Apr 05, 2011 10:27 pm

Jason Hare
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ὁ μὲν Παῦλος τοὺς ἐν ταῖς ἐκκλησίαις μαθητὰς τὴν χωρὶς νόμου δικαιοσύνην τὴν ἐν Χριστῷ ἐδίδασκεν, οἱ δ᾿ ἄλλοι ἀπόστολοι τοὺς ἀνθρώπους ἐδίδασκον τηρεῖν τὸν θεῖον νόμον τὸν χειρὶ Μωϋσέως δοθέντα.
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Re: γνῶναι

Postby Tim » Wed Apr 06, 2011 2:18 am

:D
The sound file helps
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