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Reading Group Poll: Pharr or Minckwitz

I've been chatting with Jeff about the possibility of running a reading group for Homeric Greek. We were actually discussing this before the slew of reading group announcements for other groups. :)

In any case, my first thought is that we'd just use Pharr, and I have two advanced Textkit regulars who have already expressed interest in being guides for such a group, but we also have ...
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subject in Iliad 1:127-128

...,au)tar )Axaioi\ triplh=| tetraplh=| t' a)poti/somen, ...What is the subject of a)poti/somen?
The form is 1st person pl. but )Axaioi\ is nominative.
Can this be combined to read - we Achaeans will repay you three or even four fold?
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One more from Pharr section 223 (line 5)

)Axaioi\ e)kpe/rsousi polla\ e)k law=n poli/wn kai\ da/sontai pa/nta law=|
I translated this as follows; The Achaeans will plunder many things form the city of the people and they will divide all things among the host.
For this translation to be right, I would have expected law=n and poli/wn to be reversed.
Poli/wn would then be in the genitive because of the preposition, and law=n because of its function (ie. of the people).
Any comments?
Read more : One more from Pharr section 223 (line 5) | Views : 3161 | Replies : 2

Pharr section223 line 6

ou) dw/somen ge/raj )Agame/mnoni, ga\r e)/xome/n pou cunh/ia kei/mena .
I am having a bit of a hard time translating this line. Does it mean (very loosly) We will not give a prize to Agamemnon, for we do not have a common one lying around.
As you can tell, the trouble I am having is with the second phrase.
My translation seems a little to absurd to be correct.
Can someone give me some help?
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Pharr section 223 line 2

pa/ntej )Axaioi\ leu/ssousin o(/ti ge/raj )Agame/mnonoj e)/rxetai a)/llh| I think this line means something like; "All Achaeans are looking because the prize of Agamemnon is going elsewhere", or; "All Achaeans see that the prize of Agamemnon is going elsewhere".

First question- Is either one of these translations correct?
Second question- a)/llh| means elsewhere. Is this a dative form of a)/lloj with an implied noun?
I assume it is and this is why I translated -going ...
Read more : Pharr section 223 line 2 | Views : 4419 | Replies : 4

indirect speech in Iliad 1:110-115

I would consider the sentence from line 110 to the first two words of line 113 indirect speech.
How about from there to the end of line 115?
In other words, is Aggamemnon saying; 'I certainly prefer the girl to my wife..... 'or is it; ' You Calchas, said that I certainly prefer the girl to my wife.....'
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"Homer's use of particles..."

My student's Odyssey i-xii by W.B. Stanford has a sketch of the Homeric language. This is his summary after a quick list of the particles, which I thought some others would appreciate:

"Homer's use of particles is copious, fluid and perplexing."
Read more : "Homer's use of particles..." | Views : 3660 | Replies : 2

DOQEIH in Pharr section 216 line 6

doqei/h h( kou/rh patri\ fi/lw| I don't understand the first word in this line. It appears that it might be the 2nd person sg. aorist passive of di/dwmi. I would have expected e)do/qh. The lack of augment doesn't bother me, but what about the extra Epsilon and Iota.
Maybe it is a different verb or form altogether.
It might help if I could find the paradigms of the passive voice of -mi verbs in the ...
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hOI in Iliad 1:104

pi/mplant', o)/sse de/ oi( puri\ lampeto/wnti e)i/kthn. I am a little puzzled about oi(. I can't see it belonging to anything except o)/sse. However o)/sse is dual and oi( is plural.
Can someone help me out of my puzzlement?

Thank you.
Read more : hOI in Iliad 1:104 | Views : 4816 | Replies : 5

adverb vs adjective

I have noticed several times that Greek uses an adjective while it has to be translated as an adverb.
I assumed that the Greek adjective then functions as an adverb. According to the note on line 77 of the Iliad in Pharr, this is not the case.
Line 77 reads as follows: h)= me/n moi pro/frwn e)/pesin kai\ xersi\n a)rh/cein.
The note reads; "observe that the Greek uses the adjective where the English idiom would ...
Read more : adverb vs adjective | Views : 7616 | Replies : 7


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